<![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre - Kotaku Comments]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre - Kotaku Comments]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Look, developers are getting closer to getting the controls right on consoles. Look at the fine tuning between LOTR:BFME and C&C. And with Halo Wars and SupCom coming soon, we'll see soon enough if this will be viable or not.

Consider this: when you first played a FPS with a controller you probably sucked - I know I did. After years of fine tuning things were worked out and people got used to it.

I agree there may be some things you lose out on (unit caps or whatever) but that doesn't make it necessarily a shell of itself on the PC. Things will get better. Just wait.

BTW - my two cents to developers: allow some controller customization so certain buttons can be swapped with others (or at least 3-6 control schemes). This should be for all FPS too imo.

dudeman5000

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> We need more Pikmin.

Nickname

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I dont like it when they try to use the word "fun" as a work around for dumbing down shit. Dumb players, lets call them mass market, dont like hard games. So, to make RTS fun for them you have to dumb it down, or they wont play them.... Sad, but true.

JojoTheSlayer

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @TurtleSoup:

Agreed.

You can hook a console up to a monitor already, so if they just add keyboard and mouse support, then consoles will be able to totally replace gaming PCs.

Marlor

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Just give us a frigging keyboard and mouse for the 360 and get it over with - really what is the big deal? It's so retarded.

Then go let us stream play games from our 360's/PS3 to our PC's and vice versa and then who cares anymore?

TurtleSoup

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Darth Navster: your comment about "most" 360 owners playing with SD sets piqued my curiosity and I Googled to get the real numbers. Apparently 66% of 360s are played on an HD set: [www.engadgethd.com]

I find those numbers pretty interesting...the Wii rate of 65%, in particular, is just shocking. Only 1% behind the 360?? The console doesn't even take advantage of HD, the demographic is supposedly chock full of non-gamers, and still they have two-thirds uptake on HDTV adoption.

I still think Nintendo made the right choice sticking with SD resolutions, even if only to keep the cost of hardware and game development down. But yeah, RTSs really do hurt for higher resolutions.

James MacAulay

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Simpsons Rule: He could've just as well said "board games".
"A poor attempt to defend a poor attempt at describing RTS."


mizeriq

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Sure, but I'll never play them.

TemplaerDude

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Eric: Chess is a game, not a genre. A poor attempt at an analogy, in my opinion.

Simpsons Rule

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I have nothing against any type of game on a console, as long as they provide the proper interface to it.

FPSs and RTSs shouldn't be PC exclusive, and neither should be Keyboards and Mice.

Yeah, kinda awkward having a keyboard and mouse for your PS3 or XBox 360... but why not?

Bokusatsu_Tenshi

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @MP-Geist: Yes!

Ishmae1

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> You know theres two key factions of RTS fans ( many more actually but two key ones )

the ones that enjoy huge ass armies raging about and destroying each other... ( the more common one ) and the micro intensive where armies are of any size but the point is to maximize your winning chances by playing and moving units differently and in some cases individually.

Consoles cannot do any of the above easily, at least not without a complicated grouping system that probably cannot match a keyboard/mouse. The pull of RTS' for those that just play it casually is just watching armies destroy each other and maybe some resource management. But for any really good fan of an RTS they will be distraught about the fact that it will feel so shallow much like the today's current FPS' eh?

What will happen, soon I believe is minimalist RTS' which is basically small number of groups and small amounts of micro in order to win. It'd be a quick and dirty RTS that's much akin to small skirmishes of StarCraft... I'm sure once that takes off it'll be hugely popular and THAT can be worked with on a console.

pyropetey

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I completely AGREE.

see Pikmin.

Mii

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Sounds like many of you are missing the point of his comments. Putting a RTS on a console forces developers to rethink how they're making them, stripping away the redundancy and getting back to what makes them fun.

It really has nothing to do with the controller, micro-managing came about because of the mouse and keyboard, not the other way around.

MP-Geist

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> RTS on console is stinky. I have yet to play one that feels really intuitive. I fly around in RTS at hyper speed and I usually average over 12000 key presses. A gamepad won't cut it for this.

If an RTS was made specifically for the console it might be okay, but that is where the problem lies. Most console RTS games are just ports of PC titles. It is designed for the massive management capabilities of the PC and not for the smaller interface design of the console. Hopefully Halo Wars can change this, because Ensemble is one of my favorite RTS devs. I love me some Age of Empires III.

MrSatan

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @xpnet:

It still is a fun game. Herzog Zwei is still one of the most fun games ever. It's a shame that later RTSs took the "action" out of the genre.

Being able to change into a robot and shoot the crap out of your enemy's tank, that was awesome.

Herzog Zwei is the very reason I don't bother with RTS games (though Dune seemed pretty nice). They're not interactive enough. You can't dig in and get your hands dirty.

I loved in HZ that you could attack your enemy's units with your plane/robot, but not his base. This kept it strategic, rather than "who can get the closest and personally shoot the base faster".

It's nice to see RTS come back home. Now if only they'd do a remake of HZ with updated graphics but the same hands-on action element.

Billkwando

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> developing a console-oriented RTS isn't the same as STOPPING development of a PC RTS. They're really different games for somewhat different market segments.

I actually agree with this guy -- the genre is becoming unnecessarily over-complicated. Certainly there are GREAT PC RTSs in its current form, like Company of Heroes, but these games will not work as well on consoles.

People shouldn't try porting games from PC to console, though; new games must be developed from the outset with consoles in mind (like Halo Wars). These games should not require a keyboard/mouse to control effectively.

FraGNeM

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> UaW is... slow, buggy, the usual army size is lower than even in WC3(!) and the game is not micro oriented like WC3, because the units are unresponsive(the walkers can even get stuck when nothing obstructs their path), the UI is horrible for a PC game, when the game launched there wasn't even a working multiplayer chat lobby(!!) and most of the online functions that required a $50 subscription weren't working, too. Not to mention they have always been free for PC gamers.

I don't know about any other PC RTS ever released having such ridiculous shortcomings, so how this supposed developer can say anything about the genre?

If anything, the sequel to the most selling RTS game ever being PC only says much more then any so called developer can grasp.

mizeriq

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @xpnet: Yes! Herzog Zwei is easily my favorite console RTS. I still have my Genesis plugged in to just to play the game now and then.

As far as the direction that we (Petroglyph) have gone with Universe at War on the 360, here are a couple gameplay vids:

[www.gametrailers.com]
[www.gametrailers.com]

IGN also had a (mostly correct) overview of the control scheme in their recent preview:
[xbox360.ign.com]

So far, in interop testing, 360 players are handling themselves quite well versus PC players, with neither side being handicapped. With that said, we've had a lot of time to refine and improve things since the original PC launch, so I'm looking forward to the reaction once it hits shelves.

driph

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> there are certian genres that work best on consoles, and certain genres that work best on the PC.

the consoles have Platforming and Racing
PCs have RTSs, Puzzle games, and point and click adventure
RPGS and FPSes are somewhere in limbo between the two.

Power_Wrist

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I'll echo a previous poster's call for Patapon. See also, Pixeljunk Monsters, a console take on a subgenre spawned by RTS's.

People are still hung up on trying to replicate Ctrl 1-9, scrolling, unit selection, and such on a controller, and games like PJM and perhaps the new console-oriented Civilization show that you can tweak the formula and still have a good game. In general, IMO, console games aren't meant to be micromanaged to the depth that's possible on a PC; not only is it really hard to micro 4 marines versus 2 lurkers on a controller, I'm guessing most players wouldn't really *want* to.

Portal showed us that you can have a perfectly enjoyable FPS while stripping down a lot of "traditional" aspects of shooters - enemies, weapon selection, game length, etc. Patapon manages to be an awesome experience which is also strategic despite not directly controlling your units' every move. There will always be a market for hardcore, highly competitive (and probably Korean-phillic) RTS's, but I agree that the genre needs to dig itself out of its very narrow niche.

Datheron

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @char: @

Actually he is stating an opinion, which can actually be wrong... an ill leave it at that.

ritful

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> If UAW wasn't as awful as it is, I might actually pay attention to what this guy had to say. I hope Petroglyph finds being bested (C&C3 vs UAW, not that I have any real love for either) by the company that killed their original incarnation (Westwood) suitably humiliating.

FellTheDabus

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Thank God somebody mentioned that Herzog Zwei invented the RTS......on the console.

Billkwando

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> [gsi.gomtv.com]

GG. I win the comments. Itll never be like this on consoles. Just not feasible. Finals tonight/morning btw 4AM EST.

Sentouki

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Eric: Wow, Yahtzee better watch out.
Chess isn't a genre, it's a game.


Anthropomancer

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> developers are getting lazy. :\

dumb down those games for them xbots!

zombieistired

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> u simply cant play rts on console, u lose all the speed, pace and intensity, everything is like slowed down, noob garbage......

Vaanelo

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Kaos_:
Yes but you are still compromising. In an depth strategy game I don't want the controls to be "just good enough" and they will never match a KB/M. Not that the consoles couldn't have them. But then I get a feeling that console players will be whining that they need to buy a KB/M just to be competitive.

Consoles are powerful but the ports are still watered down versions because PCs are just too far ahead once again.

FtGF

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I think the Kohan series would work well on Consoles. You had a low number of units to control in that, and no peons. If the unit AI wasn't too intensive, and they made the gameplay like the original and not the crappy sequel, then it would work well.

I think Timegate's not in the PC game market anymore anyways.

arstal

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @gaijira: Heh, don't forget us Mac users either, unless you were just grouping us in with PCs in general ;)

SC is one of the few big game titles that sells to most Mac users, instead of just those of us who happen to be gamers and mac users.

DaiMacculate

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I'm glad to see more RTS games coming out on consoles...well as long as they have mouse n keyboard support (I'm looking at you PS3).

It keeps me from having to update my computer every few years to play the latest and greatest RTS. Sadly the best ones stay on the PC...so I still end up upgrading the ol PC rig.

Bones_Jackson

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Which is exactly why we all need Halo Wars to be really, really good.

Only if it's multi-platform!

I bought C&C Generals Zero Hour JUST to play the fan-mod, and the NEXT DAY MS sent the cease and desist letter to them. Needless to say I bear a grudge.

SSJPabs

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @boopadoo: I agree fully with you. I think the future of RTS gaming on consoles will be with stuff like the Wii and more accurately the future consoles it spawns, the ability to point and drag things onscreen versus mentally approximating on-screen distance with your thumbstick is no contest. Heck, just the Wii-Mote with a wireless 10-key can probably beat the heck out of 95% of all current Console RTS games control-wise, and I'd bet it could run SupCom and such about as good as a mouse with the right GlovePIE script.

DaiMacculate

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Damn, just noticed all my typos... Burning shame now fills me...

Kaos_

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Console controllers can easily be used to control and RTS. The main worry is probably moving around the screen. Easily sorted by using the same controls as the Ps3 webbrowser uses. Left analogue stick moves the window, right analogue stick moves the pointer. Pretty easy to get used to.
Thinking further if you had to press and hold X to select things it'd be more difficult, but that could be sorted by using the R3 button to replace a mouse click.
As for creating squad hotkeys (ctrl and 1-9 on PC) you can use the D-pad for the first four, then press triangle or something to make the D-pad switch to having the next 4 mapped and. Then one more press of triangle takes you back so its the original 4 squads mapped to the D-pad. Thats 8 squads, and it could easily be 12 or 16.

Consoles have the power now. The transition to playing RTS's on them is just going to take a little thought and getting used to.



Kaos_

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> "We need to grow the RTS market and bring in new players, not isolate it further into eventual niche obscurity."

For sure, Starcraft 2 (PC only) will turn out to be a marginal title that the mouse-phobic masses will almost totally ignore...yeah Blizzard sure is shooting themselves in the foot by remaining dedicated to the PC!

Bwahahaha!

gaijira

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> what does he mean that RTS are going the route of Point and Click and Text based games?

Lot Krotan

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> All the hate doesn't change the fact that the man is dead right.

char

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Mpalm.:

Well, to be honest, StarCraft 64 was actually pretty fun. It did feel way too limited though. But SC is fun no matter what you use to play it.

Ignatius

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I disagree with this guy:
I'm not a huge RTS player but I do think RTS and people that enjoy deep strategy, don't appreciate it being stripped down to the 'core gameplay' especially the mouse control as interface. I'm sure he can branch off and use RTS basics to fuel a new console centric hybrid-genre, and this may grow more players and introduce them to RTS. BUT, I think that it's going to be awfully hard not to 'dumb' down 'real' RTS with out mouse and keyboard support.
We'll see, won't we. Never say never or ever ever.

Ehardergardens

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @DigiMish: It was a fun game..

But Red Alert 2 with Sun way points is my play style of choice BUT... the way EA took Westwood's Command and Conquer controlles in CnC3 are horrible. I tried so hard to get passed it but haven't yet.

xpnet

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @xpnet:

Herzog Zwei!!!!

That is one of my all time favorite games and my first experience with RTS games and it worked on a controller with 3 buttons. I think it came out in like '90 and it was amazing. I was like 11 years old and my brother and I could't stop playing it...split screen no less. We even would set up a cardboard barrier in the middle of the TV so you couldnt see what the other guy was doing.

Gray665

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I was able to play and finish warcraft 2 on Sega Saturn. I think i can handle anything now.

maybe not.

carbonelli

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @CockroachMan: Hmm... Point well made... I figure there may be an issue discerning player inaccuracy when selecting the smaller units during a busy segment with a shaky hand, but if they do something to offset that issue, then a Wii RTS would be pretty neat.

Taco Bell™

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Burguois: As many have pointed out, it's been proven that you can have a competent port of an RTS game on consoles; you just need to make it simple enough to suit the limitations of console input devices. This is known as "dumbing it down."

RTS's are inherently complicated. This guy is saying "let's just make really simple 'made-for-console' RTS's." Would you ever make "that" game for the PC? No, because it is in fact a dumbed down game and PCs are capable of so much more. If theoretically a console RTS was ported to the PC, you can bet that the PC version would come with a bunch of advanced features that weren't possible in the console version.

The FPS genre was successfully ported to consoles, but just barely, and RTS control schemes are way more complicated than FPS's ever were. You can't even do PC vs console FPS matches fairly, as Shadowrun proved. What makes you think you can create a good RTS experience on a console without dumbing it down?

Korey

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Anyone played FFXII: Revenant Wings? That was, to me, a surprisingly competent RTS for a handheld system. The stylus of the DS really made up for lack of mouse.

I think a console variant of that gameplay would be too awkward and unnecessarily finicky, though, unless it did use the typical PC keyboard and mouse control. I haven't played many console RTSes, and honestly have trouble imagining that genre on the platform.

epherlite

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @xpnet: That clunky system might have worked 10+ years ago, but it just looks stupid now.

DigiMish

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Wii controls are perfect for a RTS..
I don't understand why no one tried it yet :/

CockroachMan

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> See: Patapon.

I'm surprised no one else has mentioned it yet.

celery

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I agree with this. Not only will control schemes be revamped, but it seems more 'new' or 'innovative' mechanics are coming out of the works. Such as squad based gameplay for Halo Wars and C&C 3 (thank god for Dawn of War), and now (supposedly) sophisticated voice command for End War. I know a lot of people love the strategy of an rts, resource gathering and base building, but I hate it with a passion. I'm desparate for a tactics based game with intricate gameplay mechanics. Like, jamming radio between enemy units and watch them scatter, killing an officer to see morale and fighing ability drop, or detailed building interiors for intense city-fight. Those are COMPLETELY off the top of my head, I'm just trying to depict the general direction of 'detailed' RTT (real time tactics) gameplay means to me.

Garro

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> If Halo Wars is good, then I might start believing that console RTS games can work. Until I see one RTS that doesn't suck on a console, I will not believe that RTS games have any place on a console.

L

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]>


+ Watch video


xpnet

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @NutManIV: We didn't play the same game.. I started RTS with the only game I owned on the genesis

[www.gamespot.com] Herzog Zwei

xpnet

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Since when did an RTS gamer ever say, "Fuck this, I'm using a gamepad?" It don't work. It won't work. I know, I made comments before about how mastering the controls of a game is part of the fun, but for games like this, the Wiimote/Nunchuk combination (which is pretty much a keyboard/mouse setup) is the best choice. A dual-stick solution does not necessarily dumb down the experience, but it takes away a lot of the immersion.

boopadoo

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @CrimsonAngel:
Totally agree with you. And ya Sins of a Solar empire is amazing.

@Burguois:
Even though they did a good job on the console port of C&C3 it still a shadow of itself on the PC. It would be an easy fix if they allowed a KB/M but again kinda defeats the purpose of a console.

FtGF

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Honestly EA actually made console RTS games work. I didn't believe it at first, but after playing C&C3 I can honestly say that they nailed it. The current problem with consoles and RTS games is that the consoles cant handle the amount of units on screen at once. So in C&C 3 online(x360 of course) you have a unit cap of 50 which makes the game impossible if youre nod.

NutManIV

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> RTS on consoles would be fine if they would give us mouse / keyboard support. Although when that does happen, I bet it will go to PS3 first.

Oh, and all RTS console games need at least a basic map editor as well.

wired_fenix

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Wow, I've lost some respect for Adam Isgreen. I never thought that would happen. No PC-oriented developer should be GLAD that console gaming is becoming more popular.

If you want to work on console games, Adam, just stop the RTS production and make a game in a genre that's actually suited to the shitty control schemes of consoles. The RTS genre is not meant for fucking analogue control sticks.

Releasing RTS games for consoles is nothing but a waste of time. The majority of RTS fans are PC/Mac users, console control schemes are simply too simplistic to make a great RTS game out of anyway, and really, how many of the millions of HALO3 players out there are you going to pull away from their run-and-gun slugfest with Universe at War, which unfortunately turned out far more mediocre than it should have been.

Petroglyph should focus on making better RTS games for their most important platform, not working towards simplifying games of a genre that are supposed to be built around complexity in the first place. If they want to keep making crappy RTS games for consoles, fine. But I sure as hell won't be playing them.

I'm just happy through all of this that Gas Powered Games exists, and that Chris Taylor and Co are die-hard, PC enthusiasts. While they may be releasing a version of SupCom for the 360, I can always count on them to support the PC platform.

Atheist Jew

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Korey: I guess giving a tramp a wash and a haircut can be seen in a lot of ways as dumbing down the tramp, right?

Get real.

Burguois

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @CrimsonAngel: This nerd rage was sponsored by "BEER it is good for you"

CrimsonAngel

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I guess I'm the only person who thought C&C3 controlled fantastically on the 360. I've been a fan of RTS games for a long, long time and I agree with his sentiment.

Burguois

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Great the internet ate my post so her we go agian

What the fuck...

The only reasons why he thinks the RTS genre is stagnant is because of asshats like him that keep making the same shit over and over again.

Relics Dawn of war and Company of Heroes.
Supreme Commander.
World in Conflict
Sins of a solar Empire they are all pretty resent RTS games that all tried to push what RTS game is and did so in brilliant way.

CC3 and Universe at war where both old school RTS game with nothing new to offer the world at all NOTHING!!!

Both where boring ass hell so before this asshat should open his mouth he should see what the competition is making and blowing him out of the water with.

CrimsonAngel

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> "The evolution of RTS from PC to console is all about re-discovering the core fun of the genre while stripping away the redundancy, over-complication, and bloat that has been attaching itself to RTS games over the years."

Otherwise known as dumbing down the genre.

Korey

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> RTS games for me will always be PC. There's just something about the tight controls of a mouse and keyboard combined with the 'in your face' of a PC monitor. It'll be a tough sell pulling me away from that.

gils0n

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @0Jigsaw: I don't really think they work "well". They just work. If any console FPS supported multiplayer between consoles and PCs, PC players would always have the advantage because of mouse+keyboard's quicker responsiveness.

I have Uncharted on the PS3, and I've beaten it. But I'm sure it would've been so much easier with a mouse.

DarkGildon

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> What the fuck...

The only reasons why he thinks the RTS genre is stagnant is because of asshats like him that keep making the same shit over and over again.

Relics Dawn of war and Company of Heroes.
Supreme Commander.
World in Conflict
Sins of a solar Empire they are all pretty resent RTS games that all tried to push what RTS game is and did so in brilliant way.

CC3 and Universe at war where both old school RTS game with nothing new to offer the world at all NOTHING!!!

Both where boring ass hell so before this asshat should open his mouth he should see what the competition is making and blowing him out of the water with.

CrimsonAngel

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Console RTS' are pointless until they let us use a K+M to control it.

No matter how good a control scheme they make for a controller, it just can't beat the speed and accuracy of a mouse for selecting and deploying units.

I actually prefer to use a pad for FPS' (mainly because I can't stand moving with the keyboard) but for RTS' there is just no way. They just aren't fun to play on a pad.

Both PS3 and 360 have USB ports. Stop locking out K+M options and just let us play the way they are meant to be played. It makes no sense.

So long as they continue to force pad controls, I'll continue to not buy them.

skullivan

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @gamadaya: It isn't bad, but it kind of beats the purpose of a console. Half of the gameplay comes with the controller. Imagine porting every game from any console to PC and just using the relevant controllers on PC...

DarkGildon

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @DarkGildon: fps works better on consoles than rts...

0Jigsaw

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Anthropomancer: How exactly can you dumb down a genre that's just - pick up piece - move piece - capture enemy. No tweaks anywhere, that's all Chess has been... ever. Any time someone suggests ideas to actually evolve the genre, people balk (see the politics suggestion a while back). I'll stick with Tic-Tac-Toe for now!

Eric

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Anthropomancer: Supcom and Company of heroes are more sophisticated than that.

deathbunny

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @DarkGildon:
Is that bad? I'd love it if the 360 had keyboard and mouse support for all it's shooters. I don't understand why people who make consoles/FPSs for consoles force me to play with a controller.


gamadaya

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> How exactly can you dumb down a genre that's just - acquire resource - build army - smite enemy. Certain tweaks here and there, but that's all the RTS has been... ever. Any time someone suggests ideas to actually evolve the genre, people balk (see the politics suggestion a while back). I'll stick with Rise of Nations for now!

Anthropomancer

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I once read a brilliant comment somewhere:

"Playing FPS with a dual analogue stick controller is like trying to wank wearing a boxing glove"

Swap out FPS with RTS and it works just as well here.

ErskinPig

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> You just can't get the level of micro that you can on a pc... it's basically dumbing down the game and holding the player back. Unless it is a really slow moving RTS game with units that have tons of hp and can just sit there and not cast spells / use special abilities, then ok. Otherwise, it is a waste to get RTS games on console. We all know how great starcraft was on console, right?

Mpalm.

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> C&C 3 worked OK control-wise on the console, but I think the bigger issue with the game was that there was too much going on the screen to keep track of on an SDTV. The game really needed to be played in HD to get a decent handle on the action. Given that most 360 owners still aren't playing in HD, this is a huge issue for the average gamer.

Darth Navster

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> I really am pinning my hopes for the console RTS on Halo Wars.

It has the resources behind it to be very good, but I just don't know how they are gonna manage the transition.

My guess is that it will try to do too much and fail badly or find a nice simplified but fun system that will become the standard.

Not that I am a particular fan of the Halo series, but I think they did a good job of refining the FPS to work well on a console, and a lot of games since have used that model. (obvious credits to Rare/Free Radical ofcourse)

Lackshmana

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> @Fulgurator: Exactly what I was thinking. Eventually we are all going to end up having to plug in USB keyboards and mice in order to be competitive...

DarkGildon

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Agreed on the whole mouse/keyboard thing. Those games are rough to play with a controller. Just too much going on.

mva5580

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Was Grimgrimore good for the genre?

Actually, that's sort of a joke. I love those guys.

Anarchist_Gamer

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Less talk, more Proofs.

Fulgurator

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> What about the new EndWar game? Military speak to command units? I'm so there!

BTFzor_Freestyle

]]> <![CDATA[Console RTSs Are Good For The Genre]]> Anything that isn't FPS is fine on a console.

DarkGildon

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