@CollapseControl: youve really gotta get a job for MS one day, really. There's no way you should be this way for them for free.

@Scuba Steve: thank you, theyre not sold out this month. joystiq's retarded.

@Ultima08: why is no one else seeing this? yeah, the Motorstorm bundle will be the only SKU in a few/however many months. jesus.

here's to hoping for clarification today to put all those who somehow believe they truly wanna have one system back at $600, because that's how businesses work.

TheIrishNinja

Kaminari

They are cutting them out because they will be the last with PS2 backwards compatibility. The 80GB will come with the emulation software, saving them money in the process.

Mr. 47

The only way for Sony to fuck this up even more is if they have an "elite of an elite" somewhere else down the line before 7 more months from now. Seriously, how cheezed would you be if, come 2007 Holiday season, you see "Playstation 3 Ultimate Edition - Includes Killzone 2 with expanded 120GB Hard Drive! - $599" which goes on to phase out the current 80GB model? (This is all a hypothetical situation, I'm making this shit up.) I know I'd be pissed. How pissed I'd be would depend on which model I owned. 20GB, not so much, but if I had a 80GB version, I'd be REALLY pissed.

lushen124

Samos42

k4polo

k4polo

interstate78

What the hell do you think car dealerships do when the new models roll onto the showroom?

They have now >3< models about to float around in warehouses. It is hurting them. The 20GB and 60GB variation, hurt them.

What do you do? Easy. Price cut existing models, effectively eradicating them from the shelves and introduce your new model into spectrum before the holiday. Where you can offer another price elimination or incentive to buy.

What is so difficult to understand about that?

Patient

Debunked!!!!!!!!

nuck44

I honestly don't see what the uproar is all about. I do think all this confusion is unnecessary.

If sony can't sell it to you don't buy it. No one is putting a gun to your head. As long as they have 31 other people to fill the warhawk servers then it's all gravy baby.

Heihachi.vs.Kazuya

Jason R

this just about makes me take back EVERYTHING positive I've said about Sony in the past couple of days....

Enigma_20XX

All this means to me is I won't be getting one.

Oceaniax

My thoughts exactly. I still think that they're just phasing out the emotion engine models so they can begin importing the emulation models.

alucard_0007

Touy

Ultima08

That being said, we've known about this since they've introduced the software emulation that it would be applied to North America. Surprise isn't something you should be experiencing right now.

We've got the memories of a goldfish around here.

Scuba Steve

...

I'm sorry, I think my brain just locked up trying to get my head around that thought.

TRT-X

Doomstink

rojo

Collapse The Control

Skeep

So Motorstorm is worth $100 suddenly? What a bargain!

-Jeff
[alinktothefuture.com]

leshrac55

Dimipapa

Only in the sense of "water proof", i.e. it's proofed so that the future can't touch it.

@Huginn:
Did someone say bait and switch?
Oh you'll have your price drop, but we are no longer supporting the price dropped system.

Bait and switch, that's just what it is.
They're probably thinking that the average guy will say: "I just wanted to buy the 60GB one for $500, but it's sold out... oh well. I'll just take the 80GB version, the whopping 20GB more are easily worth the surcharge of $100! Nevermind that they crippled it at the same time by removing the Emotion Engine, I'll just trash my vast PS2 games library."

Curiously enough, "Full PS/PS2 backward compatibility from day 1" was announced as the most important Key Feature back then by Sony:
[s2.supload.com]
I wonder which other key features they'll cut next just to make more money...

MajoShinpan

Sony creates an non-bundled 80GB model and prices it at 499.99 before the holiday season. Microsoft responds in kind by dropping the HD-DVD addon to 99.99, the Core SKU to 199.99, the Premium SKU to 299.99, but leaves the Elite at 479.99, justifying the cost by including the HD-DVD player with the Elite.

This is where I think we're heading because those price points would put Microsoft in better competition with Nintendo and having an Elite system with a bundled HD-DVD at 479 would put them in a better position to compete with Sony as the Elite would then boast similar features, except it would be HD-DVD instead of Blu-ray.

Captiosus

teh_bear

Dolgo

Dimipapa

What? I don't understand why they do this when one the appeals of a PS3 is usable with any USB HDD. The HDD size of a PS3 is the one fucking thing I don't care about, just make the system cheaper! They must make money on this bullshit.

Xiedo

theK

Dolgo

rodsky

pecks

This announcement virtually guarantees a rush to get the last PS3s at a good price and with the good BC.

When all those are sold out, Sony gets to make a model with a more efficient process and sell it at the old price we've come to hate and abhor.

However, it the new games and features induce more people to buy, they can recover more of their losses than they otherwise could.

Now (here's the "hypothetical" that I think is a certainty), if the 80 gig is only selling like the other model was at 600, Sony can reduce the price to $500 and make it seem like ANOTHER price drop, even though it isn't. This WILL happen this year, and it will work to keep Sony in the game just a bit longer.

Brilliant.

LedRush

rodsky

D00mM4r1n3

RolexDPracer

Dimipapa

Dolgo

Perhaps it's a bit harsh to say at this point, but I hope it buries them.

mphz

Let's just hypothetically say they DON'T move a non-bundled 80GB to the 499 price point. For 599, you're getting 20GB of space and Motorstorm, sure, but you're also getting a highly inferior form of backwards compatibility. The stronger backwards compatibility is in the current 499, 60GB model which is now discontinued according to SCE President Hirai.

So, we're back to the original price point (or 100 dollars more, depending on how you look at it), for 20GB more space and a game, but ultimately an inferior product (since it was Playstation who pioneered backwards compatibility in the first place)? That is seriously going to anger a LOT of people.

Captiosus

Dolgo

MaximuM_MayheM

javajoe96

MajoShinpan

majortom1981

Random1512

I can't believe Sony would offer a $499 model twice, and both times discontinue the unit after a few months.

Starcade

Dolgo

Guys, it's NOT a conspiracy. I really think this guy doesn't give 2 craps about the US market and wants to say whatever will sell in his market. 5 years from now there will be a tell-all book by former PS executive who says that it was cut-throat and we knocked each other down to get ahead, blah blah.

But I don't know if it is true or not; it is obvious he wants to make his market look better.

Spoony Bard

Dolgo

For those too lazy to watch:

KAZ HIRAI: "Well, again, just from a hardware perspective, the 499 dollar price adjustment that we did for the 60 GB version, for the american market, uh, we're no longer in production for that product, so uh once that product is gone from the retailer shelves, then we're back to the $599 SKU only, so it's not like we have a two price strategy here in the US market. We found out very early on, you know, consumers react mostly to just having one SKU as opposed to two."

Irish.Exile

SomeRandomGuy

Sony must be keeping their executives stocked with some top-of-the-line drugs.

erlik

Zanch

Dear Sony, this is what we call a "lose-lose".

If they phase out the 60GB model then move a standalone 80GB model into the same price point within a month or two, they'll piss off the consumers who ran out and bought the 60GB model not knowing this news.

If they phase out the 60GB model and don't move a standalone 80GB model into the 499 price point, they'll piss off consumers who were finally considering getting a PS3.

I'm convinced Sony has no real idea what the hell they're doing. Right Hand does a price cut and gets positive press, for a change. Left Hand decides to discontinue the price cut edition leaving only the 599 bundle in place, destroying the positive press before E3 is even over.

Meantime, Microsoft and Nintendo laugh all the way to the bank.

Captiosus

Phenix

Rintor

Jonn

meet the new price, same as the old price...

...won't get fooled again

(apologies to The Who)

kasplat

Dolgo

robinhood1013

Aex

From Kaz's mouth himself at the end of interview, its in German but interview is English. Incredible.

Dolgo

Grael4

sklav

If you have a problem with a company lowering the price of a product or improving it, the solution is simple: buy a premium 360. Same price and hardware since November of 2005.

crackp1pe

StrikerGold

Grael4

Tarv

He's talking about the cost of the Blu-Ray disc, manual and packaging. Once the game is finished, that's really the only cost to Sony other than distribution, which doesn't apply to a pack-in.

aka Bitter

They're not cutting the price, they're raising the specs.

In other words, they're doing the exact opposite of what everybody wants on the presumption that everyone will buy their hardware in the long run anyway and they'll make cartloads of money selling downloadable content.

Yea, hubris! Yea, Sony!

erlik

Phenix

alucard_0007

Though like I say, I'd rather have my 60GB with Emotion Engine.

Phenix

Yes everyone would be pissed because then those who get the 60gb non bundle are being ripped off aren't they!

penhalion

Why, oh why, in the HELL would an executive shoot his own company in the foot like this?

Probably because the will have the 80GB standalone at the price of the 60GB in a few short months, and yes, they are likely selling out the 60GB since it's the last of the old guard...

It seems to me with Papa Ken out of control, they're going to try and correct the past mistakes of two SKUs, consolidate it into one unit...

My money?

$449 80GB standalone
$549 80GB bundle

November.

Evil J

Grael4

Grael4

Then again, ALOT of the old models did not sell, so they should still be there to buy collecting dust.

However, I see no logic in the huge price difference between the old model and the. 100 dollars doesnt equal 20g. Thats just highway robbery! And with announcment it seems like your trying to gouge the consumer.

Kenoji

Grael4

As for everyone who's saying "well, the 80GB model could drop $100 if they take out motorstorm"...comon. Games are worth nothing. If they took out the pack in they'd save about $2 on each package.

james castle

Webdemon

Sony wasn't even going to let the US consumers know....just let the 60GB PS3 fade away.

Oh wait...they did that with the 20GB PS3 too.

Queasy

I'd be really upset if i was a kid saving up 499 wishing to get a ps3 by christmas to be burned by not having them available anymore. Ouch!

blahism

velvet396

Looking at all the comments here you can tell the majority of consumers are idiots who know nothing about costs of manufacturing.

Everything Irishninja says is true.

80 GB HDD are cheaper to produce than 60 GB HDD. The extra tape is negligible (your looking at maybe 10 cents more money), what counts is is quantity being produced. Sony uses off the shelf HDD, not propritory (which MS uses). Being that, the 10 cents per magnetic tape drive is actually dwarfed by the costs of having to have an assembly line (printing, putting together, employee pay) dedicated to a 60GB HDD as they are no longer produced by contractors for sale to the retail market. Basically said, they pay 10 cents more for magentic tape totalling the cost of maybe about a few hundred thousand dollars vs. the cost of paying a few million dollars to actually have an assembly line dedicated to making something that isn't made anymore.

Also, you guys are forgetting the 5 free blu-ray movie deal. It ends when Summer ends which is conviently when the 60GB PS3s are expected to be out of stock.

Yes, for the less educated comsumer, it looks like your getting ripped off if you buy in now but for the tech savvy consumer who can weigh it all in, the best deal is actually now with the 60 GB HDD.

The reason for the "limited" bundle with Motorstorm is to give a perceived cheaper pack and some buffer time while the 60GB is phased out (in case it does not go fast).

Buy now get 5 free movies, buy later get 20 more gigs is how they are attempting to portray things to the general audience.

Also in terms of "buying exclusives". I think they arn't paying money directly. Instead they are probably giving huge volume discounts on the blu-ray discs (remember the costs of these things?) and probably a break on liscensing fees. The benefit to Sony is two-fold. First it saves a publisher a good chunk of change which is like giving money away (for those big hits or hopeful big hits) without actually giving money away (they normally make cash on selling blu-ray discs to publishers and it looks better for the balance sheets, smaller revenue but also lower expenses), second, the more they make blu-ray discs, the cheaper it gets to make in the long run.

Sony is making many crude decisions that while you may not see the complete benefit of really does benefit the bottom line of Sony a lot.

angry_gamer

Oh you'll have your price drop, but we are no longer supporting the price dropped system.

huginn

PENI_MASTA

Yeah, the Dille interview was offensive but I could see how Sony execs are getting frustrated with the situation. It's mostly their own fault but I know it hurts the pride when you deliver a superior console but it gets shitted on every week regardless of what you do. Only to have the DS and the Wii beating your ass on two fronts with grossly inferior tech. Then you have MS puffing their chest up a faulty console, a nickel and dime strategy and a plan to release the 360 a year earlier to forget about the 4 billion dollar stinkhole that was the Xbox. Karma man....karma.

Striderhayasa - Phillyyakk on PSN and Live.

ビッグ ボス

Blinded220

TheIrishNinja

BigWeather

Though really like I said before, doubt Sony is going to sell out of all their 60gb units by September, from the sales vs. shipped number, theres a lot of 60gb models left on the market and even with doubled sales, its going to take probably 4 or more months to sell out of the old 60gb units.

Kyle81

I mentioned the cheap pricepoint. Yes, the 60gb bundle at $500 is probably a better value than the elite at $480 (60gb more vs. Blu-Ray -- no brainer) but there is a difference between "cheap" and "value".

My wife hears five hundred and it's "wuh?!". Less and not so much. I'm sure many people are in this boat -- even if the PS3 had Blu-Ray, HD-DVD, a 200gb drive, and came with rumble controllers $600 is just out of the amount they are willing to spend. The value would be through the roof, though. But a $1M mansion reduced from $1.5M may be a steal, but I still ain't going to change my notion that houses should never cost more than $500k. =)

BigWeather

The 60gig will be replaced by the 80gig. That is all. This is not a bad thing.

If you want the EE buy one now, if you would rather 20 extra gigs, buy one in two months. Same price 499.

And the 80gig is cheaper for Sony to produce than the 60gig. This story has been presented in such a way that somehow good news for Sony has come out sounding bad :(

I really hope this console faction bickering stops soon.

Astrofox

db9

LeChuck

@KaneRobot: i guess its sort've up to the consumer, isnt it? reports are saying a lotta folks thought $500 for the PS3 was a deal and acted on it.
PS Wii owners could make the same argument of both systems, so let's not squabble over arbitrary numbers.

TheIrishNinja

Kyle81

Grael4

It's pretty sad when that people are so desensitized to the $400 mark established by the 360 that $500 suddenly seems like a decent deal to some people.

KaneRobot

Thanks for the heads-up about the HDMI cable -- I'd seen the pricey ones in retail outlets and steered clear, so I'm glad to hear that there are equivalents at a much lower price.

BigWeather

the point is these consoles are not cheap. People are stupid. MS put the 360 on spin cycle and people ate it up. The Elite is MS saying the PS3 is a better deal than the premium and the Elite still doesn't have all the features of the PS3. No matter how you slice it, if you buy a next gen console that's not called Wii then you're spending over $600 bucks when it's all done. That is, unless you want a gimped 360 with no harddrive and just pass on the Wifi adaptor. Or try and cut corners with a silver Live subscription which is just a big joke.

Quote by Peter Dille from Sony -

"With the Xbox 360 you've got an inconsistent design, some have a harddrive, some don't, and none of them have Blu-Ray, and the HD DVD will be out of business in a matter of months. Is this a 10 year product? And by the way it doesn't even work. Do they want to be selling it for 10 years and refurbishing them all for 10 more years? I don't think that's a 10 year product. You could disagree with me, or they could disagree with me, but I'd put that up against the PS3 any day."

Those are fighting words and that's what sony should deal with. THAT'S what sony should focus on and counter it by getting the great games on the shelves.

Striderhayasa - Phillyyakk on PSN and Live.

spongedaddy

let's see another few pages of fear and random speculation before Sony comes out and corrects what's been said here. they gotta dance carefully 'cause they want the 60GB to clear out at $500, and coming out & saying the 80GB will be $500 soon as that happens might not help that.

TheIrishNinja

So any potential buyer of that 80GB bundle with Motorstorm would be out of their minds for buying it. Since it would be cheaper to just wait till it was no longer bundled together and buy both separately, $60 + $499 cheaper than $599 bundle.

That is an excellent way of lowering your console sales number during the month the bundle is released. Of course, that's assuming Sony does lower the 80GB's price, unbundled it, and potential buyers know that it is forthcoming.

Well GG Sony, amazing how it only took one day to shed all that good hype and vibe from E307.

大漢中

Kyle81

asherdude

That EE is important to me for piece of mind on BC. The 360 went SW compat because it had to, and that stinks, but they've done a decent job supporting it almost two years after release. I have no confidence Sony will.

Also, with EE you get PS2 and PS1 compatibility, since the PS2 hardware had PS1 compat, right? Does the SW emulation support PS1 at all? I'd guess probably yes, but I just don't know.

I *almost* bought a PS3 yesterday, solely because of the EE going away. When I learned it didn't come with HDMI or (c'mon!) component I balked. But I may just buy one tonight on this news.

The way I reckon it, I can still hurt Sony. I'd be buying this a year ahead of when any games come out I actually want, and they lose money on this model. And with my ZERO games and ZERO Blu-Ray purchases my attach rate will be zero and that's where they make their money anyhow (PS3 has an abyssmal attach rate regardless) whereas someone else that would've bought the one I'm maybe going to buy might buy something.

Ridiculous position to put the consumer in, that's for sure.

BigWeather

lushen124

If anything, I was expecting the 80GB to drop out and be left with a 60GB that would, slowly but surely, drop into my price range. But what? Drop the popular 60GB model in favor of an 80GB model? What have they been smoking? Hell, if this keeps up, I won't ever see a PS3. The final nail in the coffin that would terminate all of my hope is if they announced an "elite version of the elite" sometime in 2008.

Don't do it, Sony. Don't leave me with a single $600 choice again. I wasn't a fan of SKU's to begin with, but if you're going to switch out a new model every 7 months, It's about as much frustration as trying to buy a top-of-the-line computer that stays top-of-the-line for more than a month.

lushen124

crummer

Irenicus

Buttah

Grael4

TheIrishNinja

SG79

Thats my prediction. But seeing how the sales volume has increased astronomically now that a loaded system is available at the 500 price point, i dont see sony going back to one 600 sku.

Belain

No wonder when Sony's Japanese president said that there was not goign to be a PS3 price drop everyone either thought he was fooling or confused when aall the time he was telling the truth.

Surprize everyone.Egg is on alot of faces this morning, that's for sure.

Tezs

"WE'RE IN THIS FOR THE LONG RUN.

10 YEAR LIFE CYCLE!!!"

Frybread

Grael4

TheIrishNinja

Look at Europe they get a bundle pack and no price drop and it is now the same with the US console except instead of two games and a controller (PAL) you get 1 game, 1 controller and 20GB extra.

The 60GB have been price dropped to remove stock. Can Sony get any more stupider. Shame I bought my PS3 early though lol.

Kevyn

WATCH THIS DAMN VIDEO

[atvs.vg.no]

Kaz Hirai HIMSELF confirms it at the 1:40 mark.

大漢中

So are you also gonna be in the thread later today when Sony "clarifies" these comments and tells the world this guy was "quoted out of context" and that the "rumors are untrue"? Are you going to tell us all how wrong you were?

Because this ain't happening. And you can quote me on that.

badasscat

Better? 20 GB or Emotion engine, I choose Emotion Engine. If hard drive space matters to you, you can buy a HDD that's 200GB or so for that extra $100 dollars, and you have a superior emulation system.

There's a reason Sony fans harped on the 360's backwards compatability as an obvious sign of Sony's superiority-- it's a great thing to have for people who want to play their old games without having a software middle-man that's prone to bugs/problems.

Now, Sony and Microsoft are both focusing on software-based emulation which is bad for consumers, and makes it a bit more difficult for new games to come out on the PS2. If you want someone with a PS3 to buy a PS2 game, it helps if they can guarantee it'll work, rather than have to spend development time making a software patch for the PS3 so that it'll work.

The new "cheaper" PS3 is actually superior from a chipset aspect, whereas that 20GB of space really is a moot point with the vast array of computer harddrives you can buy for much cheaper. Heck, I have 4 80GB hard drives within arms reach, and none of them are going in my PS3.

Phenix

sectionz

Of COURSE they're going to have a $499.00 80 GB model. DUH.

I swear you anti-Sony fanboys are ridiculous.

Schrade

1) The 80GB SKU (with no PS2 hardware emulation) is CHEAPER TO MAKE, while it is actually slightly BETTER (obviously 80 > 60).

2) They will continue to charge $599 for all NEW PS3s being made... so they found a kind of dazzling way to discounting the 60 GB stock without looking desperate.

3) Discounting unsold stock to $499 will stimulate sales until those 60 GB are all sold, especially since people know the price is going back up to $599 when they're gone. AND they get to do TAKEBACKS on the price "discount" once the 60 GB are gone.

-

Thus, in the long run, they've made the PS3 look slightly better (80GB > 60 GB), cost less to make (yank the PS2 chips), while NOT lowering the price ($599), and finding a way to discount/DUMP the stock that retailers have already paid for and taken, and it only cost Sony $200 million rebate to retailers (2 million PS3s x $100 rebate = $200 million).

dcartist

Mister Adequate

BiggNewt

creid

ITR

TheIrishNinja

1:40 Kaz Hirai confirms the 60 gig being phased out and the 80 gig being $599.

Ignore the Norwegian being said in the beginning. :D

大漢中

Am I the only person that feels that the only way this story could make things better is if Tokyo strings up Howard Stringer and the SCE execs, and has them go through Japanese Imperial Army Torture (circa WWII) by a rather emotionless (Yet with 20 more bullets) gaming crowd?

Sony should've stuck with hiring a Japanese CEO/Chairman... STRINGER SUCKS!!!

Soldier_CLE scratches himself, seems pleased.

After seeing whats coming at e3, PS3 is getting some great games this year and next. Games that have the potential to sell but can't if the user base is not there. It's not like a game will run on one PS3 but not the others. All the essential hardware is there out the box (harddrive, wifi, blu ray drive) so a 20 GB PS3 can still run whatever the 80GB can run.

Well, I guess Nintendo really did have the inside track for this generation because they are the only company that's laughing all the way to the bank and from the looks of it, will be doing so for a long time.

Striderhayasa - Phillyyakk on PSN and Live.

TheIrishNinja

AstronomyD

Irenicus

SAKY

Frenzy54

Nowell

Draconis

@D_Imperial115: props on the in living color reference, that was beautiful, man.

TheIrishNinja

D_Imperial115

it a conspiracy man C..O..N.spiracy

D_Imperial115

Megaseven

Sawboss

you're paying $2 per GB right now if you buy the 80 gig bundle. Figure 100 bucks extra for the bundle, minus the 60 dollar game equals 40. 40 dollars for 20 extra gigs is...2 bucks a gig.

by comparison, the 120GB Elite is 80 bucks more than the 20 gig version, so you're getting 100 gigs for 80 bucks, or 80 cents a gig.

I'm not saying anything, but there's some food for thought.

Phenix

crck

i guess that means a 120gb version is around the corner.

epionx111