freespeech

The problem is that the Wii Mote is integrated into the Wii, into its design philosophy, and into the development software. On the PS3 or the 360 it would become much more of an optional addon, an interesting gadget or curios that a few games might use. I really like the idea of the Playstation Eye, but I've only heard of one good game that uses it. A 360-AXIS would be lucky to enjoy this degree of success.

Darien_Shields

Destroyman

DugDawg

HeavenlyYeti

morienus

Eon.

@Kempatsu: Understatement of the day.

cheeses

If the 360 can do everything a Wii can, as well as HD graphics, a great online system, and all the other multi media system, then why would you buy a Wii?

Obviously Microsoft would need to up their game with advertising (as Nintendo can stamp their name on a fresh turd, and people will queue to buy it), and make some good games for the controller. But its possible.

I do wonder if Sony have something similar in the pipeline.

Mr_Ed

It's only logical that gaming companies try to emulate success, the Wii has been insanely successful so this will happen. Get over it. This is the worst part of the supposed "gamer" culture, when people whine over one company "copying" another.

L

ChaoticLimbs

ChaoticLimbs

At least MS didn't junk their entire controller strategy like Sony did with the SIXAXIS only to alienate their fanbase by removing rumble.

StrikerGold

phinehas

its a novelty gimmick waggle. won't last for 2yrs....uh-nuh!

prepare for shovelware! buuuurn! Buuuuuuuuuuurn!

*attempts to inflict psychic trauma into the hardware*

360elbows
smashedHI-DEF TV!
brokenheads
LAW-SUIT!
patent-violations
underaged-gamer PR image
recycled IP mascots
rehashed franchisee
...erm....
yeeeah.
i'm done.

*look around awkwardly*
<_< ;

Onizuka-GTO

Anyways, It's weird how people who critised motion-controls when the Wii came out are most likely the ones saying "Oh, that is so freakin' sweet!" If you didn't support the idea in the first place, don't even try. Otherwise, I'm interested to see what occurs, but I hope they don't become too dependent, because then I won't have any FPS' to sooth my hand after a Metriod fest.

Jac21

SmokeyTab

Motion controls = Not a new idea.

I'm not trying to defend M$, just setting the facts straight.

SmokeyTab

That's one of the best written stories I've read on Kotaku and a fine bit of reporting too. I'll keep an eye out for your work going forward.

As for the story, I really feel its all just distracting rumor. Like they said, its BANJO 3 that I'm looking forward to details about (MAY 13TH!!!!!) and whatever other game that Rare has coming this year.

DARTH_TIGRIS

WoWpallyGamer

So I hope they don't, is all.

karasu is my homeboy

karmakid

humongous_mouse

defferoo

Arcade machines had rumble and force feedback a over a decade before the Rumble Pak was released for the N64.

I remember Hard Drivin' had it, and this lame submarine game who's periscope would rattle everytime you got hit, bumping painfully against your face.

Koztah

3rd for me

juscallmeweasel

LOL I was thinking the same thing but wasn't sure till I checked it up on wiki.

NeVeRMoRe666

and I love how the japanese hate MS

one thing though, though sony has ripped off nintendo numerous times, its been mostly small things, and not always to the full extent (ex; motion control) because of this, they are still original, and I respect them to a point

Now, I can't help but always be a nintendo fan, and root for them with every new system. but this newest, blantant rip off on them is starting to piss me off.

The only reason I bought my xbox in the first place was for KOTOR (which I've played several times over) I have still yet to buy a 360, but my wii is doing just fine.

Eventually, I will get a PS3, just because I absolutly love MGS.

well, in the end, I hope this douchebaggery blows up in Microsofts face.

chaos_isnt_here

My360broked

Callidux

SwKninja

I'm not saying Mario, Zelda, etc. don't move that console, but just take away the controller.... M.S. has the rest going for it. And if a little wiggle, and waggle can do it for Wii.... Then as long as the controls don't suck ya got another reason to buy a 360.

Just saying.

Y0URGOD78

juliopalio

I think they use accelerometers (though a few we have at work do emit a mysterious tone...) I have a dead one behind me so I'll crack it open and check - It's a Gyration GC15M and... my god. It's the same MG1101A as this thing: [www.embedded.com] Thanks for asking. Now I know these things use a crappy ultrafragile stone-age cousin of a modern accelerometer.

The Wiimote uses an ADXL330 on-chip 3-axis accelerometer so I have no idea what Nintendo and Gyration could have worked on, other than maybe prototypes, and the concept of an air mouse (though Gyration's patent for that seems too specific to apply to the Wii...)

The more I learn about the (percieved?) relation, the more confusing it gets...

fuchikoma

It's going to have to improve reliability of their console, reduce the number of SKU's, and drop the price while packing in a game amongst other things.

Now, I don't own a 360 and I do own a Wii. But that's not to say I'm not envious of many of the 360s features. (Awesome exclusives, great online, HD). That being said I don't own one because of 1. Price, 2. Reliability and 3. Simplicity

If the 360 (or next generation of MS console) can nail these three things, especially the simplicity of the Wii, then they can capture a lot of the "Nintendo Audience" but if they can't... well I think they're better off sticking to their current game plan.

nastysquared

By the way, random all-caps words= Failure.

TOWER_JUNKIE

gpturismo

valhum

I'm thinking that at least by next gen, we'll be using flick-of-the-wrist remotes to navigate through menus and media collections, and it'll be functional for games that choose to use it. Microsoft will never be able to take the Wii's place, whether they want to or not... and I, for one, think thats a good thing

tehGloom

celica01

Herbal23

Reminder....the rumblepack came out before the dual shock.

keiichimorisato

Kempatsu

Clstirens

If this goes over well and they come out with fun and compelling software for the peripherials, then I will GLADLY join them. I have fun with the wii controls. But I don't feel that grafted on motion sensitivity is a money maker in this case.

Clstirens

A far more succinct appraisal of the situation.

houser

Every single time the innovations have been copied so why not the Wii-mote. It's gotten to the point where it's just matter of course.

And that Rare is involved makes sense. Some of their games for Nintendo were just Nintendo clones - Diddy Kong Racing : Mario Kart, Banjo/Donky Kong 64 : Mario 64.

That all being said, I like the 360 better than the Wii but I still can't believe how fun the Wiimote is when incorporated correctly so I think this is great news for everyone.

BCazh

@fuchikoma:
I thought gyration mice are gyroscope based, whereas the wiimotes are accelerometer based (much less fragile).

kftgr

GOLD5

As they only have two consoles, on what exactly do you base the assertion that Microsoft rarely make the same mistake twice?

They certainly couldn't make reliability any worse. I suppose they made their monster box a bit slimmer this time around.

@ Endersgame

The problem with the copying at least from the Sony angle is how very often they pooh pooh or minimize what Nintendo is doing and then blatantly copy it. Microsoft claimed not to be in competition with the Wii. Then said ti was a gimmick or toy. Now the core differentiating facet of the Wii is being copied.

Sure it's the job of the PR guys to sell us on that bullshit, but I for one am tired of it.

houser

megaStryke

It's been proven. The core demograph can't sustain the industry. The audience is actually shrinking. If a change wasn't made another crash was almost certain. We've already talked about attach rates but as far as userbase, MS would have to be complete fools to ignore the Wii userbase. It IS bigger than 360's.

Have we entered an era where pathetic business acumen is the new requirement for corporate positions? Of Course MS chould rip off the Wiimote. Why the fuck not? Bite it and look at the same customers that Nintendo is going after.

As a matter of fact, pack the sucker into the arcade unit and still sell it for 300 or 350. For 50 to 100 bucks more than a Wii you get waggle and a superior console. (provided it doesn't RR)

Total

No

Brainer

Striderhayasa - Phillyyakk on PSN and Live.

TRT-X

Notice the color scheme of the controller pictured in the article. Coincidence? We shall see.

Mod

Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised if "Xbox 720" shocks the world by coming in at $299 or some craziness like that. MS will use the Wii model. Some minor performance tweaks to the 360 (like adding 1080p standard support) and release a cheapish system with Blu-ray, waggle, and Xbox Live.

Xbox 360 is merely the setup to the knockout-blow that's going to be delivered in 2010. That's been the MS plan all along.

GettinMyGooseOn

bobtheduck

crescentfresh

Fetus_God_of_Love

I have great hopes for the next version of the Xbox, if the jump to the 360 is any indicator, There are some smart decisions being made at MS.

None of these hopes - NONE - have anything at all to do with "waggle", which is a novelty in the purest sense. Similarly, there is no way in hell Blu-Ray will make it to a MS console. Frankly, if 3 years go by and we don't have a cheaper, more powerful media alternative suited to games, I'll be disappointed.

Basically, I think taking the "best of" Nintendo's and Sony's current consoles would add up to far less than the potential of a real 5th (6th? 7th?) gen system.

captaindirtnap

and the part about wii owners buying mulit-platform games... well, look at how well GH3 did on the Wii. it outsold the 360 and PS3 versions.

E3. they will announce it at E3. i'm betting on it. of course these rumors pop up NOW, 2 months before E3... that's because it's more than likely in development right this moment.

then again, the DS rumors have been popping up since December of last year, and those all seem like they're going nowhere.

this actually has merit to it. i honestly think Microsoft is going to try to dethrone Nintendo's glory days. (I say try, because really, it'll fail. Casual games have a better chance of waggle "working" then other games. M$ has little casual games on the 360, yes? my point exactly. logically, it can't "work" on the 360, but it can(and has) on the Wii, because you don't have an alternative style of control. yes, there's the nunchuk, but you're still using motion controls, right?)

look, it comes down to this. whether or not Microsoft is making a "wiimote-like" controller is not the point. the point is, will you actually buy it? will you actually use it, once you buy it? and not once, i mean for every game? because if they are indeed making a motion controller... it's only a matter of time before every game uses it.

Wii60 now has a new definition.

frank0127

Mr.SithNinja

Sinnix

Playstation3

Plus the vision of Microsoft in a one console future is pretty scary.

Also BANJO sounds AWESOME!

creepwood

LongDarkBlues

the reason for this...every wii comes standard with the wiimote. thats 23 million wiimotes with every console. these wiimote ripoffs would be coming way too late in the console lifecycle to have any negative impact on the wii.

the only thing that would happen would be the wii getting some good looking games for a change.

sitsalot

Here's to hoping Micosoft will create a whole new peripheral instead of cramming this new tech in a Xbox 360 controller

[www.product-reviews.net]

bird1988

I can't see this device gaining enough of a foothold during this generation to warrant widespread adoption by the consumer and implementation by game developers. They should hold off until the 720 (or whatever it will be called) and put it into the next generations controller and include it with the console.

kagai

I do wanna say, if Microsoft thinks they can try to get NINTENDO'S MARKET I say go for it. They got tons of millions to spend and they just don't wanna end up in THIRD PLACE AGAIN. If they knew how to do it, they would release their sidewinder again, like a lot of people say they came up with motion controllers, but are they doing it? NO. they just want a WIIMOTE.

VakeroRokero

I'll look forward to that.

dance_to_the_radio

If you work for or with most technology related technology...especially when SDKs are involved you must sign NDAs so can never they cannot confirm or deny these rumours. Just because they cant clarify, it doesn't make it true...they might not be able to clarify from an unrelated NDA.

But from the points that you have made, they could just as easily suggest a 3rd Party Accessory, rather than just 360. PS3,Xbox360,PC all have USB slots (bluetooth maybe?)...PS3 sixaxis "struggled" and they dont want to "knock down the Wii".

In terms of your Rare arguement...I can only speculate that if Microsoft planned motion sensing, it would been more effective on Viva Pinata: Party Animals.

Especially as far as Mahajan is concerned, I'm sure a rumour of a Microsoft partnership would do the company far more good than revealing (for example) their publisher relationship is with Disney Interactive PC games. At least until E3 comes around.

I'ma have to chalk this Wii360 rumour to "not true" and patiently await the subsiquent rumour smash post.

P.S. so it's unlikely the rumors about the "Newton" will die down anytime soon...I see what you did there.

UntouchableP

Meuacan

In what way has Microsoft has part in the success of Nintendo? LOL, MS, you gotta be kidding!

Not to mention how everyone seems to OVERLOOK Microsoft being a lameass and ripping off Nintendo by copying the controller all while saying they are doing great. Microsoft, the profit ship has left a couple days ago, and you got Sony to make you company.

VakeroRokero

ohhello

However, I think the Wii has been the saving grace of the gaming world. With all the bad press games get, the Wii has been generally accepted as a family-friendly form of entertainment.

psychobaka

Except the gaming part...

Tarmac

Krumm

Zegridathes

They're great at what they do. But the wii is there for casual gaming - not hardcore gaming. The wii-Mote is incredibly intuitive, and thus having to learn where x O square and triangle buttons are completely unnecessary.

It seems that they should just stick to doing what they do best. Great hardcore games, and keep trying to improve their XNA stuff.

Biscuitcleaver

teh_joe

Leobebes

boopadoo

Wii60 indeed! We use Gyration mice at work - and we're trying desparately to disengage from that ASAP. They cost a ton, break constantly, and are always in short, restricted supply so if we need, say, 400, we could order a half dozen. I don't know how the motion sensors in the Wiimotes are so tough, but if you drop a Gyration mouse a foot or two onto the ground, the mouse cursor will shoot off the screen any time motion sensing is engaged and that's it. It's done.

fuchikoma

I won't give Microsoft a cent for this new controller. In fact, I won't be giving Microsoft money for anything until they transfer the licenses from my downloads to my new 360's serial number. Instead of trying to add new shit like this, how about they get back to fixing the things that are still fucked up?

Heyyou27

DiscipleofJamzy

Umm, Nintendo released the Rumble Pack first; Sony was the one who "followed up" with their Dual-Shock.

duderdude2

akashhhhh

"I think that all the auto makers who ripped off Amedee Bollee Sr's steering wheel were just biters and cars haven't been the same since."

Kotaku - The Happy Clique for Hypocrites!

FanDam

I still think motion control is highly overrated unless it's meant to simulate something that you're really doing (a la Wii Sports).

FanDam

Fallible

Poison

I love my gamepad. I love my Wiimote (when it makes sense to use it). There's no reason the two can't co-exist on the same system in a non-lame fashion (looking at you, Classic Controller!).

Microsoft has been completely tight-lipped about the Spring dashboard update, so I'm expecting big things!

Erwos

Who cares? Did Nintendo rip off Sony going to a disc based system? Did they rip off Atari building a cartrige based system in the first place?

Anyway you slice it, Nintendo didn't invent motion control. They were just the first to use it in a console. Big deal.

Sounds like, when I read the linked article, that publishers, (like EA) when they make a waggly game (like Harry Potter) would prefer a unified waggle across all platforms so they can sell more games.

Look at the three last-gen controllers. They were all virtually identical. Developers like that.

Waggle works great for some games, not so well for others. For those games that it works well on, don't you think those publishers would like to sell them to more than Wii owners (who by and large don't buy 3rd party games anyway?)

Ess

We'll be best friends,
You can even call it the revolution.
Or hell, call it the Wii.

Shocky

Thyrfing

pandafresh

gibfather

See this link for a very lucid discussion on this basic topic:

[dubiousquality.blogspot.com]

GettinMyGooseOn

Kotaku - The Happy Clique for Hypocrites!

That's fine, but people losing their minds with the Vader-esque "Nooooooooooooo". I don't care who copied who, but people upset over Microsoft copying what appears to be a successful accesory...how is this a bad thing?

EndersGame

See? Karasu NAILED it. They should be sticking to their guns with what they're known for, not going after a market that's already (somewhat) dominated. But that's me and I'm an idiot. What do I know?

Meuacan

The PS3's motion controls seem tacked on, and since I don't follow the console I rarely hear any games that make a major use of them (except for Lair...oh Lair....). But judging by the return to the DualShock I'm guessing it didn't go well.

For the 360? It's dangerous territory. If they introduce motion controls, it's going to have to be a seperate peripheral/controller aside from current controllers.

So if the undertaking fails, the peripheral becomes useless for all but a select few games.

TRT-X

valhum

valhum

"Were people this panicky and short-sighted when Sony rolled out the Dual Shock and Nintendo followed up with their rumble paks?"

I'd imagine not.

But mainly because the Rumble Pak was released in 1997 and the Dual Shock was released in 1999.

See, that was Sony ripping off Nintendo. They tend to do that a lot. Mostly out of spite.

PerswAsian

EndersGame

I actually think a wiimote for 360 would flop. It's too late. Wii already owns casual gamer's minds, and gamers who would want a Wii aren't going to plop out the extra cash for the 360 + the Wiimote clone + games.

And then there's the problem of supporting this thing with games. The Vision camera is a cool peripheral with no support right now.

P.S. Sony stuck the motion sensors into the controller like 2 weeks before E3 after they found out about Nintendo, according to some Sony developers. So, they're pretty much a rip off as well.

karasu is my homeboy

@Torgen got his apology faceplate but not his fixed GH3 disc: "Rumble Pak was out in Japan in April 1997, before the Dualshock. "

Cool. So did people freak out when Sony rolled out their DS?

EndersGame

JoseJX

Hilarious, are you comparing yourself or 'hardcore' gamers to 12 yr olds?

Can't believe people still buy into your lame theory.

Markez

TheOtis

SwindleUK

Knate

Torgen got his apology faceplate but not his fixed GH3 disc

But Jesus freaking tapdancing Christ, that's a blatant ripoff.

Hell, look at Sony. They made the SIXAXIS, so they didn't have to carbon copy anyone (at least, not that I know of...someone correct me if I'm wrong, please).

All I ask of MS is that they develop something creative without having to resort to--

Oh, whatever. Damn. I'm just talking stupid. They're gonna go with it and people are gonna buy it. Bastages.

Meuacan

"Newton" is a great name for something like this -- for its implications re: the origin of the studies of calculus and physics, and for the fact that it was an apple that hit Newton on the head.

Microsoft, taking a cue from Nintendo, who was taking a cue from Apple.

And Darwin, father of the theory of evolution -- evolution, which rhymes with "revolution", the code name for the Wii.

Somewhere far away, some executive's wife's gold-plated chihuahua puppy silently begins to implode . . . . . .

. . . . . . for great justice!

108

It seems like the company with the most to gain here is Motus. Had anyone heard of them before? I don't pretend to be particularly well versed in hardware manufacturers, but they were new to me. By riding the wave of this rumor, they get to increase their profile and play coy about the whole topic. Whether or not they are actually developing something, they benefit.

As for the whole idea of a motion controller for the 360, I just hope it doesn't happen. Maybe I'm narrow-minded, but I like lots of buttons and thumbsticks. It makes it possible to do more in a game. Sure, it would be fun to be able to swing the lightsaber in Force Unleashed (and the model controller in the picture screams "LIGHTSABER"), but not at the expense of complexity.

Maybe I'm in the minority here (actually, I'm pretty sure I am), but I don't care about a wii60 mote. I shudder to think that playing Mass Effect or CoD4 with one of those would be like. It might work just fine, but that has never been my experience the few times I've been able to play the Wii. The reason I read these articles is to find out just how much my fear of controller changes is justified.

Seanchaen

TheTog

lmao. Yeah, why Microsoft feels their only competition is the PS3, I never really understood.

Part of me wants this to be false because motion sensing is dumb and I don't want Microsoft to be a copycat.

But it really is about time they launch an attack on Wii.

karasu is my homeboy

Microsoft, taking a cue from Nintendo, who was taking a cue from Apple.

Somewhere far away, some executive's wife's gold-plated chihuahua puppy silently begins to implode . . . . . .

. . . . . . for great justice!

108

When they and Nintendo both have the "Wii-Motes" then the one thing Microsoft has going for it is the graphic power of the 360 when compared to the Wii.

Sometimes prettier graphics win out. People are STILL partial to "pretty".

EndersGame

This story was also hard to follow because it meandered into so many different areas.

DaPress

I'm kidding, frankly I think the idea won't pick up quite as nicely as MS expects it too. Why? Well the casuals who bought the Wii already have their Wii Sports and soon their Wii Fit so why would they give a crap about a more expensive rip off?

Just my two pennies.

Eothein

jayntampa

Were people this panicky and short-sighted when Sony rolled out the Dual Shock and Nintendo followed up with their rumble paks?

EndersGame

But on a related note, why can't motion sensing just stay with the one brand that has it?

I think it is effective in a Wii-type environment, but everything else feels forced(Heck, even some Nintendo games feel forced_

JoeyTheHobo

nintend0nick

The best part of this article? The Banjo 3 details. Bring it on!

So basically, we still have no idea if a wii-like controller is on the way for 360. I'm sure they're discussing it behind the scenes, but so much stuff happens behind the scenes that never amount to anything. It's just research and trying things out.

By the way, does anyone know if that Majahan guy is correct? People tend to buy multiplatform games on the Wii? I thought (a)Wii gamers don't buy many games and (b)Multiplat games are always extremely inferrior on Wii, so they'd sell better on 360/Ps3/PS2. Anyone know the actual way it goes?

karasu is my homeboy

Han Daimond

mitsoxfan

Carnok

chacho

Anyone else with me on this one? We've bought so many controllers and peripherals this gen that not making off of hardware seems a moot point. They make it all back and lots more making us buy the same controllers multiple times for negligible upgrades.

RPGr

MS is being ridiculous. It's like they're blatantly ignoring the fact that, oh, I don't know...the Wii exists?

Meuacan