See, PALfriends, you don't ALWAYS get screwed over... Sometimes the US does, too. Of course, it seems more important to me to have a bluray of Siren than WipeOut, but maybe that's because Wipeout seem more like a PSN game than Siren does...
At least the US got a bluray version of Warhawk...
dammit, I already bought the temporary version and I'm not buying it again...
Guess the right thing to do about a good looking downloadable is to just ignore it and wait for it to hit disc or fade into obscurity like EchoChrome...
(DEAD) Goldwings - Remembered for his bravery and heroism... xD was starred
(DEAD) Goldwings - Remembered for his bravery and heroism... xD was unstarred
@(Zombie) Goldwings: Same. The only reason why I haven't bought it just yet is because I knew a boxed version was inevitable. It seems odd that they would release a new game like PAIN in retail but not a great game of a long-running franchise. I'll have to pick this up at some point.
Goddamn it, I have been bitching about the lack of a boxed version of Wipeout HD for a long, long time. Thank God Sony have finally seen the light.
Of course, it's Europe only at this point, so now I've gotta debate whether to import or wait for the US release. Thing is, if everybody imports, then nobody will buy the US release when/if it does come, and Sony will never learn their lesson. They need to be taught that there is a sizable portion of the audience that just does. not. pay. for downloads.
I am intrigued by the lack of complaining about Sony repackaging old games and selling them again, when there was plenty of complaining about the Metroid trilogy and all those New Play Control games. This is the exact same thing, except that instead of a control overall, the game just gets a visual facelift. So I am just curious about the apparent double standard sicne no one complained about God of War I and II being repackaged either.
@Hamster Poop: Wipeout HD was essentially a full sized game being put out over the store as a digital release... The game is as big as full priced Blu-ray titles such as Motorstorm/Pacific Rift but by being download only it alienated a market who aren't keen on digital content, and with a game of this calibur, offering it in a new format isn't really something to complain about... especially as it's set to retail for less than the price of the downloadable version!
As for God of War's bundle, A lot of people didn't play the first 2 games (I am yet to play the second game), not to mention PS2 games not being playable on most PS3s, so a rerelease to get newcomers up to date makes sense (and is essentially no different from the film industry releasing a special edition of an old movie in anticipation of it's sequel getting released... and heck, noone's complaining about old VHS movies getting DVD or Blu-Ray releases!
Plus, of course, there are the enhancements bringing a smoother framerate and higher resolution as well as trophies, so this is a bundle well worth a lot of peoples time, and again I don't see why anyone would complain about that...
Metroid Trilogy seemed a little dubious as a rerelease however as gamecube releases play without a problem on the Wii without much of a graphical difference and the rerelease didn't offer a lot of new content to justify a rerelease either, but I don't doubt that fans of the series appreciated the convenience of the whole later series being in one place, so again, there shouldn't be a problem!
@VAD2001: If I'm not mistaken, the OP thought this was a rehash of the old wipeout game that was out on the PS1 or maybe he thought it was the remake of the PSP game (which minus fury it sort of is excluding the soundtracks).
To explain it properly, I believe exion posted what makes this not a remake of the ps1 game but rather a full-fledged game of it's own merit. I believe in his/her first paragraph he/she mentions that this is just the blu-ray package of what's available for download. Following which was explained why this was actually better than the original release, explanation about GoW re-release and why Metroid Trilogy seemed dubious.
@LordChris915: He has a point in that Online retailers will probably put it up for £14.95 to £17.99. So it's cheaper.
I bought the game oddly when it was 11.99 (edited after looking at my old mail.) at launch (the price went up in November for some reason). and the expansion was 7.99 considering I got over a year's worth of play with the first and then the expansion. I'd say it was worth every penny.
I should pick this up actually. Not sure why I haven't yet since one of my earliest and better memories of the original playstation was hours spent on wipeout 2047.
I'll probably wait till it's on offer on the blue ray.
@xxXX_Insanities_Birth_XXxx: Unfortunately there are no Wipeout 2097 levels within Wipeout HD or it's expansion (apparently the assets of the level aren't immediately available, and rebuilding them from scratch just isn't cost effective) but I'd go as far as saying, despite it's budget price, Wipeout HD is one of the most fun, and visually stunning games released this generation.
In fact, Id go so far as saying that until you've heard the majesty of the real time soundscaping of custom soundtracks (your music is effected by the racing environment, with effects like flange and reverb being used to great effect) and the visual splendour of the Zone tracks being used as ever changing equaliser displays for the music then you haven't seen what the PS3 is currently capable of!
@exion: I have to say I decided to just replace the entire OST myself. HDs OST isn't anywhere near as good as some of the old stuff...and I just happened to have the Shatter OST bought.
@exion: Well I don't mind about the maps too much as they're not really what I enjoyed the most and I hardly remember them any more, I just enjoyed the game itself and I'm sure I'll enjoy the new maps anyway. Thanks for telling me in advance though as it is something to consider although I'll be happy with getting it still.
@Showmeyomoves!: ah, that song's "machine gun"... it's not usually my kind of music, but that song pounding out of a decent sound system whilst you're playing an elimination game on Fury does get you pumped!
There's a couple of pretty good tracks all in all, but I still think Wipeout 2097 had the best soundtrack in the series!
(which I occasionally play using the custom soundtrack feature)
Ok honestly I don't understand the hate Sony's getting for the advertising here. I CAN understand the issue with it extending the loading time and am quite pleased to see Sony's swift response. However, an occasional add here and there when you're receiving FREE online play is something I can live with. Hell, people pay for xbox live and still have ads (unobtrusive or not).
@A-Rude-Hero: Well, when you buy a game that originally has no ads, you don't expect a company to release an update adding ads to the game. It's a negative upgrade and nobody likes it. PSN is known for it's free service with no strings attached, thats part of its selling point over the 360. Whats so hard to understand?
@Starshock: Maybe it's just me I guess. More and more people seem to want everything but don't want to give anything in return. The world just doesn't work that way, perhaps I'm just too cynical. Same sort of thing with piracy, we want everything, we want it now, and we don't want to pay anything for it.
I agree that increasing loading times is wrong, but Sony has fixed that.
If the ad is being displayed while playing offline I'll also concede that that should not be the case. BUT, if it's something to the nature of Wipeout Online content now being brought to you by StateFarm, well that's just the way it works out.
If this type of advertising can help game studios give quality on-line experiences while costing me no additional monies outside of my initial purchase I'm ok with it.
The landslide advertising precedent that could be set into motion is what people should focus on in this situation. The basic principle of forcing customers to endure any form of advertising for a game that has already been purchased should be wisely rejected by anyone who can see where such a road might lead us. The fundamentals of the issue are that the end user does not benefit in any way from the inclusion of in-game ads, and no advertising disclosure or concession was offered before the monetary transaction proper took place. Additionally no monetary compensation for the intrusive advertising was offered to those purchasers who paid any amount for the game, and it is shocking that any responders are content to not receive monetary compensation for such advertising even after they have paid for the game.
Clearly those who paid $20 up front, and paid another $10 for the Fury pack, should understand and value that the monetary exchange in this case was for an ad free game supported solely by the money spent by the consumer. If additional revenue is needed, to recoup the development costs, then this standout title with numerous positive reviews and a great word of mouth reputation should remain at the original $20 asking price. Better yet if Studio Liverpool, SCEE, or SCEA need even more money, they can sell physical on-site advertising to State Farm to be displayed at their studio locations instead of passing the buck on to the very people who are buying this game.
All in-game advertising, especially this arrogantly brash State Farm ad, is not welcome on any front, and the negative response should be seen as a clear example of where the end user stands in relation to mandatory advertisement that cannot be opted out of. Again, if the price of the download was $0.00, and an advertising disclaimer was made visible before any monetary exchange was completed, this discussion would not have produced such a livid sentiment. Those who have taken a passive Stockholmesque "doesn’t bother me" stance on this, or any other in-game advertising issue fail to see just how slippery the slope is in this situation.
As well, those who cannot see what the big deal is about are ignoring that any ground gained by advertisers will be next to impossible to regain if the collective gaming community doesn’t stand up and loudly voice that visual and/or audible advertising is not welcome within games, user interfaces, cut scenes, loading screens, menus, PS3 XMB, or 360 dashboard. Advertising within games is unnecessary and should not be perceived as a non-threatening entity just because it isn’t that bad at the moment. Magnify the scale, scope, time, and depth of unrestrained console game advertising only a few years from now, and you will see why such a ruckus was generated in response to this lone State Farm plug. Simply put, these ads are but pebbles in relation to the possible earth moving boulder laden landslide that might someday be ravaged down your throat if you do not object to in-game advertising at this point in time.
So I have a hypothetical question about this advertising situation. What if Wipeout HD and Fury were made and the company was running at a net loss because the game is cheap and there were not enough sales to support development cost and wages of the development team. Is it wrong for the company to then decide to find a way to make some money (in-game advertising) to assure that they break even and maybe even make some profit on the game?
NOTE: I am not saying this is the situation SCE Studio Liverpool is in.
What I am asking is whether the outcry would be justified if a game company did that to their game just to survive? I think of games like PixelJunk Eden Encore and I have no idea how they profit on something like that as there are I believe under 10000 players on the PJEE leaderboard for that game implying that they have made under $100,000 income for a single game. If they were to put a short 10-second ad whenever you start a level on that game, yes it would annoy me greatly, but if it meant that they stay in business rather than close up shop, I would be fine with it.
Also, I am not whole-heartedly accepting in game advertising or something. I am just trying to take a realistic viewpoint that as we continue moving forward, companies will continue looking for ways to profit, some of them maybe not as good as other ways.
@Eviltim: I would hope dev costs on Encore were very very low considering the game engine was there and there are no manufacturing costs for downloadable games. The most costly part might very well have been the localizations and certifications.
All in-game advertising is corrosive and negative in its influence. It undermines the integrity of the game you are playing, it destroys atmosphere and immersion and, in virtually all cases, the player sees absolutely no benefit, unless being trained to be a better consumer is a "benefit".
Any arguments that it "improves realism" are as fallacious and pathetic as they come. Do you want to know why there are ads in your game? Because the developer and/or publisher gets paid. That's it. There is no other reason, ever, why it happens. You are paying them for your game, and you are paying for it when you play it as well. If they could charge by the minute, you would be damn sure they would do it.
No arguments that "advertising doesn't effect me", please. It's not true, period. Go read your nearest sociological journal, and you will find that advertising influences people, who all think the same things you do, far more than you likely expect.
I'm glad the community is resisting this blatant bullshit, but more needs to be done if they want to keep the integrity of the medium. Games have only begun to develop as a legitimate form of art and expression, and already we are inundating them in corporate loathing. It's not enough, though. We need to refuse any and all games with advertising in them, period. I certainly plan to do just that.
@searanox: What if a game is set in the real world. You know that one where advertising for better or worse plays a huge role. You expect to see billboards, posters, and flyers. Why not make them for McDonald's or Coca-Cola instead of fictional brands? That makes the world more immersive to me, and the developers stand to profit. And if they profit enough developers can make their games free. Which makes it quite stupid to refuse in-game advertising.
Also, people are refusing this ad because it disrupts gameplay, not because it "destroys atmosphere".
@ctorrans: Err, have you played Ghostbusters, where the only company in the game world seems to be Doritos? And not just Doritos, but a Doritos that has vending machines in every building, and two or three delivery trucks on every street. Now THAT'S disruptive.
Who cares about in game ads? There was nothing wrong with the ad in Wipeout, it was during a load screen. Everybody calm down and let game companies make a little extra money, it's not like the names of the tracks all of a sudden became Moa Therma brought to you by McDonalds.
09/15/09
See, PALfriends, you don't ALWAYS get screwed over... Sometimes the US does, too. Of course, it seems more important to me to have a bluray of Siren than WipeOut, but maybe that's because Wipeout seem more like a PSN game than Siren does...
At least the US got a bluray version of Warhawk...
09/15/09
I don't if it's a wise move... it's not like people don't have internet anyway
09/15/09
Guess the right thing to do about a good looking downloadable is to just ignore it and wait for it to hit disc or fade into obscurity like EchoChrome...
09/15/09
09/15/09
No, I mean the downloadable version that once my PS3 dies, and PSN stops supporting it, will be irretrievable.
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
Of course, it's Europe only at this point, so now I've gotta debate whether to import or wait for the US release. Thing is, if everybody imports, then nobody will buy the US release when/if it does come, and Sony will never learn their lesson. They need to be taught that there is a sizable portion of the audience that just does. not. pay. for downloads.
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
As for God of War's bundle, A lot of people didn't play the first 2 games (I am yet to play the second game), not to mention PS2 games not being playable on most PS3s, so a rerelease to get newcomers up to date makes sense (and is essentially no different from the film industry releasing a special edition of an old movie in anticipation of it's sequel getting released... and heck, noone's complaining about old VHS movies getting DVD or Blu-Ray releases!
Plus, of course, there are the enhancements bringing a smoother framerate and higher resolution as well as trophies, so this is a bundle well worth a lot of peoples time, and again I don't see why anyone would complain about that...
Metroid Trilogy seemed a little dubious as a rerelease however as gamecube releases play without a problem on the Wii without much of a graphical difference and the rerelease didn't offer a lot of new content to justify a rerelease either, but I don't doubt that fans of the series appreciated the convenience of the whole later series being in one place, so again, there shouldn't be a problem!
09/15/09
Where are you getting that the BD release is going to have these "enhancements"?
09/15/09
To explain it properly, I believe exion posted what makes this not a remake of the ps1 game but rather a full-fledged game of it's own merit. I believe in his/her first paragraph he/she mentions that this is just the blu-ray package of what's available for download. Following which was explained why this was actually better than the original release, explanation about GoW re-release and why Metroid Trilogy seemed dubious.
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
I bought the game oddly when it was 11.99 (edited after looking at my old mail.) at launch (the price went up in November for some reason). and the expansion was 7.99 considering I got over a year's worth of play with the first and then the expansion. I'd say it was worth every penny.
09/15/09
I'll probably wait till it's on offer on the blue ray.
09/15/09
In fact, Id go so far as saying that until you've heard the majesty of the real time soundscaping of custom soundtracks (your music is effected by the racing environment, with effects like flange and reverb being used to great effect) and the visual splendour of the Zone tracks being used as ever changing equaliser displays for the music then you haven't seen what the PS3 is currently capable of!
Do yourself a favour and pick it up, good sir!
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
WOHD Fury has some cool music, though (see above).
09/15/09
There's a couple of pretty good tracks all in all, but I still think Wipeout 2097 had the best soundtrack in the series!
(which I occasionally play using the custom soundtrack feature)
09/15/09
08/04/09
08/04/09
Now I'm gonna go back to playing 1 v. 100 brought to me by Sprint and that car company with the catchy songs in the ads.
08/04/09
08/04/09
I agree that increasing loading times is wrong, but Sony has fixed that.
If the ad is being displayed while playing offline I'll also concede that that should not be the case. BUT, if it's something to the nature of Wipeout Online content now being brought to you by StateFarm, well that's just the way it works out.
If this type of advertising can help game studios give quality on-line experiences while costing me no additional monies outside of my initial purchase I'm ok with it.
08/04/09
08/04/09
I don't want ads unless it's a hot piece of ass shaking her ass in my face. No I don't mean that.
08/04/09
Clearly those who paid $20 up front, and paid another $10 for the Fury pack, should understand and value that the monetary exchange in this case was for an ad free game supported solely by the money spent by the consumer. If additional revenue is needed, to recoup the development costs, then this standout title with numerous positive reviews and a great word of mouth reputation should remain at the original $20 asking price. Better yet if Studio Liverpool, SCEE, or SCEA need even more money, they can sell physical on-site advertising to State Farm to be displayed at their studio locations instead of passing the buck on to the very people who are buying this game.
All in-game advertising, especially this arrogantly brash State Farm ad, is not welcome on any front, and the negative response should be seen as a clear example of where the end user stands in relation to mandatory advertisement that cannot be opted out of. Again, if the price of the download was $0.00, and an advertising disclaimer was made visible before any monetary exchange was completed, this discussion would not have produced such a livid sentiment. Those who have taken a passive Stockholmesque "doesn’t bother me" stance on this, or any other in-game advertising issue fail to see just how slippery the slope is in this situation.
As well, those who cannot see what the big deal is about are ignoring that any ground gained by advertisers will be next to impossible to regain if the collective gaming community doesn’t stand up and loudly voice that visual and/or audible advertising is not welcome within games, user interfaces, cut scenes, loading screens, menus, PS3 XMB, or 360 dashboard. Advertising within games is unnecessary and should not be perceived as a non-threatening entity just because it isn’t that bad at the moment. Magnify the scale, scope, time, and depth of unrestrained console game advertising only a few years from now, and you will see why such a ruckus was generated in response to this lone State Farm plug. Simply put, these ads are but pebbles in relation to the possible earth moving boulder laden landslide that might someday be ravaged down your throat if you do not object to in-game advertising at this point in time.
08/04/09
NOTE: I am not saying this is the situation SCE Studio Liverpool is in.
What I am asking is whether the outcry would be justified if a game company did that to their game just to survive? I think of games like PixelJunk Eden Encore and I have no idea how they profit on something like that as there are I believe under 10000 players on the PJEE leaderboard for that game implying that they have made under $100,000 income for a single game. If they were to put a short 10-second ad whenever you start a level on that game, yes it would annoy me greatly, but if it meant that they stay in business rather than close up shop, I would be fine with it.
Also, I am not whole-heartedly accepting in game advertising or something. I am just trying to take a realistic viewpoint that as we continue moving forward, companies will continue looking for ways to profit, some of them maybe not as good as other ways.
Opinions?
08/04/09
08/04/09
Any arguments that it "improves realism" are as fallacious and pathetic as they come. Do you want to know why there are ads in your game? Because the developer and/or publisher gets paid. That's it. There is no other reason, ever, why it happens. You are paying them for your game, and you are paying for it when you play it as well. If they could charge by the minute, you would be damn sure they would do it.
No arguments that "advertising doesn't effect me", please. It's not true, period. Go read your nearest sociological journal, and you will find that advertising influences people, who all think the same things you do, far more than you likely expect.
I'm glad the community is resisting this blatant bullshit, but more needs to be done if they want to keep the integrity of the medium. Games have only begun to develop as a legitimate form of art and expression, and already we are inundating them in corporate loathing. It's not enough, though. We need to refuse any and all games with advertising in them, period. I certainly plan to do just that.
08/04/09
Also, people are refusing this ad because it disrupts gameplay, not because it "destroys atmosphere".
08/04/09
08/04/09