Shaoko

Zunnoab

Because, then you are killing animals for no reason, which is the antithesis of a video game hero.

Let's not oversimplify the discussion.

berribrand

n8n8baby

I don't see what's so hard to understand.

OMGitsDarkMatter

cmcginn

Well, to be honest, some humans deserve it.

EnigmaNemesis

You can kill a human, but you can't kill an animal.

KM91

dear

Yet another proof that the world is seriously fucked up.

thinred

Killing humans for sport = cool.
Killing animals for sport = evil.

greatslack

TakeoNinja

You can shoot the humans because they are, in fact, shooting back at you.

The only justification I'd see for shooting an animal in a game is if the animals actually came out and attacked you. But I've noticed A LOT of guys like to go around killing animals in games just for "fun".

And yeah... I've never met an animal I'd call and "asshole" but I sure have met a lot of people I would.

goddessakasha

It's so, so ridiculous. And I feel sad that they felt the need to pander to this demographic.

Spoony Bard

jsf49

Juthan

Chewbenator

fadecy

1) The animals were damn fierce: no being defenseless there!
2) People actually hunt bears, etc. How many people hunt dogs and fish... with guns?

Rule of thumb in entertainment: violence is ALWAYS accepted. Screen a movie with decapitation and rape: no problem. Have a steamy sex scene: mothers are in uproar and the world comes to an end.

ChimeraTheory

As artistpavel said, a person has a family, friends - people who would miss them dearly. An animal might have an owner who's very attached to them, but losing a pet is nothing like losing a child or parent. It kind of disgusts me when people put animal life so much higher up on the scale of bad-things-to-harm because they're so jaded into thinking "well, people bring it on themselves, hurrrrrrr."

stupidfanboy

Tei

pandafresh

And I wouldn´t hurt a single animal on GTA IV because I think it´s some kind of power abuse while I think humans deserve to be kicked in their nuts so I understand why they don´t put animals on the games. They´re helpless and there´s no apparent reason to kill them, but humans? It´s fun to kill them! ha ha ha ha!

I seriously didn´t like killing a cow on Resident Evil Four but I loved killing the poor zombies.

I would only kill a dog in GTA or other games if it was an attacking and raging pitbull trying to kill me, otherwise, I wouldn´t.

lucasreis

I TOTALLY know what you mean.

One of my coworkers told me not to see "I Am Legend" when they found out it was in my Netflix queue.

(Spoiler)

She said, "don't see it. Will Smith's dog dies in it. It was the saddest part of the movie."

I saw it anyway and I couldn't believe that she was more upset over than that than the scene where Will Smith's character's wife and child die!!!

scaught78

But then maybe there's one scene where a dog gets killed, or you just see a dead dog, and the entire theater lets out a collective "Awwwwww..."

It boggles the mind.

QualityJeverage

I totally agree. Especially since the violence was bloody. I was confused because Halo 3 got an M and that is just alien violence. I don't think there is even any bad language in it.

Usually I don't pay attention to ratings, but now that I have a 10 month old child these things start to stand out to me.

scaught78

Sollus

Witzbold

enewtabie

phicaluk

But it's the ESRB, one of the most retarded rating systems out there. Lots of killing, M. Consensual hetero-sex between two adults, AO, not seen on shelves.

hahnchen

McKack

unwesen

Though that day is far off.

Gigith

Garonyldas

Shigamado

The death animations etc. for them were pretty crappy though...though letting them run amok in a crowded arena was pretty funny.

Frank

Reality check: Humans are animals too! They all deserve equal death rights!

Frank

See, that's why you can't shoot fish. Not because those PETA devils are puppeteering the ESRB but because of the removal of elephant murder. Now that makes more sense, doesn't it?

cheeses

I also just went on Amazon to look up no less than 15 hunting games in 5 seconds- all have the "T" rating- their point is completely moot.

wirebrain

My friends do know that I like animals...matter of fact a select few would say that I love them. Fine so be it. I appreciate their existence on Earth, and it lets me know that there is so much beyond my own two feet. Tomb Raider (especially the anniversary remake) had you shooting at animals for a majority of the game, and while I always said to myself "Damn...I really wish I didn't have to do that" there was nothing I could do except to move on. It's strange because in Bioshock I had no problem harvesting the little sisters. I didn't want to kill them, but since I understand that it's just a game I choose to so that I would have the upper hand in the next fight. Not to mention that the little sisters never really looked like little girls to me...with their strange colors and bugged out appearance. I see no problem with fighting something other than a person in a game, just as long as it's handled in a respectful way. Hell even making these encounters optional would help alot for people who just don't wanna do it.

Mikey G

k!dman

Is RE4 rated Teen?

LittleBigPlaneteer

Zolbrod

Mike918

IntelSilver

The fact is, they did it because they didn't want an M rating, Not because they think it's wrong to do so.

Do you know what kind of things are OK by ESRB and what are not?

Killing people is ok, teen rating, The second there are drugs involved, the rating shoots up to M. So it's ok to kill but not ok to do drugs by ESRB. It has to do with ESRB. Like the man says, overseas might be worse.

So Naughty Dog wanted to focus on Teen rating, and they had to cut out killing animals, big deal. If there is anything wrong here, it's ESRB allowing Killing on a Teen rated game but not allowing killing animals on a Teen rated game.

ffmusicdj

COD4 really disturbed me every time had to snap the poor doggy's head :(. But regardless I don't feel any remorse (the thing tried to murder me!).

I do believe in your theory because really there is that natural instinctual good guy vs. bad guy fight in many games that makes killing remorseless. However, many games like Bioshock or even in some situations GTA 4, blur this line heavily and thus add an extreme amount of weight.

I almost always chose to let the little sisters live in Bioshock. Also when I had to kill Mr. Faustin in GTA4 (OMG SPOILERS!!!), I stood their with my gun quivering at him hoping that it would prompt me that I could let him live. Although Faustin was Fed up, he probably made the most sense and was the most scrupulous of the characters in this game (at least that I have met so far) and the line "This American Dream is a Disease" really left me thinking (especially considering I just wrote a 15 page paper on the American dream in English a month ago).

Animals have this natural "good guy" innocence and that their desire to kill is either instinctual or that of unfair treatment making killing them far worse morally. For human's however, we assume naturally assume that these nameless henchmen are their purely of their volition and desire nothing but dastardly deeds unless otherwise developed in the plot.

Its not that we view animals as above" humans in this sense, but that we have a highly romanticized view of the life of an animal and its innocence compared to the innate perceived evil of humans.

Weasel3689

Poison

Look at Michael Vick, for example. He is a person. But he hurt some animals. So now he's in prison. He's losing years and years of his life.

He is a person. He is being harmed, even though he never hurt anyone else.

Because dogs are cute.

Personally, if I had the opportunity to save him -- to give him back all these years of his life -- and all I had to do was hurt some dogs, I would do it. Because he's a person and I value people a lot more than dogs.

Kohath

JustinS

Oh and I don't kno why you guys have a problem with killing virtual animals. Repeat after me

They are pixels. They are not made of flesh bone or matter. They are pixels.

Although anything that pisses off PETA is ok in my book now if only GTA would let us kill dogs.

Father-Time

Father-Time

Father-Time

@Spartan1308: Yes, they did. That was part of the focus of the controversy.

Palladium

Siskoraban

Are there any T rated games where you can kill both humans and animals(animals that dont attack you first)?

JustinS

And corgis.

Mr. Mastodon Farm

Luke Plunkett

Spartan1308

TouchMyBox

Most people (other than psycopaths) can clearly dissociate killing in-game humans from killing real-world humans but perhaps that line isn't as clear when it comes to animals. That might be why some commenters feel guiltier about killing animals in a game than they would about killing humans.

Not sure I buy my own argument here but still an interesting tidbit from the interview and unique insight into our cultural norms.

rawg

I'll admit, I didn't see 'Legend' because, kill all of humanity, no prob, I just didn't want to see the dog die.

Killing NPCs in games don't really evoke an emotional response. When you first meet an adult person IRL, you maybe shake hands and try to remember his/her name. Meet a puppy or kitty or other animal, and you immediately pour on the affection, like cooing over a baby. It's socially acceptable and encouraged to want to 'save' and pamper things that look young and cute- heck, look at anime characters with eyes inversely proportional to age.

NPC fodder in games don't usually have backstories, mothers or families, and they don't trigger our 'protect' instincts. They aren't really 'human'. They just look like targets with squishy insides for our purposes.

Marion517

Albanian_Killa

xbandaidx

biznatch

artistpavel

MGS3 has you murdering a whole range of animals, then consuming them.

Though they all kind of turn into an item box...

Crysis has you killing crabs and chickens and birds IIRC too.

Don't know why Uncharted didn't do it, but I guess it wasn't important anyway.

BlackDove

The justification of "I don't kill hookers in real life just because I do in Grand Theft Auto" doesn't mean that we'll ever be able to shoot 5-year-olds in the head in a GTA game.

V1L3

Drake Lake

Yes! The bastard one that sat on the log. Tried so many times to kill it! Grrrr. stupid bird!

ChiZ_MacT

dry-roasted-peanuts

I too am kind of with that thinking. Duno why, but I feel guilty with fake animals, and don't with fake humans. Maybe I've been conditioned, or maybe I only 'kill' those who are portrayed as the bad guys lol.

KrsJin

futurebiblehero

technical_ta

silenthill4vid

Heyyou27

Heyyou27

I_fit_in

Yes, juvenile delinquents harass escaped tigers all the time?

I_fit_in

Jazhuis

For once, thanks ESRB !

Ycare

jsf49

What if it raised controversy and stopped the game from selling well? That is a chance I wouldn't want to take if I were making the game.

LittleBigPlaneteer

Roto13

I think this all has to do with a percieved level of innocence. An old bag in GTA you can surmise has done bad things in her life, a pigeon has pooped on someone, some dog or cat is probably totally innocent and they don't want little weirdos spending their time torturing virtual animals. Though better than real ones I guess.

Garrison Dean, King Awesome

Xiedo

j.howlett

Klaymen

Kaizuden

Netnavi

Spartan1308

Banedon38

Double J

And then I couldn't kill the birds, no matter how many times I shot them. It makes me kind of sad.

@karasu is my homeboy: The animals have to be understood to be evil. They do it in NWN, too, but, as stated, EVIL BADGER!

Palladium

Drake Lake

e30b27

DigiMish

Tomb Raider has you fighting against bears, bats and wolves.

It wasn't M.

This seems like a lie.

karasu is my homeboy

Nirolak