<![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later - Kotaku Comments]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later - Kotaku Comments]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @LORDofDANCE: What good quality and features?

gtr225

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @LORDofDANCE:

Ack, I hit enter by accident. That was a bad post, and I'll finish what I'm saying below.

@E2K:

If you want shit quality. The only reason that PC's are successful online is because their free. I have tons of trouble playing some PC games online because their not supported well. The PS2 was a joke online so don't defend it. I have no problem paying $3 a month for Live as long as it continues delivering me good quality with new features.

LORDofDANCE

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @E2K:

If you want shit quality. The only reason that PC's are successful online is ebcause their free. I have tons of trouble playing some

LORDofDANCE

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @E2K: M$ is just testing the waters for now with they're Windows Live gaming service. First you pay to play PC-360 matches, and if enough morons buy into that crap, they'll make you pay for more things that should and could be free. I'm pretty certain that most gamers will fall for this shit and just bend over and let M$ rape them w/o Vaseline. I know Sony and Nintendo's online strategies of late have been pretty poor, but I'd rather give it some time and let them work out the kinks than have to pay for things that should be free (maps, online play), or have to pay way more than something normally should cost (like a 120GB HDD for $180).

gtr225

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @LORDofDANCE:
i don't need to repeat your question, as it is obvious.

XBow windows Live will lead to all pc gamers having to pay for online gaming.
Free alternatives like playstation home and nintendo friend code online NEED to me successful so that MS is forced to make online gaming free again. The way it has been on PC's and PS2 for years, and should be.

E2K

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Here's what I'd like to know - if it is indeed true that Microsoft wanted to force Epic to charge for additional maps and extra gameplay modes (e.g. Annex), then it begs the question: where does the money go? Does all the money from the transaction go to Microsoft, does it all go to the developer of the original game, or is it split between the two in some ratio? I know there's a good amount of speculation in this comment thread, but I'd like someone to do some deep investigative reporting to get to the bottom of the matter. I'd like to know where the money goes to from each transaction, micro or otherwise, and who really benefits from charging for Xbox Live Marketplace content.

Hell, I'd probably do it myself, but I lack the industry contacts and time to really do it.

Webimpulse

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> This is why PC gaming will not die. People are'nt going to pay for your fucking maps M$ when they can make better themselves. Counter-Strike, if I do recall, was a fanmade modification.

"I think the PC community has invaded the consoles and expect things to be the same here as they are there: cheating, modding, user-created crap."

GTFO, nublet. Sad little sheep like you buying crap like this that thinking people reject is causing M$ and others to think its a valid business plan. Go die in a fire.

EA has the same money grubbing strategy. Don't release new maps! - they cry - release an 'expansion' with 4 new maps and charge 30$ for it! They even reused the art assets! Yippie!

The Commissar

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Ludwig: they don't host gears - games are peer hosted on xbox live.

Rajio

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Kajetan: agreed

Rajio

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Fabrice: Playing FPS online should be free but you don't see M$ following that idea either :-(

gtr225

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> ROFLMFAO

Xbox360's don't even USE nVidia graphics chips. rofl.

so that being said, a PS3 would play GoW better? Seeing how it IS using an nVidia graphics chip...

HEHEHE no one saw THAT coming, now hah? :P

SliceWarriorX

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> the first time they offered the Halo2 maps(the first ones) for sale (like 20 bucks or something ridiculous)...I was like, FUCK NO. And then I heard that if you waited till after a certain date they would be free. I waited. Seriously, this is getting ridiculous with this Microtransaction BS. I can d/l player made user maps for most FPS's for my PC online for FREE. This is the major problem with additional content for the console generation. Funny, I don't remember there ever being any additional charges for content for the PS2 (of course, I can't think of any game that HAD additional content, but that's another story...).

If they keep up this "Pay now, Free later" philosophy--believe me, I WILL wait. Especially when a great developer like Epic actually ADMITS to having additional content they WANT to give YOU for FREE!! How many companies do that? (not EA that's for sure). It's just M$ trying to squeeze what they can out of you for their 360....because they know that later on the PS3 is going to kick their butt (not a fanboy, just..I can *feel* it..hehe).

Whatever...Currently (despite all the 360 fanboys), there are only 4 games I actually want for a 360:GOW, Lost Planet, Mass Effect and Too Human. There is NOTHING else on that system that is worth buying for me (I have a nice PC). So until they start putting out more and better games, they can charge all the current suckers all they want---because by the time I finally buy one it'll all be FREEEEEEEE for MEEEEEE!!!!
lol!

playinggames

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> I'd really like to know where the money goes for this

Gamerleet0374

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Uh, for understanding this thing .. you guys have to disconsider Microsoft Game Studios from the "Live" pot .. your "live" money isn't going to Microsoft Game Studios .. this is a separated publisher .. hosting Gears of War (and many other games.) .. they are maximising profit to go on publishing more games ..

They are just a publisher, like Ubisoft, EA etc .. so this actions have nothing to do with "FORCING THIRD PARTIES!!" or with "Stealing you for your live money and this".

Ludwig

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> XBL, PSN, and online play are overrated imo. I almost never play online, but almost all game allow it now.

I don't have a problem with paying for microtransactions.

I DO have a problem when a developer thinks something should be free, but MS steps in and forces customers (already paying monthly fees) to pay for what should have been free.

_sean_

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Anyone consider all the bandwidth MS will need to use to send all these maps to people? I bet that cost a buck or two and the initial low download cost may be set to help off set this issue. If you want free online go to the PS3. I have it and have only used it to download a few games to my psp. It sucks as a primary online system.

Orionz Dream

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @E2K:

Are you retarded??? That's the worst analogy I have ever heard. The PSN and friend codes suck. When they give me the same quality I get out of $3 a month on Live, that is when I start advocating them.

LORDofDANCE

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> I think the sad thing is the game industry is purposefully creating a class system.

Used to be if I went out and bought a console, and you went out and bought one the only difference between the two are what games we chose.

Now your elite, I'm premium, and our other friend is the cash poor sorry bastard that got the base system or whatever they call that stuff.

But the divisions don't end there. Now you have some maps that I don't. Etc. Etc. We are devided from one another even when we own the exact same game.

Used to be when a developer wanted to make more money on a game they released an EXPANSION.

WantedCreative

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @tljent: hear hear. They are still going to release them for FREE in a few months time. This is just like silver account members bitching about not getting a demo until a week later... If you want the damn demo so bad, BUY A GOLD ACCOUNT! They are giving you a free service, it OFTEN costs money to be an early-adopter, regardless of the service being provided. It's called capitalism, get over it!

beckerist

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @DashTheHand:

Agreed, but this is NOT the case of Microsoft, the owner of the 360 marketplace, bullying Epic into charging for Gears content. This is Microsoft, Gears of War's publisher, demanding the content be paid so they can make money.

I guess it really is "up to the publisher to decide the cost for Marketplace content"

@FoxHoundADAM:
Totally agree with that statement. The "Microsoft can do no wrong" train is derailed, probably for good.

aka Bitter

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> I love hearing people endlessly bitching about something that costs less than 10 dollars. I could collect cans to come up with the cash to get these maps if I needed to.

Stop pissing and moaning because everything isn't free and given to you at your beck and call. If you're so fucking broke you can't afford some new maps I don't know what to tell you.

A bunch of fucking crybabies...go back to WoW.

tljent

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @t0nic:
"So not only do you have to pay for xbox live but if you buy a MMO for console now you have a monthly fee."

Not really. MMOs can be played with a FREE Silver account.

Walshicus

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> OMG I cant decide.... should I buy it when it comes out or wait.... I just wish MS had not given me the choise..... ahhhh boo hoooo.

Damn people grow some hair.

Orionz Dream

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> The conversation that was exposed between Microsoft and Epic is the same conversation that is had for every game between a studio and publisher - pricing, extras, expansion packs... Everything is discussed. The difference here is that these conversations are usually not exposed to the consumer.

What we should be looking for are ways to make user-created content more available and for sharing (for free or otherwise). Then, we will see the value (or lack thereof) from microtransaction content. It will seem more like a choice.

A lot of those complaining feel entitled, but to me, it seems the problem is that there is no competition for content, so pricing and offerings seem arbitrary and opportunistic to the consumer.

jgressley

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> I'm currently in the middle of listening to the interview. And this listed compromise was one of the things that bothered me.

Rein and Sweeney seem to know exactly what they want to do and can show these techniques have worked well for them in the past.

But then they seem to act as if they are open to certain compromises which don't accomplish their goals.

This is one of them. They want the maps free because it encourages customers to keep their copies of Gears and not trade them in. How is this free? I can't see how this would prevent me from trading my copy in. (Rein and Sweeney see sales of traded in copies as reducing sales of new copies, that's why they want to prevent trade ins).

Another one is they are angry that if they were a Games for Windows Live game, they couldn't offer buddy lists or voice chat to their customers. Instead, their customers would have to subscribe to Live Gold to get it. They find this wrong. But then they say that if you got a 90 day Live Gold trial, they'd be okay with it? How is this okay? What if I bought Shadowrun, used up my 90 days, then bought UT3? I wouldn't get the chat. They say chat should be free and it should, don't go halfway.

And the most baffling is they complain that with Live for Windows, they could can't support Macintoshes and dedicated Linux servers, both of which they support right now. If this is true (and it is), why would they even consider Live for Windows? MS is not going to support Linux. Also, considering in the same interview they say matchmaking in Gears is boned because MS didn't get the ability to do good (group-based) matchmaking into Live in time for them. So again, why would you jump into a program where you have to wait for MS to develop network capabilities you need, and they only seem interested in developing them on their own schedule (i.e. in time for Halo 3).

I just didn't see the point in the whining. Rein and Sweeney are smart and know what they want to do. And what they want to do is incompatible with Live for Windows. Thanks for exposing the problems with Live for Windows, but why are you still considering it when it will compromise your ability to follow your own principles and do your own development?

br549

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> The only problem is that EPIC publicly announced that they wanted them to be free, and the maps have been ready for a while.

MS should just let them go for free, now, and next time make the pricing structure discussions part of an NDA. Tempests in teapots should be avoidable.

VectorScalar

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Don't see the big problem here, if MS follows this structure. If people want to pay for these maps now and play them now, that's perfectly fine.

If you have the patience and aren't terribly excited, you can easily wait the few months before they're free.

This is exactly what bungie and MS did when the 4 new Halo 2 maps were released, you could get them for price at first, but they were released like 4-5 months later for free.

exkon

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> This is what microsoft is planning, after xbox live on windows, they will make you pay for all online gaming activity. Also HL2 PC vs PC.
After this this they will ban all mods and user created content.
You could make your own maps, but for other to play it, they will have to pay microsoft.
This is the future of gaming, courtesy of microsoft.

PSHome and NintendoFriendCode should kill xbox live, so that PC gamers can play again for free, and that all online gaming is free again.

Remember, paying for online gaming (mmo aside), is like paying for sex.

E2K

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @BlackDove

True but the fact they are playing around with micro-transactions is a fairly good indicator they are testing the waters to see if such strategies are viable.

t0nic

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Kosher Infidel:

Please. Your hatred clouds your logic worse than any PC enthusiast.

1. Quality doesn't magically go to shit when something is free.

2. Microsoft has done this before with other games (where they wanted it to be free or cheaper, and Microsoft said no), and they WILL do it again.

http://kotaku.com/gaming/bizarre/bizarre-geometry-wars-sho...

There is no slippery slope. More like tracks, and we're on the train.

Scuba Steve

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> This brought to you by the company c.e.o Dollar Bill Gate$

OIvIeN

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Sony isn't making you pay $50 for Home. Or for GT HD for that matter, last I checked.

ClosedAccountDueToErrorsAshCouldn'tFix

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Marasai:
Way to miss the point 100%. Microsoft are the ones that demanded charging for the maps, NOT EPIC. How is it whining when the people that made the damn game and the content on the disc wanted to give us more stuff free, and the middleman says "Whoa whoa whoa, hold up. We're gonna have to set you guys straight. We are going to have to charge people for this free stuff you wanted to hand out whether you like it or not."

DashTheHand

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Kosher

Well considering Sony was flirting with using micro-transactions on Gran Turismo and they are going to use them for Home. EA was considering or is considering using micro-transactions for roster updates in Madden. Oblivion charged for horse armor of all things. Its not a far leap from moving toward a more micro-transaction based system.

You are correct though that PC's have influenced consoles. The patch system and move toward more network related games on consoles are straight from PC style multiplayer games. The next step is MMO's imo, Its not a far idea that something like WoW could be ported to xbox360 considering FFVI was console also. So not only do you have to pay for xbox live but if you buy a MMO for console now you have a monthly fee.

t0nic

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Rajio:
Yes, sure ... and the best way to do that is not to buy this stuff. Even not to buy these games!

But sadly, the main target group is still young gamers, male gamers, who spend gladly every fuckin dollar they have on games. Well, i was young too. I had a part time job and spent everything i earned in games. My parents payed for the house, for my clothes, for my food, for my school. Why bother?

Kajetan

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Well, you bought the game, that is all. You don't want to pay extra for extra content? Don't. No one is forcing you to do anything. What I think is going on here is not that consoles are effecting PCs, but I think the PC community has invaded the consoles and expect things to be the same here as they are there: cheating, modding, user-created crap. Yeah, please make my console more like the business model of the PC. Can't wait.

Oh, and for those who think that all this is a dangerous move whose effect will ripple forth like a great, digital tsunami:

http://www.concurringopinions.com/archives/slippery_slope....

Enjoy that illogical ride people. You have no 'proof' other than your own paranoia.

KosherInfidel

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @adamcole:

Sony has always used computer entertainment system for the PS2 and PS3, and I know Nintendo has not used that label, ever. I'm not sure about Microsoft.

LORDofDANCE

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Kajetan: except the console's content pricing model is migrating to the PC so consumers are better off fighting it where it starts (here) rather than later on once its prevalent on pc and all other platforms too.

Rajio

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Sounds to me like Microsoft hired some of those recently released Sony PR folks.

FoxHoundADAM

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> No, you don't get it. Casuals do not buy extra maps, that's why they should be free, since you are limiting the payer base and it's not the way to go to keep a 6 months old game alive.

Fabrice

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Marasai: Oh and stop whining. You bought the game for what was on the disc. That is all the price includes. Anything afterwards is fair game.

So the flaws in Gears of War that they patched with updates....should they charge for those? I mean, the fixes weren't on the disk, that's for sure. I'm curious how much you think those should cost.

...and yes, I know what you were getting at.

Adam In Texas

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Console players are not used to the fact, that nearly all online services/features for PC games are free of extra charge. You have Gamespy, you have another matchmaking tool and another and some. And if i remember correctly ... Battle.net was THE reason for the outstanding commercial success of Blizzard games.

But if you have enough money to throw it out of the window ... well, it's your money. You decide!

Kajetan

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Kosher

People are pitching a fit because micro-transactions are becoming the norm not the exception to the rule. People already see where this is going which is the world where you buy a game but in order to get everything for the game you have to keep buying texture packs, roster updates, new maps, new vehicles etc. When someone spends 60 dollars or whatever on a game, they should not be forced to run out and buy online the remaining part of the game they didn't recieve in the first place.

Yes, the extra maps are extra and everything but when Sony is floating the idea of GT Micro World and EA is looking at roster charges/cheat codes transactions. It is within the realm to think that a company is going to be willing to withhold content and sell it as extra. I know I am not going to be happy when I am forced to buy a game only to find out that multiplayer is extra or that the game ends in Act IV and pops a screen saying I can buy the real ending for 10 bucks and see Act V.

People are bemoaning the move by companies to nickel and dime you at every instance not to mention the propensity of more games (on consoles no less) to ship unfinished and bug ridden until they patch. Console games used to ship fairely finished and that was sort of an advantage it had over PC games. Now that advantage is gone and well some people are ticked off that we are moving down a path that could in theory lead to "Patches" being considered fair game for micro-transactions (God I hope it doesn't happen).

t0nic

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Frankly I think this is the way that all online content should be done. Ie it becomes free after awhile. That was the casuals get to use without paying.

Oh and stop whining. You bought the game for what was on the disc. That is all the price includes. Anything afterwards is fair game. people still need to make the new content,test it, host it. Hell, we already got 2 free maps already (4 if your count the two that were added to the disc at the last minute). I think people really need to get over the idea that we should get everything for free. Nothing is free, it all costs someone somewhere.

So while I naturally would prefer not to pay for gears maps, and will likely wait until thy are free, I don't find it insulting or in any way inapropriate that we are expected to pay for additional content.

Marasai

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Free. I paid you F--k-rs $60 already, and another $50/yr for membership to Live. You owe me free maps. Atleast 4.

Well, atleast I'm not some sap that forks up 80-400 pts for some custom icon that is a joke.

Spare_Change

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Sigh. Look,it is not free to use Xbox LIVE, period. They have to pay for bandwidth, storage, and other 'small' items, which, when coupled to what, 4 million accounts is....yeah, you do the math.

So. We can have sponsored items, like the last GoW maps, or we can pay for them. Oh, or we could not get sh** and play the same crap over and over and over and over and over...I don't mind paying for additional content, really. It is a paltry sum for those of use who purchased a $400 gaming machine, TV to play said machine on, sound system, games at $60 a pop. Tsk, tsk. And now people bemoan the fact that they will be "forced" to pay a few dollars (nothing compared to what you dropped on a luxury item) more? Get the F out. I just came back from Kenya where the avg. person makes around $20 a month. Learn to appreciate where you live and the great things we have and can do before you pitch a bitch about $6. Jesus Christ, stay away from Starbucks for one day and you have your maps.

For F's sake, can't people find anything better to bitch about in our hobby? How about the shit that keeps rolling out from each studio?

KosherInfidel

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> "Why was this such a issue, again?" Luke Plunkett

Such AN issue.
--
We might have some healthy competition in this instance if Microsoft weren't positive that sony would sell each weapon/character/map and shading texture ala carte and you end up paying $90 for the entire game.

MikeTV

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @Fabrice:

I agree! You bought the damn game in the first place didn't you?

Unless there's going to be new technology added that (better physics, AI etc) Then this should be free. (for all we know, this was already completed before and was made to be DLC).

Unless a map as a harem of sexy ninja sex slaves that are waiting to be sodomized. Hell all of it should be free!

Interesting thing here that the devs wanted to give it away while MS wanted a fee for it.

This is why I sometimes hate that consoles are going the PC route. Everything should be online!
Co-op split screen with a buddy in the same room??! HELL NO! Do it over the internet!

Game going gold being optimized, checked for bugs and polish?! HELL NO! Just patch this sucker up later and then make a profit out of it!

Don't get me wrong, I'm not just criticizing MS. But all three of 'em! And some devs too for pandering.

Ah what do I know?! I'm still a sucker for games...

excaliburps

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> I don't care. Regardless if I pay or get these maps for free, I'm getting them either way.

y2julio

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Yeah, I guess it is good they are giving them away for free later down the road but it sucks that they have to charge for them at all if they don't want to in the first place.

This a little off topic but _sean_ reminded me of it when it asked where gaming was headed. Has anyone seen the Virtua Fighter 5 commercial on TV where they talk about all of the good scores it received and everything? At the end of the commercial it says, "Only for the PS3 Computer Entertainment System" Have they always called it a computer in the commercials? It's the first time I noticed it. I thought all the big 3 said "Video Game Entertainment System" but maybe not.

Adam In Texas

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> @_sean_: MS is GoW's publisher did GoW marketing campaign and will host download. In your opinion this does not justify participating in decisions?

ConayR

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Because Microsoft is a power hungry madman?

Seriously getting sick and tired of these micro-transactions :(

t0nic

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> But I want an Oompa-Loompa N~O~W!

phinehas

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> yay! MS makes more decisions for developers!

sheesh, GFW, XBL, where is gaming headed?

_sean_

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Micro$oft the peoples champion.

o gad.

Witzbold

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> That's utter nonsense.

Multiplayer maps should be god damn free. Gamerpics or backgrounds don't matter, make us pay all you want on these, but keep new maps free...

Fabrice

]]> <![CDATA[Gears Maps: Buy Now, Don't Pay Later]]> Yay...go microsoft...

Zho

]]>