SensAzn

gtrhroman

That's pretty interesting. I like it when there's stuff that gets sneaked in (ah, Disney...) or placed for viewers who are interested in really analyzing a movie. I'll have to remember to get the dvd so I can stop the film to search for stuff.

anoriel

I don't know. I didn't play Undertow yet.

Eliasoz_01

I see no evidence of supporting any point you claim to have had. Though I'm certain I'll see more of your attempts to sidestep before I'll ever see you back up your original point about Cloverfield being less-than-average. It seems to be the sort of person you are.

Homard

Mr.SithNinja

I use reason when approaching real-life situations, including judjing the merits of movies. If I were to claim that a movie's script was juvenile, hackneyed, or otherwise poor, I would explain precisely why, instead of simply slapping my opinion down and dismissing rebuttals with childlike defensiveness.

As for Michael Bay, I have a very low opinion of him as a director, but the man knows what people will pay for, and I am willing to bet that he has far more money than you will ever see.

Neither I nor he is an idiot, as you so adamantly claim. I believe that the identity of the real idiot is apparent.

Homard

navvywavvy

indemnitypop

I really like the idea behind it all, greater immersion and "realism," but obviously most of us, our bodies and minds, can't handle the fact that we are sitting perfectly still while whatever we are watching shakes all over the place. The whole sensation is completely unnatural, hence we get sick. I really want to pick up Mario Galaxy and have a go, but after playing games like Prey and even Portal to an extent, I can tell that all the twisting, turning and flipping of perspective will get the worse of me at some point.

Why not include an option to turn excessive screen shaking in some games off. I know you can't do it for a game like Mario Galaxy, but being able to turn off some of the craziness in COD4 would be great.

Southrncomfortjm

L_K_M

russtophiles

Although it's probably nothing like the Cloverfield monster, there really could be something freakin' huge somewhere in the ocean that we haven't found yet. Look up what's being referred to as the "bloop". It was a deep-sea recording of something that was huge. They confirmed that it was biological and that it sounded much larger than a blue whale. Who knows what's in the ocean that we still haven't found?

Sylar

anoriel

underground_slacker

I am for it though =)

SK

ghibli303

Sylar

Silverhammer35

Sabre_Justice: Okay, no more long name.

Irenicus-the one and only

We're the FPS generation. Motion sickness shouldn't even be in our vocabularies.

Eliasoz_01

Jaimz11785

If anything Marathon needed a SHAKIER camera.

On this subject, i'm still waiting for videos of Mirror's Edge. That game would likely have mondo shaky cam for their physical gameplay if it pans out like they describe it.

Also, STALKER is a good point of reference. It's hard to even see wtf is going on when moving at normal speed there, but it never really bothered me.

Sunjammer

I am sorry but everyone keeps calling this a "great monster movie". My point is how can you call it a monster movie when the monster is in only 5 to 10 % of the movie itself?

Granted it has very realistic elements that can draw you in and one great scene where they take off in the chopper and are knocked down(movie should have ended there by the way. It would have been far more realistic than having them ALL survive the crash)but other than that it was a complete waste of time.

Mr.SithNinja

Mr.SithNinja

N-Bomb

Weasel3689

art_zombie

Gouki4u

HollywoodBob

Shiku

That said, I could see using a little more physical camera awareness in games - maybe a Gran Turismo where the 3rd person camera takes little bumps (optionally!) as your car hits ripples and bumps in the road. Maybe a game like Burnout where if you crash, the camera mostly follows you, but is broken off its mounting point and bounces and rolls along with the wreckage (I mean, it doesn't do much good anyway, pointing in the opposite direction of any oncoming opponents until they've escaped you...)

But overall it's hard enough to spot objects in a realistic 3D game displayed in 2D, much less with a camera that shakes all over the place. How about we focus more on FUN design than REALISTIC graphics?

fuchikoma

I keep thinking about the continuation of this story and how presentation will factor in.

I cant help thinking this story should be a game. If the story were to continue as say from the perspective of a ground troop, starting from the point the military is called in to some point passed the original movie's ending. I dont think it should necessarily be played in "shaky cam" but in 1st person for sure. I agree with most of the comments I have read...that in a game...the shaky cam would/could disrupt gameplay, unless done in a subtler kind of way. I am all for immersion, but not distraction. Games already have issues with camera angle problems that luckily developers are correcting.

xnicox

And I loved Gear's camera.

The only sort of camera that could make me feel ill would be one which involved a lot of spinning.

Some parts of Portal when I was trying to turn quickly to fire a portal started to make me feel queasy If I didn't stop after a while.

brent_w

Here in Australia Cloverfield wasn't marketed as a Godzilla movie, it was marketed as a Lost type (used Abrams name well) handycam disaster movie. No images or trailers released here showed any monster. That was the best part of the movie, not knowing what the hell was going on like the people on the tape.

el_rezzo

There's something about that movie that makes it one of the most exciting movies I've seen in years.

fenderfuel08

el_rezzo

d3ath_fly

TRT-X

Would you have preferred if Cloverfield was directed by Michael Bay, got bloated up by another full hour, and shown the PoVs of different people around the world not acting like real people in the slightest? Perhaps if Cloverfield were based on a computer game and directed by Uwe Boll, you could have appreciated it. Or maybe if King Leonidas defeated the monster in one-on-one combat. Or if it had a happy Spielberg-esque "explain everything" ending.

Would it have been better then?

Homard

ZinkO: USA WE DA BEST

PurpleMonkey

King Seafoam

unmarkedone

Posthaus

Toasticus

EightBit

Mr.SithNinja

Don't get me wrong, I loved EDF 2017. It's just that I'd like to see better AI. Of course, EDF would be impossible to beat if all those swarming ants and spiders had advanced AI. Come tot hink of it, I still haven't beaten the whole game. There's a crapload of missions in that game. I kept thinking the game was almost over, then, surprise(!), new mission. Well, I officially have no free time. I'm now splitting my time up between Halo 3, Mass Effect, Assassin's Creed, DOA 4 and EDF 2017.

Sylar

AqueousBeef

RichChap

KM91

3. Some batteries do have a charge out of the package(I'm guessing QA testing?), LI discharge fairly slowly so some charge could be left.

2. Internal bleeding was a huge risk, but it's still a risk not a certainty since no major arteries were apparently broken. Adrenaline could account for some of her behavior but I did find it odd.

1. They keep referring to it as tape, and I missed anywhere in the movie where they say or show what kind of camera it is. They do seem to state it was an SD card at the beginning, and it would write data in files not partially in the way they show. The movie does treat it like a DV tape though. This bothers me the most as if they changed the opening titles it would be fine. It's possible that it did overwrite the file from coney island but some parts of the digital data remained and the images were stitched back in, but that's inconsistent with what was shown because the DOD would have had to have done this and that would be silly.

Ehardergardens

"That was like Half Life only Gordon Freeman didn't kill anything and he Spoke"

stune

Perhaps you were disappointed or felt they left too much unanswered? I think it was incredibly interesting that they told this monster's story through the background of these people trying to survive, and though it was the background, I think it showed everything I wanted to see. I'd take this anyday over the typical hollywood monster movie that usually gets made.

@Akmed: Nuking New York City would be disasterous for surrounding areas due to fall out... they most likely used a chemical fuel bomb at the very end.

Ehardergardens

Think about it....

Mr.SithNinja

8cott

bnpederson

3. Since when do cell phone batteries come fully charged right out of the package? ( when our hero's call battery dies and he "loots" the electronics store with the rest of the hoodlums.

2. They find his woman impaled through the chest, pull her up off of the rebar "spike", and she spends the rest of the movie running around like it's just a scratch. She would have bled out after pulling out the rebar.

1. The basis of the whole movie being shot with a camcorder and having "flashbacks" of a previously recorded event that was "taped over" is impossible considering that the camera they were using in the movie only takes SD CARDS!!! It is impossible to have something "taped over" when using SD cards!! The goddamn movie in the very begining tells you the footage was taken from an SD CARD!!!!

That is just plain bad film making....

Mr.SithNinja

lokey

well, IMO, i thought it made it more realistic. some parts can scare the shit out of you. unlike most movies where the camera's almost never "in the action"

it's a great movie. ending sucked...
and some parts made no sense. like droping 100000 pounds of TNT on it's back won't kill it. WTF?! just nuke it...

Akmed

The trick of course, would be to pick the right moments to do it. For example, if you're just, running and gunning, taking down zombies ever so calmly in say, Half Life 3, it'd be detrimental to have the camera shake all over the place. Though a _very subtle_ jerk might be appropriate when a shotgun or other heavy weapon is fired off.

Reversely, if you're say, jumping from one ledge to another, hitting a little hard, it'd make sense for the camera to wobbly wildly while the character regains his balance and gets back onto his feet. Similarly, if said character isn't even stopping, then said wobble would realistically be even more dramatic.

So, really, for a genre like a first person shooter, it wouldn't take too much to, mimic this effect. I mean, the genre already plays much like a person is running around with a camcorder and gun anyway.

WolvenOne

That and I'm a shaky cam whore. I loved that shit in Bourne Ultimatum.

Ping5000

Secondly, it's Half-Life 2. I don't mean that in a condescending way, but that's the biggest impression I got when I left the theater. It was a continuous journey from Point A to Point B and everywhere in-between with no exposition, great characters, and a great sense of cohesiveness.

Oh, and the rooftop scene (the return trip) was RIDICULOUSLY tense.

Spiffyness

miniboss1232

Although I can't see someone use a tripod or ask screaming people if he could use their shirt for a white balance in Clovey. :-p

GordieHoweHatTrick

A reactionist type game? Bring it on!

huginn

anable

VerasGunn

I think a shakyy cam for an entire game would be really annoying. Sure it works for the "rodeo" cam in Gears of War, but that is because it is only used sparingly in the game. I do like the idea of using it in a limited fashion though. Like diving for cover when you hit a wall a bit of the shakey cam would be cool. Or during explosions and such. All the time though would most like turn the shaky cam into a gimmick that would go down in video game lore with the power glove or CDi. Great sounding ideas, but pulled of in such a way that it's actually a detriment to anything it becomes part of.

lostalaska

EnigmaNemesis

So I highly doubt I can do that (even though other FPS games are fine :P)

That Girl Hates You

Also, I love the fact that after seeing the movie, some people went home and drew the monster then posted the pic on art sites.
Like an profile artist in a line-up. "I think it was the one on the left with seven legs and twenty eyes."

Shinzatsu

CyberSkull

smd31

Mr.SithNinja

So it's not that shaky-cam couldn't b used, it would be a better question of "is there any point?"

The singular exception might be for weapons sights.

thecactusman17

rdj

D00mM4r1n3

ZinkO: USA WE DA BEST

perdevious

And I think the leaders of me throwing up includes Crysis, Far Cry, and Unreal Tournament 3. And lets not forget Halo Trilogy and Quake 1-3

kingme

Taco Bell™

Tony Bullard

*SPOILERS*

Wow I didn't see cloverfield just about the middle of the movie (before I cut it off)

but I liked the idea a lot better when it was called GODZILLA

From what I watched online this movie came off as over-hyped garbage.

I mean I know it's a movie and all but people running around recording the mayhem dropping the camera like 4x's and then it being "found"...

Come on, Batman and Indiana Jones can't come soon enough...

FunKrusher

guy_jin

Xira

ZinkO: USA WE DA BEST

But I'd just had my wisdom teeth out first time I played through that, so maybe it wouldn't seem so home-video second time around.

Xiatter

A phenomenal achievement.

topaz420

I actually have an idea for a Cloverfield MMO. It wouldn't be your typical MMO with the world being pretty consistent. The city would be destroyed cyclicly and you'd start all over again. The monster would attack in a random location every time the game starts another cycle and each character's spawn would be random. I'd say the city could be destroyed weekly or bi-weekly to give people time to eat, sleep and work. There would be a lot of replay value, since every scenario would play out differently, plus achievements for XBOX 360 would get people approaching the game in different ways. The first goal would be to just survive the destruction of the city. The rest would be various other achivements. You could get an achievement for rescuing adding to your party a certain number of people. You could get an achievement for being killd by a spider and getting killed by the monster. There could even be one for specifically getting stepped on. There might be an achievement for being the only surviving member of your party. It would be hard to pull off, but with a little creativity I think they could do it. Giant monster attacks haven't really been explored to their fullest potential in video games, and don't even say EDF or Rampage or any of the Godzilla games. Those are nowhere near what this genre, properly addressed, could be.

Sylar

tazz77

Obviously I voted "No!" on the poll.

J-Fro

Especially the scene where the military just all the sudden show's up from behind.. Awesome movie though.

makemoney

it may be good for FPS, but doubt it...

Akmed

On the subject of shaky-cam in games I have to go with the crowd that says it's fine in moderation.

Maluvin

Allusion is a far better mechanic to obscure the object that obfuscation through shakery.

joeymojo

Hiero Glyph

But if it was as shaky as Blair Witch then no way hose.

dowingba

armchairnixon

brainless

I can't change your experience and make enjoy either of the things, taste is subjective,
but I feel you are being unfair to them.

Ehardergardens

Mr.SithNinja

Briz9

Zombie_Crunch

It's called a dolly. People spent hundreds of thousands of dollars perfecting it, it makes the camera shots look awesome, so people should use it. NO EXCUSES!

And considering 80% of game developers can't get a simple camera right, I think game developers should learn to walk before they try to run.

FunkyJ

PooPooKaKaBumBum

A movie as well done as Cloverfield? Absolutely.

Homard

But if a hundred companines copied and did it for there games,I do believe I would puke sometime down the line.

Shiro_Shishi

Moklomi

infi

Shaky cams are bad. Games shouldn't use them. Same with insane blinking lights during action scenes that make me wish I was having a seizure.

However, small things like with Gears of War's use of it are alright. Entire game full of it is ruins the effect. Maybe if you were the one actually controlling the camera in some weird adventure game it could be acceptible for an entire game.

KirbyMorph

phalanges

WK016

Anyways, I can imagine the whole Pokemon Epileptic Seizure episode happening again, except this time people will be projectile vommiting instead :D.

Phlycheez

HikariOblivion

However, the new Star Trek movie Abrams is making looks awesome.

sascha23

Mr.SithNinja

Shade Malek

Seems like there were games a few years back that even had 'head bob' options, I don't recall it affecting the gun sight though. I don't think a Handicam view being the main view would work to well for most people.

Ehardergardens

Because of the way the human eye and brain work, we don't see things shaking around even if we are moving around rapidly.

Video games generally try to simulate viewing through a human eye, not viewing through a camera. Adding a shakey cam to a game would do absolutely nothing to make a game more enjoyable and it would do absolutely nothing to make a game more realistic.

Luziphir

Issue being that like God of Wars button command whatever it's called system, every other game on earth will use it. (PS: I know God of War didn't come up with it)

So no, it might be a bad idea.

Gigith

Whatever happened to proper cinematography (at least in big-budget films. Many smaller art films are still gorgeous). Just look at Stanley Kubrick's works. His use of the steady-cam has produced some of the most visually stunning films ever. Barry Lyndon is a treat for the eyes.

bysty

GPman

Now if you do something that fits with the camera movement, it totally rocks. Look at Mechwarrior 3 with cockpit rocking, GTA: SA on a motorcycle at high speed in first person, and probably the best use of it: MS Flight Sim X. Hop into an F-18 in the Acceleration expansion and lay into the afterburner. It really looks like your head just sank into the seat. That sort of stuff I love.

Skunky

COD4 does the best job so far that I've seen it simulated.

If developers don't want to go as far as full movement, I would be happy if they added things that you normally wouldn't have any control over. An example, an explosion goes off in front of you, 90% of the peoples first reaction would be to look away or move your arm over your eyes. Its a natural reaction. If they added little things like that they could get away with the Cloverfield look, without the motion sickness problems.

Khabi

bangbangblah

eldunce

kylenalepa

Black_Ops_19

ShaggE

I mean seriously, I get sick on tire swings (yes, I'm that bad) and Cloverfield didn't even make me motion sick in the slightest.

Doomstink

ila

bah. go play Legend of the Seven Paladins and then com back and repost your message ;)

Acunia

Tiger-Fever

geoffcbassett

Moonshadow101

Frame rates is another issue. Even with current hardware, we're still struggling to keep frame-rates as high and smooth as possible. As every generation with 3D has shown us, developers have historically attempted to max out hardware as best to their abilities, so such camera movements would probably digress from the gaming experience rather than make it more unique.

mr_dimsum

I read a blurb in the Half-Life 2 book about how they had a tester who was especially sensitive to motion sickness, and he became their vomit-meter as they worked on the game. IIRC, he particularly influenced how they handled the Route Kanal vehicle segments. I wish all developers were as conscientious.

Still breaks my heart to think about Okami...

Campion of Drymouth

MeanMF

Wasn't the problem with Marathon the field of view? I thought that was it, not a shaky camera.

That type of thing never makes me sick, and after about ten minutes of the Marathon demo, I had to stop, as I actually started to feel pretty queasy.

prmononoke

It's strange, I only get a headache when I'm watching a highly active camera which I have no control over. Odd how the brain works, isn't it?

Sugoi

I don't understand why everyone is pissed off at the shaky cam in cloverfield. The camera man is an actual character, the shakyness goes along with his character and the situation. It makes the story more realistic and believable. If you get motion sick from anything that isn't on a tripod, gtfo of 2008.

Nessman

A group of us saw it Saturday night. One of my friends did come down with a case of the Cloverfields ... he made it about half way through, when he got up and ran out. I believe he did make it to the restroom, so no mess to clean up from the theatre staff. So if you get motion sickenss and really want to see this EXCELLENT film, pop some dramamine before hand.

icarusprime

Shaky cameras are fine when you're just watching, but implementing it as something to take into account in a hectic firefight where you've got your hands full taking cover from bullets and taking potshots already - it's just annoying.

Anyways

liquid_kore

iamnotdryad

teh_joe

I think its a good mechanic to have, but it can't be overdone.

GM08

Zonderic