Billkwando

To start i live in a low income area (some would call it a ghetto... their are housing projects around but low inclome is easier to define). So all of this is based on personal expierience.

First some stuff i can't debate... Car insurance is MUCH higher after i moved here and i think they are justified for doing so. Car theft rates and break in rates are pretty high here (fortunately my car blends in with the junkers people drive so it's immune from this :)). Their are also a lot of pay day loan places/title loans/rent to own/etc places around here. They do prey on the poor and uneducated.

However on things like the 'increased food costs' i just don't see it. Poor area's almost always have thinks like big lots/ national liquidators etc that carry stuff cheaper than you'll find at wall-mart (where i have NEVER seen a 25 cent can of soup... granted i don't shop at wal-mart that often because it is out of the way but i don't feel my life has been harmed because of that :) ). Poor area's may not have mega food stores but the markets they do have competitive prices, not to mention the food markets that are geared towards the immigrant population.. these places are cheaper than your standard pathmark on a lot of items. I think that's a flaw in the 2'nd articles research they only compared the exact same products at both places and didn't notice that the low income area store had more lower cost options. Sure you can't find dry ages steaks like you can in the rich areas but i bet you can find better pork belly/ tripe and other 'poor' cuts of meet 'in the ghetto' (queue up Elvis).

And people walk a lot further than 'a block or 2' if they don't have a car.

Again you sound like someone who has little experience living in poor areas

harlock_JDS

azzybish

cinderx

Big saving, and it's not taking up any space in your closet...

Stormbringer

diodegrey

izrahfel4

SmAuRt_GuY

I_Hate_This_Place

I think you might be right. Maybe that deal doesn't exactly include a flatscreen TV, but the "as low as" in the ad makes me think there is more to this than just what's being reported.

Herc

[kellys.rtotogo.com]

You can also buy one outright for a competitive $499!

Electromancer

Isn't everyone on here jumping to conclusions? It looks like that bundle includes a flatscreen TV.

I know it is still expensive, but it doesn't appear to be the blatant robbery that article is suggesting.

visionep

Whatever happened to usury laws anyway?

Alegery

In Soviet Russia, Wii rents you!

PurpleMonkey

sadkermit - soon to be banned for standing up to the ummm nazi.

And it doesn't just affect poor people... the #1 cause of bankruptcy in this country is medical bills. And nobody wakes up in the morning saying, "hmm I'm gonna buy a heart attack today and put it on the credit card!".

Final point, bad luck is bad luck, just like good luck is good luck - Bill Gates is an awfully lucky man, a lot of people just as smart/talented/savvy as him don't have a fraction of his wealth, ask him and I am sure he will acknowledge. Sometimes shit happens.

chantastic

@Yetanotheruninspiredscreename: I agreed with you about the regulations. I was just stating my point about us bailing those people out.

I_Hate_This_Place

I don't really disagree with that. Now with that said, are you with with me in supporting the immediate cessation of all medical care to people over 18 in the U.S. without insurance/medicare/medicaid on the same principle? If they had been responsible, planned ahead, etc etc they would have insurance and not be in this predicament.

I think most people disagree with this principle so starkly applied though; hence Ron Paul's relatively poor showing in the Primaries ;)

DaiMacculate

[www.nytimes.com]

The subprime fiasco which was due to not having regulations that would have prevented it does affect ordinary people. A lot of overseas banks are being affectd and a lot of people in other countries are afraid of investing in US businesses and banks. With money not coming and investors pulling out the US economy suffers badly.

[www.mcclatchydc.com] details the rise of hidden fees that are often undisclosed, hidden in the fine print, or just listed as an unclear line item on a bill.

These fees some of which are a 200 dollar cancelation fee for a cell phone plan. 25 dollars for checking in an extra baggage at an airline.

Yetanotheruninspiredscreename

I_Hate_This_Place

As far as your other point, I have to agree. My main point is we(the people) should not have our tax dollars bailing out the lenders or the borrowers. Wall street made this sub-prime thing seem like it was such a huge impact on the economy when really if you look at the statistics, real estate as a whole has a minute impact on the over-all market. Much less the impact of sub-prime real estate. But to hear wall street tell it armageddon was upon us becuase firms were closing. All of this was of course to get the usual corporate welfare. Kind of like what we did with Boeing after giving them billions to "future proof" our borders only to have it fail, and then they come back asking for more tax-payer dollars becasue they're hurting. I say let the firms close, let boeing hurt for a while. It will teach them to learn from their mistakes.

And just so you know, Republicans and Democrats alike work for big business. Don't let one of them fool you into thinking they have your back as a taxpayer when it comes to fiscal responsibility.

I_Hate_This_Place

Rollie-the-Guar

cb_32

p.s. of course, this doesnt apply to student loans. You should give your soul for a proper education. ;)

zyberteq

Tigerfog

Sigh the thing is charges in the fine print is an illegal practice. Charges are not supposed to be hidden.

Lenders weren't regulated so they engaged in practices that caused their downfall. Guess what such downfalls effect the economy of not this country but others.

You may want to dig deeper into the whole sub prime fiasco you will find that the measures that would have prevented it were not in place because Republicans are under the view that businesses can adequetly self regulate. Which is why food inspectors are a minority, why the FDA and other agencies cannot institute recalls of say contaimanted food making people violenty ill or causing deaths. The company has of it's own violation institute said recall. Guess what most companies do not recall their shoddy products or defective foods until weeks or months have gone after becoming aware of the issue.

Yetanotheruninspiredscreename

I_Hate_This_Place

SpartanQ77

Kandralla

Also have you ever dealt with people who were impoverished? Spent time volunteering at a HeadStart or a Soup Kitchen? I have, and if you haven't let me tell you that they're constantly preyed upon, from all types of businesses and individuals. Your own example, that more expensive gas station? Put it in a neighborhood where the average income is minimum wage, add a crumbling or nonexistent mass transit structure, and add in some gang violence and boarded up buildings...now please tell me the extra it charges isn't predatory, or that there are so many options and alternatives for these people.

A video game system is an extreme example, the people who might possibly be in the market for this _should_ be above the very lowest income levels I agree, but I (and again, I think CG although I don't know) was addressing the way the practice of rent-to-own plays out in general. Ever see a Rent-To-Own in a really nice neighborhood? I haven't, the one near me is literally just over the line between middle and lower class in our section of town.

DaiMacculate

Well the thing is a lot of these people quite frankly don't have a choice. If they cannot get a bank account they have to get their pay checks cashed somehow because their employer doesn't hand them cash.

Loans well those companies know that the people in the ghetto for the most part don't have consumer advocacy groups representing them so they can do often outright illegal terms conditions other methods I won't list that take hundreds or thousands of dollars from these people. The loan companies know that the current US legal and banking system will not step in to enforce fair loan terms on the people living in certain areas also they will not have the proper people representing the person coming in to discuss getting a loan.

A lot of the businesses operating on the ghetto tax mode are quite frankly doing illegal methods of business or would get them sued out of existance if they tried it in the upper class areas of America.

Yetanotheruninspiredscreename

Funny how it's only in the US that socialism/communism has become synonymous with EEEVIL. We can plainly see there that the Cold War era rhetoric really lingers. There are still a lot of countries where socialist parties get a non-token amount of votes.

Guizzy

[www.nytimes.com]

A lot of cities do not have trams or busses plus carrying loads of groceries by taxi or bus or tram is not effective. Most ghetto residents only go a few blocks because they don't own cars and there are no grocery stores around them.

Food Worlds, Walmarts, Winn-Dixies, Bruno's etc usually sell cans of soup at 25 cents per or for the gourmet stuff at over a dollar.

[salt.claretianpubs.org] details more ghetto tax stats such as :

Nearly 60 percent of rent-to-own customers earn less than $25,000 a year. In Wisconsin, it is estimated that a $200 television might cost as much as $700 at one of the rent-to-own businesses in the state, after interest.

Yetanotheruninspiredscreename

Even so, most of this are traps for idiots, nothing more. It highlights why we badly need education reform in so much of the US, but I can't quite feel bad about someone who's actually taken in by a fancy version of "I'll trade you this GREAT BIG NICKEL for your itty bitty dime".

Aliasi

where do you live that you can buy a can of soup for 25 cents?

also amazingly enough buses frequently exist 'in the ghetto' that go to non ghetto area's (as do food markets etc)

somehow i think you are just believing some bs you've read and not actually going 'in the ghetto' to see what's there

harlock_JDS

Should be the stories of a person who worked at a rent to own store. I lack the indeceny to work at a rent to own place. I let morals get in the way of employment unlike a lot of people.

Yetanotheruninspiredscreename

Also, this idea is hardly new. Rent-to-own furniture and the like have existed to take advantage of people without a means to buy items up front. Not exactly the bright and cheery side of capitalism, but it happens.

rdj

For those that don't understand it's expensive living in the ghetto. Grocery stores dont'e exist so you visit gas stations where a can of soup that at a grocery store would cost 25 cents costs a 1.50. Also they sell individual cigaretes. Not a pack but individual cigs for a buck each.

Check cashing places charge 20 dollars to process a money stub from your place of work. Reason the people in ghetto go to the check cashing place is because banks don't exist in the ghetto or they cannot get an account.

There are people renting stuff from rent to own at the price of hundreds of dollars a month stuff they could afford to get at full price if they saved up. Guess what the vast majority of trailers have 40 inch widescreen tvs and they pay 50 dollars a month for that tv over a two year period. The 40 inch tv takes up one quarter of the trailer and due to the placement of the items inside you are sitting just a few inches away from it or half the screen cannot be seen since there is stuff in the way.

[www.somethingawful.com] is filled with my stories of a person who worked at a rent to own store.

I live in a town of a quarter million people within a half mile radius of where I live there are dozens of these rent to own places and I would rather buy at a thrift store then a rent to own because the rent to own quality is often worse and far pricer for a plain table then what you could pick up a thrift store or antique shop.

Yetanotheruninspiredscreename

You are thinking of Soviet communism. Or Stalin-like communism.

Chinese communism doesn't regulate economic by government monopoly. They just regulate everything else :P

But then again, most countries do one way or the other.

Herodito

rhinojosa

anglon

skullivan

The great thing about capitalism is that there is always another source of product, unlike socialism/communism, where you get one vendor... the Government.

Besides, what about "being greedy" is unique to captialism? As Churchill said,

"Capitalism is the worst economic system, except for all the others."

Juminatriascala

If you can't do basic math, maybe you deserve to get hosed.

chenry

baked ham

ichiban1081

FP ph15h

Then this christmas, I got a call from my network, Orange.

"Hello is this Mr Likeimgonnagiveyoumyname?"
"Yes. How can I help you?"
"We've analysed your network usage, and we feel you'd be better off paying £25 a month, instead of your current £65"
"OK. Will I have to give back my PS3?"
"I'm sorry?"
"Well...when I signed up for this contract, the deal was that I got a PS3, the phone and the texts and minutes."
"We don't know anything about the PS3. It must have been a deal from the place you bought the phone."
"K. I'll take that offer then."

So I end up getting a PS3, a brand new phone, and more minutes and texts than I can possibly use, for £900, which I pay over an 18 month period. Bargain.

But this deal is utter rubbish. And I can't imagine that anyone but the stupidest clown would do it. At $79 a month, they could have that Wii in 3 months, and 2 new games each month.

Nayl

Voteforme2020

I'll be here all week, folks.

KurtSubvert

Regarding the second part: Nobody is forcing the "low end" of our society to buy a current gen video game system or any other gen video game system. Nobody disputes that this is a terrible deal, made all the more so by the "lease" part of it, which on the surface locks the customer into the whole 12 months, vs. the usual absurd rent-to-own payments where at least part of the payment amount is buying the customer the right to walk away from the arrangement without paying the full price (or getting the merchandise). This is like a gas station which habitually charges 5-10 cents more per gallon than the station across the street. The beauty of capitalism is that the customer can choose to go to the cheap station or to this one, depending on the customer's perceived needs. If there aren't enough customers who see themselves as needing to pay the extra cost... too bad for the seller. Arguments that the "lower end" need to be protected from free choice are inevitably based on the perception that the proponent of the argument knows better what's good for someone else and generally lead to all sorts of undesirable effects.

ElReyMysterioso-PBUH

DaiMacculate

Rebelphoenix83

I think Communist Gamer has something of a point, though put awkwardly if not totally misplaced in this post. Many states have laws against predatory lending, which this basically amount to in fact if not in name, but these types of ridiculously one-sided deals are always going to exist in a fully open market. The key is to out them for what they are, and for this service I once again applaud Kotaku. Its just sad that the people who might consider this plan are likely to be low-income families ignorant of the penalties or alternatives, like the Lottery Rent-to-own stores prey on the lowest end of our society mentally and financially.

DaiMacculate

TechnoPirate

I love communism it would so fucking work but sadly it doen't cause people go power mad and it becomes dictator ship.....anyone giving this person negative comments are just plain retarded.

Ontopic: the main reason im posting is also because of this guy.>>>

@Foggynotion: you are not cool.

now back to the Wii rip off thing, HOW and why would you do this unless you obviously were using it to re-rent to some one else thus ripping them off makin a nice big in-complete triangle of 'love' I really don't see why someone would accept this offer

tyddraig

zanzibarlegend

ElReyMysterioso-PBUH

I use credit cards and pay off the debt before I get interest.

I don't get ripped off.

You need credit to survive now a days...well if you want a car/house at a feasible amount.

Vecha

Getting screwed by Kelly a street corner prostitute for $50 = illegal.

GPman

reptile168

zztopp

gamadaya

Guizzy

texicali74

I think the only people who do get trapped by this are "impulse" buyers who see something and have to have it right then.

seamroy

zanzibarlegend

Dopeski

Part-Time-Viking

GamerBunny

@Earthslide: it would be great if people could live debt free, but unfortunately that's not true

obeymydog

elementary

waitinthecar

@manjikengo: yes. its called common sense.

by the way guys, in case ther are people out there trying to find the wii, the nintendo stor e in nyc gets a shit load of them all the time. i walked in the store the day after black friday, and snagged one upwith no problems. find someone in the city willing to ship it to you, and give like 100 bucks for their time and effort. that ends up being 350 dollars, which the last time i checked is way less than 948 dollars. i dunno just a thought.

zanzibarlegend

....

Car2oon

waitinthecar

Wolf_Dog

I agree that it's wrong to knowingly take advantage of the stupid, and I honestly can't think of a situation where renting-to-buy a Wii would make any financial sense, in any situation.

Then again, I think the point most people here are missing is that while this offer has been advertised, it has yet to be announced how many people actually "take advantage" of this offer. I mean, I'm willing to bet the only people who would take that deal would just use a fake ID and address, then "rent" it and dip out.

tzaketh

NLMantia

Part-Time-Viking

Books

Wolfers

HurricaneDave

I_Hate_This_Place

Car2oon

I do. It's basically abusing the stupidity of retards who can't multiply.

Guizzy

King of Kings

Moonshadow101

AkirasCrow

Guizzy

No, and there shouldn't be. If you're an idiot, you're going to get screwed over, no matter how many laws we have. Unless we start mandatory institutionalization of anyone with an IQ of under 130, we're going to have people getting screwed over left and right. And even then, no matter how smart the "general populace" is, there will be a percentage of the population that is both smarter and more ruthless than the bottom of the curve.

tzaketh

That's the beauty of capitalism; a market will exist wherever there is a demand for one. And a market with no demand will cease to exist.

I only wish I would have come to this realization before I spent my savings opening a business that sells Harold Ramis bobbleheads.

elementary

sariah

harlock_JDS

(I love the consumerist)

brent_w

wisconsinista

Voteforme2020

Tale

Then I realized; that's probably the kind of thinking that led those people to the point where they can't even get a credit card.

Guizzy

ManjiKengo

Earthslide

Yeah. And anyone who can wrestle up $79 per month can put off getting a Wii for a month, save the money, and then buy one.

tzaketh

And sadly someone probably will too.

Cactuar

Foggynotion

Part-Time-Viking

Jun581 won't give you tree fiddy!!

acez2087

elementary

Now? Just wow.. How stupid do they believe people are?

huginn

nxp3

Sorry to ruin the parade, but stuff like this is just because where theres money to be made, it will be.

Communist_Gamer

Old-school Sonic fanboy

Gadzooks149

Saint Anima

KingDavid73

Mr.SithNinja