PS3 can upgrade its hard drive, so this would not be too big a problem.

ritful

cherrybomb

heero69

KevinMassacre

I am suspecting they did this as an easy way out they didn't want the PS3 version to have much longer loadtimes and since the Hard Drive is in all systems they were able to say hey we are giving you a feature making it the better version cause the game load faster. Well technically it does after the preload but the load on the 360 shows they are doing some impressive loading to get a 3-4 second loadtime. And I think the laziness comes in that they didn't have to optimize the disk and caching on the PS3 version they just put it all on the Hard Drive.

There are plenty of games that dont require a huge cache on the PS3 that have done fine so I do not want this to be the norm. I do not want to compare this to PC load time cause well this is not a PC and not having to wait to install has always been a nice thing about console games.

Now if an install on the hard drive could cut load times from the 15 sec plus loads it would be worth it. Or if it allowed for more textures larger maps etc but minus 2-3 sec's is BS for anything other than an optional install.

Konchu

sascha23

But yeah, no whining people.

sascha23

i really don't see how its a problem.. you non-ps3-owners practically jumped at the opportunity to watch the install on your computer...

its pretty much a perk of the ps3 version by now.

joelface

eilegz

Guizzy

There are differences, but mainly because of LOD bias and the existence of a blur filter on the PS3 in-game. But they're minor. Textures and models etc. are all the same. Just compare the "gallery" section of both games (with the character models).

Bodes well for upcoming multiplatform Capcom titles.

SG79

This to me is of bigger concern since I'm forced to sit through them to make sure they are not revealing some otherwise obscure bit of information essential to my progress through the game. In fact more companies should follow this route, most specifically the masters of the concurrent load Electronic Arts.

pABSO

ElektroDragon

Aas people have pointed before, Uncharted, Ratchet and Clank, and Burnout don't have load time problems, and then there are games like Heavenly Sword that have unbearable load times even with the install, but 4-5 seconds isn't an issue either way. If it's 4 seconds on PS3, 3 on 360, and 2 with an install, I agree they shouldn't have bothered, but I'm just wondering where people are pointing the fingers here.

bobtheduck

fuchikoma

@Dumari:

You might want to explain why Uncharted doesn't use a HDD cache, and has one reasonable initial loading time. Then there is R&C, which has a negligible game data cache. Same with Burnout Paradise, which only has an online profile installed (like the 360 game). it's a case of sloppy programming on Capcom's behalf, that's all. Most developers are taking advantage of the very fact that the HDD is swappable.

A 2X BD may have a slower transfer rate on paper, but realtime figures are comparable to the rate of a DVD-9 (which btw spins at 6X on the 360, 12X is DVD-5).

Without making this comment into an article, a DVD drive is a CLV (constant linear velocity) type. The transfer rate and speed are at peak (ie what's on paper) in the centre of the disc, and get slower as you move to the edges. The disc spins slower or faster depending on the data position on the disc basically.

A BD drive is a CAV (constant angular velocity); the speed and transfer rate remains constant throughout. Which is why it's a much quieter drive as well.

SG79

what0080

Guizzy

TheNthDegree

Hey genius, not everybody has (or wants to have, or can afford to have) both a PS3 and a 360.

TRT-X

Its not about decreasing level load times. Its about getting the data 'during level play' quick enough. The cache file holds in-game assets (audio/models/ textures etc) which are pulled out during the levels. They need to be accessible quickly otherwise the game would have to pause during play to load these up (or you would have to downscale textures etc to reduce the file size) The 360 can stream all of this data quick enough during gameplay so as to not require a lengthy install process. Its just a design quirk of the PS3 attributed to the Blu-Ray read speed.

In future, the bigger the game then the bigger the cache file. Imagine if a huge title came out utilising the full BR disc. How about a wait for an hour while it installs a 15gb game cache?

irnchriz

The PS3 HAD to have a hard disk, ask all of the developers, they knew from day one that there is no possible way to run today's games straight from Blu-Ray at only 2x drive speed. Thats the Blu-Ray disadvantage, shed loads of storage pretty shitty data read speeds.

The 360 doesn't NEED to put a data file onto the hard drive to play because the data read speeds and seek times on DVD blow Blu Ray out of the water with its crap read speed and data streaming. I bet that GTA will NEED to cache to the PS3 hard disk to play because, just like the previous GTA games, it will stream everything uring the game. If this is indeed the case then you won't even need a HDD to play it on the 360 !!

BTW if the 360 has a HDD the game automatically caches data to improve loading times, although the cache is relatively small and you don't have to wait 22 minutes for this to happen. This has been the case with all* 360 games since the launch and also the original xbox.

*there are a few exceptions which require a HDD for the whole game or just for multiplayer etc.

irnchriz

Cheers!

Deth

There, I said it.

Of course, I have neither system right now...but I'm seeing less reason to hang around the PS3.

Frank

cduran02

quen

It would've been nice if was optional, but I think I would've installed it anyway. All in all its done and over with now and Im just enjoying the game.

.....And I do agree with some of the comments here...gammers are getting really whinny now a days. Installing DMC4 is nothing like installing a game on a PC. There are no chances of something else on your PS3 causing incompatibility with your game, no need to install the latest DirectX or OpenGL.

cduran02

Insomnia Bob

Just because something is exaggerated to make it horribly bad doesn't mean it was not bad to begin with.

Burguois

However,these people whining about how a console shouldn't be like a PC need to go cry me a river. First of all, is there some kind of magical law that exists that states consoles can't have anything in common with PC's?

Last time I checked, you still don't have to: worry about hardware issues,manually install patches,worry about viruses/malware,mess with hardware drivers,etc...

Are you going to start bitching about consoles using GPU's,hard disks, and optical media? Maybe we should go back to using cartridges and saving games on internal batteries (that die after a few years). God, I hate how I can online now and play people and download stuff-that sure does suck! (Let me guess, your ears had steam coming out because you had to take ten minutes and learn how to set up a router.)

CaptainBuzzKill

Irenicus-the one and only

okenny :)

Luke Plunkett

can definitely see what the hoopla's about. may pick it up.

StratfordX

You know, you fell back on the personal attacks awfully quickly for someone who cops such a holier than thou attitude. Last time I checked low income housing just meant you were poor...not blameless, entitled, or superior. Most people who are genuinely indifferent about others suggesting they're fanboy don't tend to drop as many f-bombs as you do.

Nightshift_Nurse

How many people in this comment section have added something to the discussion? Most everyone, I think. Except for you.

I can't be arsed to look up the definition of "troll" but I think I can do this from memory. You are a troll.

But I'm sure anyone who has survived without a banhammer for 2 whole months must have something to say. I've only been around here since aught 6.

dowingba

Maybe you should sell your fridge and buy a thesaurus? Or perhaps enroll in an entomology course given your fixation with insect brains...

Nightshift_Nurse

Irenicus-the one and only

Nope, I have a 360 and no PS3 so that = fanboy, or twat, or whatever other retarded thing you want to come up with. I also live in low-income housing, but that obviously doesn't factor into anything. I should just sell my refrigerator to get a PS3! So I can play DMC4 on it instead of the 360 so I can save my self 1 second of load times every level or so.

dowingba

Seriously, installing games on a console? *smacks forehead.

edhe (xbl)

No, I'm not insisting that anyone who doesn't own a PlayStation 3 is a fanboy. But I am saying that your colorfully worded, reactionary posts sound like the ramblings of some 360 obsessed twat.

Nightshift_Nurse

These people were the target audience when Nintendo refused to go ROM and stuck with cartridges. Warhawk took a while too, wheres that outcry?

Nevermind Ill go downstairs and watch my brothers 360 load screens between levels and other stuff instead.

Zepultura

And it's cool, you know. You start out by arbitrarily insulting someone for no reason at all (unless my comment about mandatory installs of a video game for some reason offended you on some deep spiritual level) and then when you can't take the heat you pretend to take the "high road". That's how the internet works. No consequences. Just start shit and then walk away whistling.

dowingba

Nightshift_Nurse

I hear ya.. I'd just like to know their reasoning behind it.. it just seems like a bad move, especially when the 360 doesn't need to do it and the load times are only decreased a few seconds.

PlasmaMachine

Maybe if a game came out on the system that I wanted, I'd buy the system. It just so happens that this phenomenon has not yet come to pass. It's not my fault, you know. And I'm sure as hell not gonna drop $500 on something I have absolutely no use for just so that lifeless folks on the internets stop calling me a "fanboy".

This isn't a presidential race, you know. I "support" the consoles that have games I want to play on them. So far for me that's the Wii and the 360. So fucking what? If everything in your simple insect brain boils down to "1 = fanboy, 0 = no fanboy" then that's your problem, not mine.

The DMC4 mandatory install is an issue. And within 2008 you will start to see why. Unless DMC4 is way beyond what any game will ever do with the PS3, lots of other games are going to force this mandatory install and PS3 owners are going to be fucked for space.

dowingba

I just have to wonder: if Naughty Dog (and everyone except Capcom, for that matter), can "make it work" with minimal or no installs, why is it suddenly a problem for Capcom? Does it require that much extra work for multiplatform games? Is it bad planning during the course of the development? Is BD to blame?
I have no fucking clue, and nor do most people hammering definitive statements.

Antiterra

Really, it's not that big a deal. As long as you're not making your PS3's hard drive a holding ground for gigs upon gigs of pirated anime, what are you using the space for? Really. The only people who have a right to complain are 20GB owners, and there's only like eight of them anyways.

Archaotic

As a poster, you are:

A) Your typical whiny bitch of a present-day gamer.

B) A stealth trolling 360 fanboy.

C) All of the above.

The fact that you don't even own a PlayStation 3 or a copy of Devil May Cry 4 is just icing on the cake...and would lead me to think "A" is the answer. Though a compelling argument could be made for B or C as well.

Nightshift_Nurse

Irenicus-the one and only

RiouV97041

Captain Impulse

Let me explain how consoles work: you take the game out of its case and insert it into the console. Then you play the game.

dowingba

No, not particularly.

Oh, you were just being a dick? Oh ok.

CaptLtrl

Now go take your Ritalin and before you know it that agonizing twenty minutes will be over. Maybe you could tear some paper while you wait...

Nightshift_Nurse

RuneX

Stefanten

I agree.. had this been the case for Xbox 360 you know there would be tons of "hah, Blu-Ray FTW!" type crap everywhere.. So the situation being what it is, wtf ya know? I thought Blu-Ray was supposed to have this covered? I mean if a dinky (in terms of content compared to the following) game like DMC4 takes a 20 minute install, what's going to happen with MGS4, The next FF or GTA4? Was this just a bad call with Capcom?? or a sign of things to come?

PlasmaMachine

RiouV97041

dowingba

A) Your typical whiny bitch of a present-day gamer.

B) A stealth trolling 360 fanboy.

C) All of the above.

Nightshift_Nurse

There are several problems with this mandatory install. First of all: it's mandatory. What the fuck for? There has got to be a damn good reason for Capcom to have made this mandatory on the PS3. Like, maybe the Blu-ray load times were so incredibly terrible off the disk that they decided it wasn't even a shippable game in that state. Ever think of that?

Also, what are you supposed to do if you don't have 5gb available? What if lots of other games start requiring these installs and you quickly run out of space? You're going to have to start uninstalling games and reinstalling them when you want to play them? This is ludicrous considering these are console games.

So once you uninstall DMC4 to make room for MGS4, and you want to play DMC4 again. Better stock up on cold cuts because you're gonna be watching that load screen for another 20 minutes.

It's stupid and you know it. You're just trying to defend it because you happen to have bought that version and you don't want to admit you got shafted.

Oh, sorry, they took a whole second off of in-game load times. WOO YEAH!

dowingba

Cagalli

NESv1

It would have been nice if the install was an option, but ultimately does it really matter? Oh, and the game is great... even if Nero is weaksauce compared to Dante.

Sugoi

OmegaKulu

As for music and games, this is what upgradable hard drives, flash memory cards, ipods, computers, and the back up feature are for. If half your PS3 hard drive is mp3s, you need to buy a 60 gb ZEN or an external sata drive ASAP either way.

blurayforever143

PlasmaMachine

Erwin

robokasey

gamadaya

Snukadaman_

@CaptLtrl:
I bet you looked really cool waiting.

gamadaya

robokasey

Erwin

Oh cool, I gotta get Patpon

vizion27

This is the biggest problem with forcing Bluray when it simply hadn't matured yet.

Up till now the games had just copied and pasted the same data all over the disk so access times would be faster due to longer actual seek times for the drive. Now it might be that the seek times are so long that this may be the only way to go without creating PSP-like load times for some games.

Dumari

josh924

Though I could see why some are upset that it's mandatory here.

SG79

This game is buckets of fun. The difficulty is definitely dropped from DMC3, but then again, I haven't beaten it and started the higher difficulties, so I'm gonna shut up now :P.

Seriously though. Buckets!

CaptLtrl

drweazel

Let *me* decide if I want the full game on my HD or if I want to play it from the disc with a few extra seconds of load time.

How hard is that to understand?

Over and Out.

MrBionic

If it's not what you want, that's fine, but to say it's not what gaming on a console should be borders on arrogant.

Maldron

I mean, we've got politicians trying to make laws to control who buys games. We've got a console war going on. Video games are being seriously misrepresented and slandered in the mainstream media. We've got wack-jobs blaming all the ills of society on all our favorite pastimes, and you people are going on and on about a 20 minute installation that just happens to not exist on a different version of a game.

Really?

ShirtGuyDom

The disconnect comes from my wanting to sit down, pop in a game, and play it. Not sit down, decide what content on my HD I no longer use very much, go about deleting it, pop in the game, wait for it to install, play it, and then delete it after I'm done with it a few weeks later to repeat the whole thing again.

Woah.. look at that, ease of use gone, and why does this rigamarole seem so familiar? Oh, that's right, I just did it on my PC the other day.

If you have no problem with consoles just becoming PCs, then fine, but I do have a problem with it. I'm not about to trade "stick in a game, play" for "Mess around for 30 minutes, play" any time soon.

MrBionic

lol...just reminded me of Zero punctuation...that guy...who does the reviews...yea

Vecha

Checked back before the stage was finished, it was done installing.

Anyway, game is great. Nero cooler than I thought, and Kyrie is Hot.

Saint Anima

I figured the "Get over it!" thing referenced earlier was an online post. It's actually part of the introduction letter.

Heh.

jallen

Dear capcom, release dead rising on the ps3. i will buy it. sincerely yours, ps3 owners

demonknightinuyasha

Data caching and optinional installs are different...I don't mind waiting 7 seconds if it means I'll have 5 gigs free for other things.

@Maldron:

I just like the option is all. I would like to install it ...then later on delete it...then maybe play it without the install if i'm just bored one day.

Vecha

brennan

Maldron

i was sad about that because i wouldn't have minded a longer history but at the same time fine with it cause it was a damn tasty sandwich X3

sadly i was out of soda though ;-;

demonknightinuyasha

I'm having fun playing a game. Why can't that be what matters?

As far as other uses, I'm aware. I have several downloads on my console as well - I'm constantly surprised that the PSN videos are typically bigger than the demos/games. Scary stuff.

Maldron

RiouV97041

I'm not *against* installs at all, just continue to always give the player the option. Simple common sense.

MrBionic

Allcars

logicaldefense

Opinions my friend...no reason to get hostile over them.

Vecha

The HDD is there for installs? Really? That was the plan when they opened the PSN store and everything? For mandatory installs?

Vecha

It's a part of the system that designers will bloody design for. It's been a standard on computers for years now, and now it's being integrated into consoles. You'd have to be downright ignorant to expect that people will keep doing things the old way when they could make it better with the new.

And seriously, deleting data is an option. You can always reinstall it later. God knows I should delete my NGS data from my PS3 because I won't be going back to it for a long time, make more room, but it isn't an issue yet. This crap about limits is just an excuse to whine, this crap about mandatory is just people forgetting that it's there to make the experience smoother.

It's not a PC, it's a console with a hard drive. Games will use it, as it's a part of the console. I seriously don't see the disconnect.

Maldron

Yea...I have ps1 games downloaded on my ps3...Not totally full...but eventually(I hope) there will be more games release...I really don't want to have to take up a certain high percentage of my HDD to a game...that I have a hard copy of...

Vecha

RiouV97041

Anyway, I get too involved I think. lol. I should learn to just let it goooo...

MrBionic

and the ps3 is what?

I'm just curious...

Vecha

It just doesn't make any sense to force you to install a console game. None.

Saddens me that people think this is the next hot thing, really.

MrBionic

The xbox version has screen tearing. The load times between cinematics and actual gameplay = 4 - 7 seconds.

:X

logicaldefense

GUNDAM-RX-78-2

vizion27

HibikiRush

So you are for or against mandatory installs?

The HDD can used for other things besides installing games.

Vecha

Beyene

dv8godd

dv8godd

I stand by my statement. Making it mandatory is silly.

MrBionic

zerokoolpsx

QC8472

Arttemis

TheCleaningGuy is no longer (that) disappointed with DMC4

See wut I did thur?

Maldron

lol on me.

We played Mario and Sonic at the olympic games to pass the time.

...don't judge me.

Ichidou

and is DMC4 better on the ps3 because of this "install"?

Vecha

MasterSauce

MasterSauce

Prepare for the BEST DMC of the series, hands down.

Arttemis

Beyene

MasterSauce

Digitalguardian

Bluecell

Beyene

20 minutes install in a console game is UNACCEPTABLE, period.

Drakron

GUNDAM-RX-78-2

Silly. There's a reason they are consoles and not PCs.

MrBionic

Had to stop after I got the switch to Dante. Rather upsetting, but I'll get back into it later.

Maldron

I thought the loading would be faster than it is on the PS3 version, altho it really is a huge change compared to all the current-gen and last-gen games that I've got home. (Mass effect seems like eternity compared to this).

QC8472

josh924

How much time does a twenty minute install, installs in?

When conducting such experiment one must take following factors that will affect the final result into consideration:

1. Room temperature

2. Air humidity

3. Surface area of the disk (how clean is it?)

4. Surface area of the laser lens reader (how clean is it?)

Therefore it is advisable to repeat the experiment several times over and post the mean time of the acquired results.

2SBs

so how has it been?
Why is it mandatory?
I thought you get to choose.
oh well.

Beyene

The Vampire Raziel

josh924

Samicham85

KeroseneClimax

ohhello

dv8godd

Though the lack of sound is... uh... I don't know. Were you as bored as I am watching?

Cola82

Bluecell

Sorry, I just joined in so I have no idea what's going on.

bangbangblah

Arttemis

One day, i'll master the layout of your house...

brennan

Seriously.. You put it in and walk away fro 20 minutes, it's not like you have to pop in a new disc every 3 minutes.

weasl

blurayforever143

GUNDAM-RX-78-2

ceilingFANBOY

VonDante

wickedneoq

ceilingFANBOY

@Sollus: Because not every 360 has a hard drive.

kingclip

WasabiJoe

Digitalguardian