Kotaku
We've seen a teaser that suggests that Metal Gear Solid 4 will feature significant flashbacks to the story's early days, so it's possible that everyone's favorite tragic soldier-turned-despot will show up alongside the other blasts from the past. But Big Boss is dead for good, right?
Right?
Possible spoilers follow the jump, so if you'd rather not speculate on anything MGS 4-related, steer clear.
Some screenshots obtained by GameGuru appear to hint at the presence, somehow, some way, of the Metal Gear Solid series' patriarch making an appearance in the upcoming MGS 4:
Muses the GameGuru:
There can be a number of ways to look at this, either Big Boss has been genetically modified and recreated once again by Liquid Ocelot in the game and Metal Gear Solid 4 ends quite like the very first original game, a classic battle between the Big Boss and his prodigy and Solid Snake cannot bear this guilt for the nth time and finally kills himself ending his family feud, and hence the saga finishes.
It sounds farfetched, but then again, so does the idea of the President turning out to be a clone, or the late Liquid, evil Big Boss copy, controlling Russian jack-of-all-trades and gunslinger Ocelot through his arm, and those did happen![*]
Solid Snake, aged and ravaged by the FoxDie virus, is not in such good health these days, and Kojima has often suggested that this might be Snake's last sortie. But if the death of the "old killer" is to be the close of an era for the Metal Gear franchise, you can leave it to Kojima to close it out well. And that just might mean giving Snake an opportunity to confront all the ghosts of his past - and what ghost is more significant than that of his dear old "dad"?
(* Oops, correction made. Total misfire indeed. I was so excited I screwed up my enfant terrible super-soldiers.)
Big Boss Returns in MGS4, Mandatory Installation Of Game Necessary? [GameGuru.in]
Comments
A Snake / Big Boss fight at the end would be a nice bookend to the MSX / NES original.
Sweet!
"so does the idea of the late Solidus, evil Snake clone and former U.S. President, controlling Russian jack-of-all-trades and gunslinger Liquid Ocelot through his arm, and that did happen!"
Uh... I think you are confusing your clones.
I should hope so. Does anyone realize that he's quite possibly the most im[portant character in the franchise and yet he's only been in one modern game?
Hell, I'm astounded there haven't been 3d remakes of the first two games before now. They'd sell well, and I'd imagine that you could sell them both together or apart. And you wouldn't haveto budget for a main villain since Big Boss and snake are voiced by the same guy.
Look at what he's wearing. The trench coat and his appearance are exactly how he was back in the olden days of the MG1 official artwork.
This is more than likely a flashback/playable dream sequence.
I saw this picture a while ago, but I'd be pissed if I didn't and read the title for this. I think a less spoilerific title would be nice....
"It sounds farfetched, but then again, so does the idea of the late Solidus, evil Snake clone and former U.S. President, controlling Russian jack-of-all-trades and gunslinger Liquid Ocelot through his arm, and that did happen!"
?
Misfire!
?
I dont think so. I think he'll just be part of the flashback sequence. but i havent played it so i know nothing.....
<_<
>_>
No really, I'm just guessing.
*wink*
I don't think that screenshot's any more or less of a spoiler than, y'know, the headline and text before the jump.
I've predicted ever since the first MGS4 trailer that you are actually playing Big Boss in this game. You will play as the young solid snake later on though.
Evidence:
You use a knife - Solid Snake says in MGS2 he doesn't like blades
Snake smokes cigars (at least in the first trailer he did)
He has an eye patch (ok its the snake eye but still)
He is seen saluting the grave of The Boss when the colonel picks him up. Big Boss and Campbell were also friends.
He is old.
I said it and I stand by it.
@Demonbird: Yeah, that part kinda confused me too. Liquid is controlling Ocelot through his arm, hence his name "Liquid Ocelot".
Maybe he means because Solidus was the one who payed for it to be grafted on by some super expensive French doctor?
Also- Liquid Snake HATED Big Boss. Liquid was mad at Snake for killing Big Boss because he wanted to do it himself. I doubt he'd reanimate Old Jack just to kill him once again.
You know, a word of advice. If you're going to put spoilers in an article, don't put them in the title of the post and THEN warn about them...
It kind of defeats the point, because we know roughly what the "spoiler" after the jump is, in effect.
This is the second time Kotaku has spoiled a part of MGS4 for one of my friends. First with the child rape thing (thankfully that wasn't 100% accurate), and now this. He says, "thanks."
whoa
Liquid Snake is controlling Revolver Ocelot through his arm. Solidus Snake is just plain dead.
Cough* Solidus was Different than Liquid (whose arm is controlling Ocelot... OR IS OCELOT CONTROLLING IT!?!?!?!) Que dramatic music
@YUYU:
It was just flat out wrong. He even got the wrong form of Ocelot in there.
@YUYU: Liquid didn't hate Big Boss. The whole point of Shadow Moses was that he wanted to recreate Outer Heaven, something Big Boss started. Now in 4 Liquid Ocelot had created Outer Haven, which is the same principle.
He also wanted Big Boss' body as part of his demands in MGS1. He wouldn't revive him just so he could kill him himself. Come on.
You've GOT to be kidding me. You've GOT to be kidding me.
No way man. Holy shit.
@PlayingKarrde:
OBJECTION!
Just because he's not a fan of using blades doesn't mean he wont. He just likes guns better.
MGS4 Snake doesn't smoke cigars in any of the trailers.
As you said, it's the solid eye, and it's on the OTHER eye, Snake still has both of his eyes, BB's was 'shot'.
Actually, in MGS saga 2.0 it is confirmed to be the grave of Big Boss himself. I'm guessing it was EVA that put the same thing on his grave as The Boss's.
And then what about Meryl and Otacon and Naomi ect. How and why would Big Boss know them?
Ocelot's old. Campbell's old. EVA's old. There are lots of old MGS characters.
Not to mention that Big Boss was torched by Snake.
@akwinters: I have to agree somewhat.
Leigh, the spoilers are in the header of the article.
If this is true, I would have wanted it to be a surprise.
...
...
...
*Drool* Need...game.
PLEASE KOTAKU, the title is a spoiler enough for me. ='(
@Shiloa: That's true. Now I'm going to be anticipating him...
@PlayingKarrde: No, Liquid flat out told Snake that he HATED Big Boss, and hated Snake for stealing his chance at revenge at the end of MGS1. He wants to build Outer haven to surpass Big Boss and prove he is better than him.
Big Boss treated Liquid like garbage, calling him inferior and such since the day he was born.
Kotaku - please consider renaming this thread as the title itself represents a fairly significant potential spoiler.
......
anyone else see the Assassin's Creed similarity on the bottom screen?
WTF, I'm never going to get this fucking plot straight....
Yeah, if no one's played MGS2, they're going to be seriously spoiled. Also, Solidus doesn't control Ocelot-Liquid does- and he also wasn't really "evil". He's opposed to the Patriots, just like Solid Snake, but he resorted to terrorism to fight them.
@YUYU: Haha there are holes all the way through my evidence yes, but I still feel that there is something like that going on.
As for the cigar thing, do you remember ALLLLL the way back to the first MGS trailer that made fun of the killzone 2 trailer? Snake was smoking a cigar there.
As for the blades thing: he gave Raiden the katana because he doesn't like blades. Why would he suddenly change his mind for the new metal gear? Snake has aged MUCH more than Otacon, Campbell or Meryl. That's the whole point of "Old Snake".
Also, we have seen a young snake getting bird crap on his shoulder in one of the trailers. Care to explain that? :)
As for what you're saying about Outer Haven, yes I think you're right there. What was the reason for him wanting Big Boss' remains though? I forget.
@PlayingKarrde: Dammit I just watched that trailer again and it's a cigarette.
ANYWAY... I'm still holding out that we will be playing two versions of snake (and not just flashbacks). Old and young. Whether thats Big Boss and Solid Snake or what I don't know, but that's what my theory currently stands at :P
This guy on Kombo called it first.
[ps3.kombo.com]
@Zeikcied:
Solidus may be dead, but so is Liquid, and so is Vamp.
Wait wait, I'm confused...I don't remember fighting Big Boss in the original MGS...
Dear Kotaku:
Can we stop posting MGS4 spoilers as headlines? Thanks.
Love,
creid
I really like that Idea of finally ending the blood feud with Big Bosse's return.
"Wait wait, I'm confused...I don't remember fighting Big Boss in the original MGS..."
@Norellicus: The ORIGINAL Metal Gear, not Metal Gear Solid. lol.
^-^ Super Fan Service with that if he returns
@Norellicus:
The original METAL GEAR. No Solid.
You're still doing it wrong Leigh, "But Big Boss is dead for good, right?" is as much a spoiler as the previous title of the article... half the internetz is spoiled now
With MGS, nothing is a spoiler since anything is possible and an image of Big Boss could be part of his visions or part of reality. You never know...
I'm now off to my cryo-chamber. Wake me up on June 12th.
I love the people who come in here to complain about spoilers, yet you clicked on this page in the first place to get in here.
IF YOU DON'T WANT TO BE "SPOILED," DON'T READ THE ARTICLES. It's pretty damn simple. Don't blame others for your lack of self-control.
@PlayingKarrde: Snake gave Raiden the sword because Olga asked Snake to give it to him. He said he's not a huge fan of blades, and I doubt he changed his mind, he's simply using it for better combat.
Yes he is aging rapidly, he has always been aging faster than normal because he is a flawed clone made with old 1970's cloning technology. But his recent really drastic aging is unknown as of now, even to him. Did you see that MGS4 clip of when Snake meets Meryl? She asks what happened to his face and he says he doesn't know why he's aging so quickly.
It's my belief that the young Snake in that trailer was just Kojima using the young Snake model we will be using in the playable dream sequences to fuck with us. Others believe it is an unlockable "young snake mask". And others think it's Snake after finding a cure for his aging, which I highly doubt. We'll have to wait and see.
Liquid wanted BB's remains to cure the genome soldiers who had gene therapy with artificially implant some of BB's "soldier genes" into them, but they got it wrong, and a lot of them started dieing. Liquid needed BB's corpse for his REAL DNA to find a cure for the genome soldiers.
@PlayingKarrde: Uh...the Solid Eye is on Solid Snake's left eye. Big Boss lost his right eye.
It's probably just a flashback to the original Metal Gear.
@Marasai: Oh you mean Metal Gear Solid 1?
And Foxdie doesn't age people, it just kills. He has been aging rapidly due to the fact that he was cloned from a man in his 50's.
@mva5580: The spoilers in the article aren't the problem. It's the fact that twice *before the jump* that the contents of *after the jump* were heavily implied.
"But Big Boss is dead for good, right?
Right?"
Why not just say, "You all thought Big Boss was dead for good, but this new evidence shows that he might actually be in MGS4"? It's effectively the same thing when paired with the title "Secret MGS4 Character Leaked."
You changed the title Leigh but I'm sure people already saw it. Not good.
i dont know how they would bring big boss back but my theory is old snake becomes big boss at the end i know its a huge turn for snake but lets not forget big boss turned after mgs3 and snake is a carbon copy of bb im just saying maybe ocelot tells snake everything and snake has a massive brain fart who knows. i will say this i dont think he dies hell just have a name change like bigger boss or what ever kojima wants.
Thanks for changing the title, but having "Big Boss id dead, right"? remain before the jump doesn't change much
Way to fuck up by putting the spoiler in the title again Kotaku. Jesus.
@KaneRobot: O yeah...I watched the GameTrailers.com MG revisited video and was thinking the same thing :)
I kind of figured Big Boss was going to make an appearence.
Snake in the trailer is visiting a grave, much like how Big Boss visited the grave of Boss at the end of MGS3.
Unless he was visiting Emma, theres nobody else who should be in that grave except Big Boss, who he would really care about. ....okay maybe Gray Fox, but thats it.
So if hes visiting Big Boss, chances are thats what we like to call 'foreshadowing'. Like how 'Master' shouldnt have even been around on the Shadow Moses mission, and that point was ignored until it was smack dab in your face duh its Liquid.
But all in all, a nice end for the MGS saga if this is true. Everything comes full circle.
That image is could just be from a flashback.
BUT, if you look at the earlier promotional media for MGS4, Big Boss figured prominently.
I would be surprised if Big Boss *wasn't* in the game as a living, breathing entity, to be honest.
Whoa, whoa, whoa guys. Let's step back from the (surprisingly very polite) bitching for a moment. Is this really a spoiler? A fuzzy image of a screen pulled from a candid studio shot?
We're all obviously MGS fans, and we know the kind of crazy shit Kojima-san likes to pull. Maybe this shot of BB is from a flashback. Maybe Snake decided to dress up like BB to fuck with Liquid. Maybe it is the actual BB, miraculously resurrected from the dead. Maybe that's the actual identity of Johnny Sasaki under the mask. Hell, maybe it's another goddamn super clone, who'll pull the curtains to reveal that he's part of the super-secret S3 project that was initiated by the Templars in order to combat the Assassins and that the main mastermind working the scenes behind all the MG games is, in actuality, Altair--who is actually a 5,000 year-old super space Saiyan that hails from the alternate universe Earth 616, who has been trying to save the world of MGS from the clutches of Galactus.
Point being: not much of a spoiler. We all knew that BB was going to be in the game one way or another, especially after taking the starring role in the previous two canon MGS games. This is about as much of a spoiler as finding out that Snake is once again going to be voiced by--GASP!--David Hayden.
His appearance matches the retrofit they did on Big Boss for the original Metal Gear right down to the coat.
Everybody that dies only comes back once in the Metal Gear verse if they're really important and BB came back in MG2. Unless that is a complete prosthetic body and somehow they managed to copy the entirety of Big Boss' consciousness ala Ghost in the Shell cyber brains it's safe to assume that it's just an Outer Heaven or Zanzibar land flash back.
The only second logical answer is that it is another clone.
Seriously, he was already thirty during Snake Eater and in his 60s during the Outer Heaven and Zanzibar Land incidents where Solid Snake literally torched him. There was no post game codec revealing BB was alive in MG2 like in MG1.
If Big Boss were somehow alive in 20XX, assuming it's 2014 if MGS2 took place in 2009, he'd be well into his eighties.
As for the grave Snake is visiting, we've got a good portion of game to get through spanning some time over five acts. What's to say it isn't the grave of a character that perhaps dies during the game?
@JustThisGuy: Hayter.
But no- I think this is more than that.
Big Boss looks like Chuck Norris. Is it just me?
@YUYU: HA! You know, I read your response and asked myself, "then who the fuck is David Hayden?"
For shits and giggles, I googled David Hayden and found out that he is apparently some sort of failed Silicon Valley entrepreneur. I suppose it would be quite a spoiler if Hayter was replaced by Hayden.
Seriously, though: why do you believe that his is a spoiler? (Actually curious, not a rhetorical question.) There's no clear context to the screen grab, and I can't think that anyone would be really surprised by BB's appearance in the game. At the very least, I think most of us would expect him to appear in some sort of flashback sequence, considering both his importance to canon and his central role in the last 2 games. I still hold that this is about as spoilerific as, say, watching the old RotJ commercials to find out that Harrison Ford has escaped the carbonite, alive and well.
@Black-Dog-Howls: I'm not sure if logic of any kind applies to the MGS series--unless you're talking about Kojima's strange, twisted form of internal narrative logic. I mean, once Liquid's arm took over Ocelet and made him speak in a British accent, I kinda decided to just give up and enjoy the ride for what it is.
I'm pretty sure that's a flashback so I wouldn't say Big Boss is back... yet.
@ William "Killer" Shatner:
You know, I tried to reply to your comment, but Kotaku just kept on bumping me back up to the header. Technical issues, I suppose.
In any case: MGS's overarching plot is perhaps best described by reading this, and replacing every reference to "Spider Man" with alternating variants of "Snake"--Liquid, Solidus, Solid, Naked. Oh, and every once in a while, pepper the article with a bit about a sentient arm that makes people speak in British accents.
@PlayingKarrde: The eyepatch is exactly why it COULDN'T be Big Boss... The eyepatch lets the eye under the patch see things better with readouts... Both of Old Snake's eyes work just fine. Big Boss's eye is, ya know, gone... So it couldn't be him, for many many other reasons, and Metal Gear Saga 2.0 and many trailers have confirmed this is Solid Snake...
Didn't someone from the MGS4 project say there were going to be some surprise returning characters?
Big Boss back, I wouldn't be surprised. Here's another name no one has mentioned yet but could very possibly return from the "dead".
Fortune
@JustThisGuy:
Well, judging by a lot of peoples initial reaction, not just on this site but others, there are plenty very surprised and very excited about this. I just think that after showing so much of MGS4 over the past...4 years (God has it really been that long?) it's kindof a shame to have an exciting/surprising moment taken away from some peoples playing experience.
And the text before them jump might as well say that Big Boss is likely going to appear in MGS4.
My guess is a flashback or ocelot gets a haircut and an eyepatch.