Azza

agentofdoom

There is a difference between progressing a game and hacking it to bits by making it like every other game out there. The game you discribed has already been made, it's called Tales of Symphonia. And while it is a great game and one of my personal favorites, it's no Zelda, nor do I want it to be.

Let's go through you points one by one. Link talking. Awful idea. This is one of those things people only think they want, but will do nothing but bitch if they get it. The reason is simple, everyone has an idea of what Link should sound like. And I'll bet you any amount of money you can ask 100 people and get 100 different answers on this one. Giving a character voice isn't so cut and dry as people think. There are a ton of things to consider: age of the speaker, background, diolect, accent, word choice, attitude, emotions, and plenty more. I'm a Texas girl, so TP link having a southern drawl wouldn't bother me a bit, but how would you feel about it? And while we could probably all conceed that he is of reasonable intellgence, but as a farm boy in a dark-age setting, he probably wouldn't be highly educated. So it is well with in reason for Link to sound like a back water hick, but do you really, honestly think that would go over well? I certianly don't.

Second, a larger story. I can kind of see what you want here, but remember Zelda is not an RPG, it's an action/adventure game. It's meant to be simple and straight forward story line wise. By introducing a long complicated story, you'd have to break up the action/adventure part; and thus defeating the very idea of what Zelda is.

Third, change the story. Yes, Zelda is formulaic, but seeing as it is a formula that has made a generation of fans, it clearly works. But the game you are discribing here is Tales of Symphonia, seriously, you'll love it. It's on the GC and the PS2.

Four, no hearts. Seriously? Why on earth would you get rid of this? Collecting all the hearts is one of the best parts. There are whole guides to this very subject. Clearly, the majority like this part.

Fifth, continuity. Part of Zelda's charm is it's lack of continuity. If Zelda depending on continuity, the you probably wouldn't have enjoyed TP. As by your own admission you haven't played a game since LttP. That would mean you would have been missing 3 games worth of information. It would be like trying to pick up "Return of the King" without have read "The Hobbit," "The Fellowship of the Ring," or "The Two Towers." You'd have no idea what was going on, who anyone was, why they were important, or how you got where you are and why you were there. the lack of a definitive story line makes the game more accessable. That way people new to the series or those who have missed a game here or there, can pick it up and play without spending hours on the internet figuring out what the bloody hell is going on.

So there you have it, my 2000 words on why the series doesn't need to be ruined by becoming just another RPG.

EmeraldDragon

Then again... "I can't wait to bomb some dodongos!"

Insomnia Bob

I'm not talking about removing everything that makes Zelda great. I'm saying, take what makes Zelda great, and improve on it. (You might have missed that somewhere in the 20,000 word essay. I seriously don't blame you.) I'm not knocking the franchise, it's one of my favorites. I just don't think that Zelda has reached a peak. I want the people making the next Zelda game to do more than make it look prettier and come up with some kooky new mechanic for me to master.

At the very least, I think you have to give me my point about the 'silent protagonist' thing getting old.

Insomnia Bob

jonr21

So youw ant to take away all that makes Zelda what it is and turn it into just another RPG? If you want RPGs there are ton and half out there, so there is no reason to ruin Zelda for those of use who love it just the way it is.

The truth of the matter is that fans rarely know what they really want. After WW, for example, people bitched and whined about the art style and how it wasn't OOT enough. So they got TP, then they bitched and whined that it was too much like OOT.

Let's face it. Zelda has made Nintendo filtthy rich over it's life time. It has thousands, if not hunreds of thousands, of fans world wide. Clearly they have found a formula that doesn't just work but might as well print money. Why should they trade in their cash cow to be just another sheep?

EmeraldDragon

Exkabad

Norellicus

cheeseboybeans

Perhaps not for two year. But looking at recent history shows that Mario Galaxy, Metroid Prime 3, and Smash Brothers were all slated to be launch titles for Wii - as recently as 6 months before the Wii was launched. Two of them made it to the 1 year mark, the other is going 3 months past if current release dates are to be believed.

If my saying 2 years, when it was really closer to 1 year is the difference between what starts others in on personal attacks and a quiet day on Kotaku; then I truly apologize.

OrionTheSmiter

Insomnia Bob

tasty%20crabcakes.">coffeeguy

Hoboman725

Roflcopter_Down: Wants you to follow HIM!

Twlight Princess, however, was what I'd always wanted in a Zelda game. A realistic art style, an epic story, fleshed out characters, gigantic boss battles, the works. Sure, it unleashed Link as a wolf onto deviant art (Rule #34!), but all in all, I thought it was a good title.

Now having said that, yes, it's a rehash of every Zelda game. Ever. Except this time, instead of having a magic mirror, or an ocarina, or a boat, you turn into a wolf. And while they put a much higher gloss on the game this time around, and actually tried to tell something of a story instead of just linking together dungeons, I have to admit I'd really like for them to shake things up a bit.

Here's what I would do if it were up to me:
First, do away with Link as a silent protagonist. Give that boy some speaking lines. He doesn't have to talk a lot, I suppose. The whole idea behind having a silent protagonist is to allow a suspension of disbelief, to let the player insert himself in the place of his in-game avatar. When we've gotten to the point in Twilight Princess where you're showing Link's reactions and emotions but he still doesn't SAY anything, it's just silly. It's like watching a movie where one of the main characters is a mute, but no one ever acknowledges that, and everyone always seems to know what he's saying.

Second, no more single installments. Take the story in a new direction. And, most importantly, BUILD on that story in future releases. In fact, it would be wise to plan on producing a trilogy of games, perhaps 'coding sequentially', giving a nod to the tactic employed recently by film studios to put out three big budget movies (LOTR, Matrix, Star Wars 1-3, etc) in three years at reduced cost.

Third, new story. Everyone always worries about alienating fans when you do this, but Zelda has the opposite problem. Zelda hasn't changed it's story ENOUGH in the last ten years. This isn't Prince of Persion: Warrior Within we're talking about. Even so, keep some of the iconic set pieces, but try to diverge (or better yet, expand) existing Zelda cannon.
At the heart of every Zelda story has been the plot: Link, a young boy, must fight monsters and collect magical treasures to save a princess (and his home). That's a good place to start. But how about bulding Hyrule as an actual nation? Give it a King, a Queen, nobles, an order of Knights, a Church, and have these factors play off one another.
Perhaps the new story could center (at first) around a war between Hyrule and an aggressive desert nation. Link's quiet forest town exists on the border between these two nations, dramatic raid of village ensues. Have the early plot of the game focus specifically on the narrow picture, you have to save your village/friend/horse from the evil soldiers. Along the way, you discover a magical artifact that gives you a significant advantage over the 'bad guys'. While this is going on, sprinkle in some foreshadowing about the larger plot: an evil force (who may or may not resemble a pig) is playing Hyrule and (southern desert nation) against each other. He has an agent close to the throne, who is subtley try to convince the King to undo some seal or another to "win the war", thus freeing big bad evil from his eternal prison. You stumble across this plot, confront the evil cultist guy in an attempt to prevent catastrophe. You travel across Hyrule, visit various dungeons, fight boss monsters, etc. Eventually, you slay the evil sorcerer before he can complete his dastardly plan, and help end the war.
As the trilogy progresses, you realize that the sorcerer wasn't working alone. Maybe a trusted ally from the first game turns out to be another cultist in the final installment. Eventually, the story leads you on an epic quest to retrieve the Master Sword, and slay the dark god/giant pig/theif forever. But not before he's unleashed upon Hyrule, and you get to see all kind of dramatic scenes of devastation heaped upon familar locations.

The main difference between the plot I've outlined above and every other Zelda games is that it has human enemies. Yes, you've also fight lots of monsters and bomb dodongos and what have you, but there will also be evil people you need to fight. Because at the end of the day, we make better villains.

As far as gameplay goes, there's not much here you should mess with. Mechanically, some more in depth RPG elements would probably help the series if you were going to do a three game epic, perhaps a more robust inventory system, maybe switch from a big giant heart bar to a big heart with numbers in it.
Keep the combat basics more or less the same from Twilight Princess, but add another level of complexity. Scale the game so that you can win by circle dodging and shaking the controller violently, but add some more depth to it to keep the more skilled audience interested (for that matter, don't underestimate kids). Make it easier to switch weapons on the fly, and add in some more robust combat animations. A system for sword parrying, where you deflect an enemy's strike with your sword or shield, would be delightful.
Make better use of the Wii's motion controls. Replacing 'hit a to attack' with 'shake wii-mote to attack' isn't a vast improvement. Obviously, there are limits to what you can do, but it shouldn't be that hard to seperate from horizontal and vertical swings. Maybe even differentiate between high and low attacks on the horizontal axis. It'd make a hell of a lot more sense than holding down a button on my 'shield arm' to do a special move.

Well, that's my Zelda rant. Shake it up a little. People are going to buy it no matter what you do with a Zelda game. At least this way you're going to be moving the series forward, instead of putting it on a prettier treadmill.

And think of it this way, Metroid survived the shift to FPS. I'm pretty sure Zelda can survive the shift to continuity.

Insomnia Bob

AlpengeistOS

I'll agree to disagree. While I can see a LoZ movie being great in concept, I think the consessions that would have to be made to make it work would cause the lose of what makes LoZ...well, LoZ. To each their own though.

EmeraldDragon

'ogoromiwoyamiruhomi gamomi umofuraramirumemi remu orumaraminn amagumirugagiwomi'

I can't make heads or tails out of it. These all correspond to sounds in the Japanese language, but I can't find a single Japanese word in the sentence. And the only possible particle I see is Wo, no Ni, Ha, Ga, or De. On top of that there is a repeated n, which is very rare in Japanese. I could be showing how little I know about the language, but I do not think this is Japanese.

JRONJR

Of course there would have to be concessions made to make the movie good, though. Ask any comic book readin' geek about that.

MR. FAP☆FAP!

SSJPabs

appledumplingsfromhell

a) It's now been a year since TP. That's a lot of dev time for a game that still hasn't launched and could've been started a couple years ago

b) Remember TP was a really Cube game, not a Wii game. I'm sure Nintendo had intentions to make a Wii-native title and as such would've started development on it from the get-go.

c) There was an IGN article many months ago that mentioned a closed-doors conversation that supposedly let slip some details that they're making a more mature, darker Link

eponym

In all seriousness, I'm about 85% certain that the next Zelda game will be a more lighthearted, although not as cartoony as WW, Zelda where the Wiimote is used in a similar fashion to the stylus in Phantom Hourglass. To get more specific, I'd expect they're trying to make it not require the nunchuck, and feature a character design for Link similar to Oracle of Ages/Seasons.

Reneg

"Who will restore the dreams if not you?"

Paragon

Josh*

Second, it doesn't matter whether you're a Nintendo fan or happy with the quality of their games or whatever, you still come off as a smart ass by making such an exaggerated statement as "Nintendo likes to pretend their next game will take 6 months, and then delay it 7 times over 2-3 years." We're not psychic to know whether you're trying to make a good point with such a horrible statement. Give me one instance where Nintendo announced a game would take 6 months and delayed it 7 times over 2-3 years and I'll gladly take back everything I said.

And third, "which is a fact that he seemed to confirm in his fit of verbal outrage." I don't believe you know what the definition of a fact and an opinion is.

Green-clad Gamer Dude

mferrari

captronj

*Looks at earring*

Azza

Fedule

is what I got, trying to translate it into Romaji.

@Twin-Brome: What do you mean by "I realized they were just typing everything in English..."?

OMG, I'm excited xD

Azza

"Experience the Challenge of Endless Adventure"

I also checked the html for the page and found this message:

"Who will restore the dreams if not you?"

Hope that helps.

Twin-Brome

I'm quite happy with the quality of Nintendo products, but when they offer a release date, one should probably take it with a grain of salt.

OrionTheSmiter

Personally, I'm throwing my hat in with Fan Film. I don't think Zelda is the kind of game that will translate well to film, not even if done professionally; at least not without butchering the characters. Because for all the bitching that goes on about the lack of voice acting, everyone knows (even if they won't admit it), that Link won't be Link if he spoke.

EmeraldDragon

kuzuboshii

tomrutters

JRONJR

That's... helpful.

Dishliquid

Atamisk726

@OrionTheSmiter: Seriously though, he's right. Lair seems to reek of being rushed, while Nintendo polishes nearly everything to hell. A FEW exceptions aside... *glares at Pokemon Ranch, winces*

Sabre_Justice: Okay, no more long name.

I'm a Nintendo fan, and you... are an asshole. Keep it in your pants next time cowboy before you go blowing your load for no good reason.

To rest of Kotaku: I thought they took care of these people on Mondays?

OrionTheSmiter

kathartik

Nessman

Kuro

So, I threw what I had translated into AltaVista's Babel Fish - no luck, as I expected. So, one of the following is true: 1 - that text translates to spoken sounds that aren't meant to be written or 2 - what's written on the site is total gibberish... and the 'GoDaddy' bit is very suspicious.

I have no way of being able to tell, seeing as I don't know Japanese, but I know one of the Editors sequestered in Kotaku Tower does. Maybe they'll take a look; see below.

According to this site: [www.omniglot.com]

The Hylian text translates to:

'ogoromiwoyamiruhomi gamomi umofuraramirumemi remu orumaraminn amagumirugagiwomi'

^_^

TheCakeIsALie

sketchturner

Nerdelphia

Wiitbred

www.zod2008.com

Tenshigami

...

"Twilight Princess will be the 'last Zelda of its kind' according to Miyamoto"

TheTheTheTheWhat

ThisCharmingMan

But it just doesn't Look like the quality of a zelda game. I donno.

tvo

Where have you been? He rolls as G-dorf now. XD

Mrobinson587

Some facts that probably don't mean anything but:
-Nintendo seems to prefer using pngs, the image on this page is a jpg;
- xhtml declarations for the page are not consistent with official Nintendo sites; and
- the description tag "Who will restore the dreams if not you?" is just so... shitty fansitish.

The only thing in its favor is that any Wii-based Zelda title - following the dating established by OOT/MM - would be 2 years after Twilight Princess was released, which DOES mean 2008...

Mario's Pants

(at least, not the good ones...)

Wyld

BrianD

....times up.

CanadianZero

Kado

rocsflight

PeterQC

Green-clad Gamer Dude

That said however, the delay of Twilight Princess was certainly an unforgivable one. Despite their claim to delay it to work on it longer, it's painfully obvious that the game must have already been finished and all they really did was work on making the Wii version of the game.

Green-clad Gamer Dude

rasenganchidori

OrionTheSmiter

CancerMan

red

It's a shame, really. I was totally looking forward to seeing Link's pores. :D

BambooCactus

GA MO ME

U MO FU RA RA MI RU ME

RE MU

O RU MA RA MI N N

A MA GU MI RU GA GI WO MI

Someone needs to transliterate it from Kana to English.

Gigahedgehog

And, in fact, in Japan, there was a translation guide IN THE OFFICIAL INSTRUCTION BOOK.

I'll translate if later, if no one else has, if it's not just a bunch of jibberish, but I have to leave in about 1 minute...

Here's the script:
[www.omniglot.com]

And the first part, I think, reads
ogoromiwoyamiruhomi
オゴロミヲヤミルホミ

MasaMuneCyrus

soggymuppet

udbdum2

Green-clad Gamer Dude

udbdum2

Green-clad Gamer Dude

Otaconnachos

Majorasblaze

AMonkey

HOVA

It's fun, sure, won't deny that. But it was the same exact thing we've been getting out of Mario since the 1980's.

@mferrari: I was totally serious with that translation, obviously.

Kirbytheslayer: In-Kirby XMB

It is not anything official. I'm also surprised they were able to get the domain. I thought it looked a lot like the fanmade live-action Zelda movie, that looked interesting but is most likely something that people should not spend money on. It's probably just a hoax though. That's enough about the article...

Hylian was originally not a language, ala Link to the Past were it was just random syllables. Then, it was created for Ocarina of Time for random stuff, basically a stylized japanese. It can be read by those who know japanese and what was changed, for example, the bands on Kotume and Kotake, which spelled their names. Then as it should be obvious to anyone who played Wind Waker, it was altered quite a bit more from japanese and actually translated to what it did in the second time around. So it's not just fans making stuff up, which they did from time to time anyway.

Worse things have been done with Tolkien by the way. Speaking all kinds of elvish, praticing dwarvish script. On the topic, I say if one good fan (with a life) can notice things and be able to know if it's possible to even read it, cool. Heck, they wrote it out with a font, it's not complete nerd bs.

It's strange to say that only nerds like Zelda. Since Link to the Past, it has one of the best mythologically based stories (albeit very similar stories) of any video game, copied openly by Sony and Microsoft. Twilight Princess was disapointing, but not unsatisfying. By the way, Miyamoto himself said that the next Zelda would be like nothing we have previously encountered. Happy now?

Besides, is there anyone who has played any of the early Zelda games at least once, especially Ocarina of Time, who isn't excited by a Zelda built from the ground up with Wii graphics and controls?

TheTheTheTheWhat

walkman1022

Actually my girlfriend loves that I know Hylian/Hyrulian.

Thanks. :D

Scottendo

SpikeSpiegel

Green-clad Gamer Dude

New Hylian:
[www.omniglot.com]
Old Hylian:
[www.omniglot.com]

Dishliquid

immelmann

MR. FAP☆FAP!

Accordion

As for the site in question: It reminded me of the forcibly terminated Chrono Resurrection project for some indeterminate reason. They likely share the same fate.

And I'll add my voice to the chorus of Zelda dissenters. While I greatly enjoyed Twilight Princess - the fight against Argorok is probably my favorite boss battle in series history and perhaps of all time - it was very much a formulaic experience. The same can be said of Wind Waker, an fantastic game in its own right whose setting - a veritable waterworld - proved to be both its best and worst enemy. The question then becomes what alterations Nintendo must make to re-invigorate this series. Some might contend that Phantom Hourglass is a pristine example of adopting an antiquated franchise onto modern hardware and compellingly engendering the technological advances present in such a leap. I'm not entirely sure if I'd welcome such an assertion with open arms.

It seems that the fundamental issue underpinning any substantial overhaul of the Zelda franchise lies within choosing where to break with the considerable historical foundation that Nintendo has established in the last two decades. For more than a few of us, the Legend of Zelda is just that - legendary. It, like all creations which have attained mythic, precedes those whom it attracts. A question can be culled from this argument - what is quintessential Zelda? And, if Zelda is to progress, then does it not have to overhaul these things or leave them behind completely? If it is truly "mythic" then it's influence (in this case, gameplay influences) should be widespread, perhaps tiresomely so. Is this the case? ...I digress. The issues of mythology are many and varied, and can't possibly be given just exposition in this single post.

Of course, I doubt that Nintendo is tirelessly poring over these issues because, when all is said and done, we'll still purchase the next Zelda simply because it bears that illustrious title. If we're lucky, we'll get the Wii equivalent of Phantom Hourglass, the same essential gameplay experience obfuscated by a new means of interacting with the game world itself. (And, if I'm a cynic, then I suggest that this is the only possibility.) Maybe this isn't a patently BAD thing, but it isn't entirely fulfilling either.

Intellectualdiot

but my Hyrulian is not as good as it once was. :P

sadkermit - soon to be banned for standing up to the ummm nazi.

HigglyPiggly

Asclepius

PeterQC

DeadHex

Unless of course you think Nintendo is planning on using CGI during their next Zelda game. Which, for some reason, I'm doubting.

@Moonshadow101:
Thank you, I'll file this claim next to "the world is flat".

@billybastion:
Wow, someone has self esteem issues.

Volcan

It may be some fan fiction, because I bet anyone who's handy with 3d modeling and photoshop could come up with that.

Vegeta

thedogandthecat

gdf

TRT-X

agentofdoom

Hoboman725

[Dextr]

Mascott

fnool

and zelda has gone downhill, because of greedy ass nintendo!

death_is_the_spice_of_life

Furious_Liver

I mean, PAPYRUS? Jesus fuck; honestly. Let's not even consider that the background images look like something pasted from a recent Final Fantasy cutscene.

fnool

ridley282

Hoboman725

Moonshadow101

CrimemasterGogo

On the other hand, there were a lot of rumors a couple years ago about a Zelda game for the Wii deep in development to be released in 2008.

In any case, if it's not Nintendo, their lawyers are going to have some fun come Monday.

Nathan24

only fanboys (nerds) still play it :)

death_is_the_spice_of_life

awwwweeesssfuuckkkyyooouuuunintendo....

TP sucked balls. Ocarina 1.1 + animal form ripped from majora.

worst. 3d. zelda. ever.

death_is_the_spice_of_life

reddevil

Translated into Japanese katakana it seems to make no sense (though honestly I don't know the language, this stuff is just the result of the last 20 mins of research online). It seems to me that the syllabary was chosen to look good, and not say anything, though maybe someone that knows katakana can say for sure.

Translated: オゴロミヲヤミルホミ ガモミ ウモフララミルメミ ムム オルマラミンン アルグミルガギヲミ

(NOTE: the above translation could be backwards since I've read that sometimes Hylian is translated into japanese backwards, so who knows.. and wow I'm suprised that there is so much info on this on the net)

lostatsea

[www.escapistmagazine.com] says it best, while saying alot.

Kayin

Twilight Princess on the other hand is based on our roman alphabet.

Andune

mferrari

It means they have their gamertag linked with their Bungie.net profile.

noisome07

WebScud

It looks more like Windwaker style but some of the letters in that text doesnt exist...

Andune

mferrari

"magoromiwoyaruhomi gamomi umofuraramirumemi remu orumaraminn amagumirugagiwomi"

Don't know what that means...

[www.omniglot.com]

rbelmont000

i sir, appreciate your wit. thank you for being normal.

billybastion

either way you need to wake up and realize learning fake languages isnt cool and no one cares you know it/about it.

billybastion

tvandlust

Moonshadow101

StopTheOncoming

I jest, of course :P

Ichidou

yamiiguy

[www.kasuto.net]

Thats what I know.

Scottendo

Scottendo

I lol'd. Hard.

Sqwerell

cheetos82

The main reason I'd find this hard to believe to be a true Nintendo website is because I'd imagine the new Zelda is going to be released in around 2009 or 2010. Ninty likes to take their sweet time.

JibbyJam

I wouldn't mind seeing that. It's well overdue.

Buttah

blehh

Koji Otaku

Well the before it was called triforce, it was a logo for some 70's porn company *Get why miymoto used it ;3*

Sailorcancer

RJdog

Kfizz311

Kirbytheslayer: In-Kirby XMB

Crazy_Buffet_Happens

Tom_Murphy

Thrash16

Vidunder

redgopher

Truepatriot

DaiMacculate

SuperMekman

=O

Fadakar