It's well and fine for Namco and BottleRocket to point fingers at each other, but at the end of the day, a developer that accuses its publisher of ineptitude sounds suspect to me.
Just because a game's been in development for 18 months and has had milestones approved along the way don't mean shit. Especially if the milestones were fluffy and not substantive.
Think about this kids- for a game that was supposed to be released sometime in the fall of this year, Namco/BR did minimal to zero PR for the game. If you think about print press and retailer lead times of 3 to 9 months or more, they would have needed good looking PR materials back in January, or even earlier than that.
The lack of solid marketing materials means that BR didn't have the game in good enough shape for the Namco marketing people to do a proper job to promote the game. When you can't promote the game properly, the sales people won't sign up to sales numbers. When the sales people won't sign up, the marketing people will bug out and won't support the product.
If BOTH Namco and BR had their shit together, we would have been enjoying awesome screenshots, videos, and early impressions up the wazoo by now.
There are many moving pieces when you're in game development. Support from your marketing and sales departments is just as important as the competence of your developer and publisher-side project management.
@memtrace: You've got the best comment on the board right now, hands-down. My question is, if BOTH Namco and BR needed their shit together, which side would be more at fault for not having their shit together?
I feel like the more I read about videogame development, the more bad games can be blamed on bad management. Obviously, someone didn't have their shit together. If Namco's contractual requirements were too low and then they realized their mistake, that puts them at least one step ahead of somebody like... Midway? But they're still one step behind a publisher like Nintendo, or dare I say it, EA or Activision (not that I really love the business models of all companies listed).
Either way, I think Namco has a problem. If their contractual requirements were too low, that's their fault. If they hired a developer that was under-qualified to make the game they wanted, that's still Namco's fault. And who knows? Maybe Namco just wasn't willing to pay for enough man hours to make the game happen right.
There are so many variables not answered, but my gut instinct is to say Namco is more at fault than BR. Just my two cents plus (bailout-inflated) tax.
You would think that Bottlerocket could sue them for defamation, after all if Namco cited performance issues, its only going to hurt Bottlerockets business down the line...
On the other hand, money (and big businesses) talks...
Ramonskito commented on Patent Troll Lawsuit Begins on Tuesday "By calling them patent trolls wouldn't that open Kotaku up to a defamation suit?" [kotaku.com] 6:51 PM on Mar 15
Dude...wtf? I'm assuming then you're a lawyer? Oh forgive me...assumptions make an ass out of you and me right?
Regardless, I don't claim to know or be read up on the case we were discussing beforehand. It was just a simple comment and you ironically twisted it the wrong way.
Sadly, the guy is probably right. There are already several ways to get a better deal on used games than Gamestop, and yet the vast majority of people will still sell their games for a fraction of their value and then turn around and pay almost-new prices.
Though, Amazon has the advantage of being the ubiquitous online store and are associated with the best deals. So maybe they have a fighting chance.
I agree I think Amazon are a bunch of stupidheads...lol
why not skip both offers and use a service like Goozex to trade directly with other gamers...haven't tried it yet, but I signed up and am looking at using them with the next game I finish up.
That's pretty funny since I sell all of my used games on Amazon, and I invariably get more money than I would have if I traded them in at GameStop. As a bonus I can sell used PC games on there, which GameStop doesn't take, and I get real money instead of store credit. Plus I don't have to walk into a GameStop. Selling stuff in my underwear from my computer, and having cash deposited into my bank account seems pretty fucking immediate to me.
I am shocked no one has even mentioned Gamefly. They take trades and sell used games also. Not to mention as soon as I get a day one launch title I automaticly get 20% off of the game. They will send you all of the retail packaging all in mint never used condition. Also when trading games in you also get way more credit than Gamestop could even try to match. Like 10-15% more credit over Gamestop. I haven't bought any used games from Gamestop ever since I got Gamefly, for the simple fact that it's cheaper and the case, manual and disks are in MINT condition with no stickers.
I don't buy anything from Amazon so I can't really comment on thier services.
@JorgieX: How do you manage to get day one launch games over Gamefly? The chances of getting them sent are usually low, due to low availability, and they don't actually go up for sale very quickly in the store. The only real way to "just buy it" from them is if you manage to receive it from them which, as I just said, has a low chance of occurring. What's your secret?
Monopoly? Are you sure you know what that word means?
You can get games, used and new, at Amazon or eBay or any number of online retailers? Or in brick and mortars like Best Buy, Wal-Mart, Target, and whatever their Canadian equivalents are.
Their used game sales allow them to stay in business as a niche game retailer and remain competitive with big box stores.
I honestly don't understand the widespread hatred for them, especially when it stems from a complete lack of understanding of basic retail economics.
But yeah, go ahead and root for yet another company to go out of business and more people to lose their jobs, and less options for gamers. That's awesome.
Y'know, Gamefly recently started taking used games for credit... at good rates too. If none of these three companies can do it, I'm willing to bet Gamefly can.
GameStop can shove it. I don't care how "immediate" their stores are. I just cannot accept the fact that they buy used game at less tan half price and then proceeds to sell it back $5 cheaper than full retail price. I may not be rich, but I have enough money to pay an extra $5 for a new copy.
fuck gamestop. their used games only cost about $5 cheaper than new games, i am sure amazon has a chance of selling used games at a cheaper rate than that. GUYS DID YOU KNOW GAMESTOP HAS GEARS OF WAR 2 FOR $56.99 USED, THAT IS AN AMAZING DEAL. O WAIT NEWEGG.COM HAS IT NEW FOR THE SAME PRICE. O WELL.
I wish people would take a moment to consider what would happen if the used price was more than $5.00 than the new price.
If current used sales are already harming publishers (a dubious claim at best), then increasing used sales by lowering their price would give people more incentive to buy used.
While I don't think Gamestop has altruistic motives at heart when determining their pricing, I do think that a side effect of keeping used prices close to new is that you maintain a higher level of new sales.
03/16/09
Just because a game's been in development for 18 months and has had milestones approved along the way don't mean shit. Especially if the milestones were fluffy and not substantive.
Think about this kids- for a game that was supposed to be released sometime in the fall of this year, Namco/BR did minimal to zero PR for the game. If you think about print press and retailer lead times of 3 to 9 months or more, they would have needed good looking PR materials back in January, or even earlier than that.
The lack of solid marketing materials means that BR didn't have the game in good enough shape for the Namco marketing people to do a proper job to promote the game. When you can't promote the game properly, the sales people won't sign up to sales numbers. When the sales people won't sign up, the marketing people will bug out and won't support the product.
If BOTH Namco and BR had their shit together, we would have been enjoying awesome screenshots, videos, and early impressions up the wazoo by now.
There are many moving pieces when you're in game development. Support from your marketing and sales departments is just as important as the competence of your developer and publisher-side project management.
03/16/09
I feel like the more I read about videogame development, the more bad games can be blamed on bad management. Obviously, someone didn't have their shit together. If Namco's contractual requirements were too low and then they realized their mistake, that puts them at least one step ahead of somebody like... Midway? But they're still one step behind a publisher like Nintendo, or dare I say it, EA or Activision (not that I really love the business models of all companies listed).
Either way, I think Namco has a problem. If their contractual requirements were too low, that's their fault. If they hired a developer that was under-qualified to make the game they wanted, that's still Namco's fault. And who knows? Maybe Namco just wasn't willing to pay for enough man hours to make the game happen right.
There are so many variables not answered, but my gut instinct is to say Namco is more at fault than BR. Just my two cents plus (bailout-inflated) tax.
03/16/09
On the other hand, money (and big businesses) talks...
03/16/09
03/16/09
03/16/09
*shrugs*
03/16/09
Ramonskito commented on Patent Troll Lawsuit Begins on Tuesday
"By calling them patent trolls wouldn't that open Kotaku up to a defamation suit?"
[kotaku.com] 6:51 PM on Mar 15
Dude...wtf? I'm assuming then you're a lawyer? Oh forgive me...assumptions make an ass out of you and me right?
Regardless, I don't claim to know or be read up on the case we were discussing beforehand. It was just a simple comment and you ironically twisted it the wrong way.
:D
03/16/09
*snap snap*
*head jerk*
*snap snap snap jerk jerk snap jerk jerk snap snap jerk*
03/16/09
*jerk snap*
*BREAK*
03/16/09
03/06/09
Though, Amazon has the advantage of being the ubiquitous online store and are associated with the best deals. So maybe they have a fighting chance.
03/05/09
why not skip both offers and use a service like Goozex to trade directly with other gamers...haven't tried it yet, but I signed up and am looking at using them with the next game I finish up.
03/05/09
03/05/09
He's not commenting on third party sales on Amazon, he's commenting on their trade-in program.
As is with most used good, selling them yourself outright always nets you more.
03/05/09
I don't buy anything from Amazon so I can't really comment on thier services.
03/05/09
03/05/09
gamestop is my #1 enemy in games of all sorts of business
im sure a lot of you agree.
Their North American monopoly is too much now
especially in Canada
03/05/09
Monopoly? Are you sure you know what that word means?
You can get games, used and new, at Amazon or eBay or any number of online retailers? Or in brick and mortars like Best Buy, Wal-Mart, Target, and whatever their Canadian equivalents are.
Their used game sales allow them to stay in business as a niche game retailer and remain competitive with big box stores.
I honestly don't understand the widespread hatred for them, especially when it stems from a complete lack of understanding of basic retail economics.
But yeah, go ahead and root for yet another company to go out of business and more people to lose their jobs, and less options for gamers. That's awesome.
03/05/09
03/05/09
The only problem with Gamefly's trad-ins is that the credit can only be used to pay their subscription fees.
I think a lot of people who trade in games do so to get a new game, so that may not be attractive to them.
03/05/09
Fuck GameStop
I'd rather support Amazon then those greedy bastards
03/05/09
03/05/09
So many people. So little understanding of supply, demand, and basic retail economics.
These threads always wear me out.
03/05/09
03/05/09
03/05/09
Mmmm...maize
03/05/09
03/05/09
Note that Amazon is what Edge magazine asked him about. Don't read to much into it.
03/05/09
03/05/09
I wish people would take a moment to consider what would happen if the used price was more than $5.00 than the new price.
If current used sales are already harming publishers (a dubious claim at best), then increasing used sales by lowering their price would give people more incentive to buy used.
While I don't think Gamestop has altruistic motives at heart when determining their pricing, I do think that a side effect of keeping used prices close to new is that you maintain a higher level of new sales.