@jayntampa:
That's what I'm basically saying, just because she doesn't wear those things someone has to deduce she's a lesbian. Same thing could go for a guy in a game if he's not a space marine he must be gay undercover. There are a lot of personality types out there and just because people deviate from what some people consider the norm doesn't mean their a sissy or a butch.
It's probably hurtful to a lot of people when their categorized like that. like today I was at Home Depo and saw this chick in overalls buying electrical and studs (wood for framing) and I'm sure people probably call her a lesbian but we have no idea, why can't people just let people be interested in what their interested in and not categorize them? And if a guy likes colors and interior design it doesn't mean he gay. If your that type of person it can get annoying people jumping to conclusions.
So basically I was just saying how much of a bore this was to me, old dog, old tricks.
@jayntampa: But it's a boring choice. It's a safe choice. When it's already been done by Haloid, you're not breaking any ground.
It's nowhere as clever as the typical McSweeny's fare. But that's not a surprise, as that crowd all want to distance themselves from gaming as fast as possible. Ergo, they blow what could be really stinging, if they actually knew the underlying material.
@yeOldeTimeyGamer: That's ridiculous. We don't see her in her down time, she's working -- any woman that's working a dangerous job isn't going to be wearing a dress or something extremely feminine. That's called fan-service and it's much more derogatory than supposing Samus could be lesbian.
I don't think any of my lesbian friends would be insulted by Samus being considered gay.
And, it's hardly an old trick for video games since lesbians are generally shown as being OVER sexualized.
@AlucardsQuest:
Yeah because it's not like they've got form.
Hmm well Birdo is transsexual and Tingle is erm well I'm not sure what the hell Tingle is but I know I don't want it anywhere near me.
@[ZTF]NSF Operative: Honestly it really depends on how you read it.
What I took from it was not a mockery of the issue of gay marriage but rather a mockery of the way we argue about gay marriage and the overall senselessness of it being an issue in "Enlightened Society". It was a bit meager as far as chuckles go but it wasn't unintelligent.
I personally found it funny when it mentioned making laws that enable a self-replicating organism wanting to marry itself to do so, as it so obviously parallels with conservatives who claim that gay marriage will open up the doors to polygamy and polyandry etc etc..
I don't know maybe you saw
-VIDEO GAME CHARACTER-
and
-LESBIAN-
and assumed it was going to be either blatantly disrespectful or blatantly humorous.
@p.e.r.e.g.r.i.n.e.: I actually saw "satire" and assumed it to be illuminating. But Kaye dresses up tired remarks and observations with half-hearted gamer "humor". I understand what satire is, and this wasn't particularly good, which is why I found it to be mocking rather then satirical.
(DEAD) Goldwings - Remembered for his bravery and heroism... xD was starred
(DEAD) Goldwings - Remembered for his bravery and heroism... xD was unstarred
Curse_Lily promoted this comment
Edited by TheWP listens to Yukkuris; Takes it easy at 08/04/09 8:25 PM
TheWP listens to Yukkuris; Takes it easy was starred
TheWP listens to Yukkuris; Takes it easy was unstarred
@Curse_Lily:
Right then, I fully expect to see you do a bear armed with a cricket bat beating to death a bee in the next scribblenauts thread, or you know another nekkid lady would do fine.
(DEAD) Goldwings - Remembered for his bravery and heroism... xD was starred
(DEAD) Goldwings - Remembered for his bravery and heroism... xD was unstarred
I agree with the article, and think the other posters have done a good job of supporting it. Thanks, Kotakuites. :)
It is a shame that a "realistic female" is the exception to the rule. Right now I'm playing Mirror's Edge and really enjoying Faith. She doesn't play like a girl, or a guy, but a real person reacting to various situations, and I like that.
Women are as violent as men. It's just that the culture and history always put men doing violent stuff like going to war, hunting, and stuff. And it has something to do with the undisputed power that men had. And this has changed. Women have status now, they are leading some important roles on society and while this is good it also brings up their "violent" side.
Speaking of games, my girlfriend is way more violent than me. She is the one who wanted to buy Manhunt, she is the one who plays GTA only to screw the bitches and run over them to get their money back, she is obsessed with fatalities on MK, etc.
I guess seeing girls as "holy pacifist human beings" is just part of our old men sexism.
There are a lot of other things that play into this.
To address games like Fallout, I am going to posit that they can't count. They fall much under the category of Metroid, where the main character is, by-and-large, voiceless and somewhat faceless (they have faces, but you rarely see them). The association between gender and actions is nearly irrelevant in such a case, because the character stands as more of a shell to represent the player rather than a personality that can be readily identified as male or female.
I will also say that the worst fights I have seen have been between women. Not necessarily the bloodiest fights, but the most vicious (and I would attribute this to the damage-dealing capacity of men vs. women). It's purely anecdotal, I admit, but animosity seems to run far less deep between males who get into fisticuffs, and usually seems to pass by the time the fight's over. That said, the frequency of male fighting is greater (again, just anecdotal). It does, however, raise the question of quantity over quality.
I'm also going to go out on a limb and say that children will be less likely to report an abusive mother than an abusive father, just from having watched kids. An abusive father tends to seem to become emotionally detached, relying instead on physical domination. An abusive mother seems to use emotional attachment as an additional weapon. I saw this particularly in the case of a girl my old room mate was interested in, and her mother. There was physical abuse, though not on the level of what a man can inflict. It was coupled with heavy emotional trauma, however, and that connection could be used as a guilt trip into preventing a child from reporting it.
I don't think this is a case of the article getting lost in its own cleverness, as someone stated above. I think there are points that are obscured by the fact that it's a video game article, and the fact that it's little over a page long. There is simply not enough room in that sort of space to give such a topic the attention it necessitates.
That said, I'm not trying to invoke anyone's wrath with this post. I would rather that it raised some points of discussion. This is a touchy subject, and people get very defensive when it comes to gender identity and admitting what they are capable of doing. I think we've all met a girl at some point who believed there would be no war if women ran everything. Of course, we've also all met that guy who thinks men do everything best. They're both wrong, but I think somewhere in all of us there is at least a fragment of that mindset we have to subdue in order to properly analyze a situation like this.
@MisterFryGuy: That's right. But do you remember Catalina from San Andreas? She could be a female lead easily and is WAY more violent and vicious than Carl Johnson was.
@Daisuash: unfortunately it is believed that women aren't violent. So of course there aren't abused husbands, so the husbands that are abused never step forward so the statistics are low on it because it's never reported.
Yes, complete grammar fail there, but you get the point.
@Ajh: Absolutely true. I know some cases of domestic violence against men. But they never report it because they're afraid of what the cops are going to think.
@karaokequeen3: What about Konoko (Mai Hasegawa) of Oni? Or Alyx from the Half Life sequels? Rynn of Drakan, Cate Archer of No One Lives Forever, Mona Sax of Max Payne 2...
I was ready to scoff at this, but outside of fighting games, there really aren't many exceptions I can think of.
There's Thi Barrett and Lorelei Ni from Rise of the Triad, Generic Females from GTA1, and Catalina in GTA:SA. I know there's more, but that's all that comes to mind at the moment.
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08/04/09
And the only main character that doesn't wear a skirt? Lara Croft, Jade, Faith, and quite a few others would argue that point.
08/04/09
That's what I'm basically saying, just because she doesn't wear those things someone has to deduce she's a lesbian. Same thing could go for a guy in a game if he's not a space marine he must be gay undercover. There are a lot of personality types out there and just because people deviate from what some people consider the norm doesn't mean their a sissy or a butch.
It's probably hurtful to a lot of people when their categorized like that. like today I was at Home Depo and saw this chick in overalls buying electrical and studs (wood for framing) and I'm sure people probably call her a lesbian but we have no idea, why can't people just let people be interested in what their interested in and not categorize them? And if a guy likes colors and interior design it doesn't mean he gay. If your that type of person it can get annoying people jumping to conclusions.
So basically I was just saying how much of a bore this was to me, old dog, old tricks.
08/04/09
It's nowhere as clever as the typical McSweeny's fare. But that's not a surprise, as that crowd all want to distance themselves from gaming as fast as possible. Ergo, they blow what could be really stinging, if they actually knew the underlying material.
08/05/09
I don't think any of my lesbian friends would be insulted by Samus being considered gay.
And, it's hardly an old trick for video games since lesbians are generally shown as being OVER sexualized.
08/04/09
08/04/09
Yeah because it's not like they've got form.
Hmm well Birdo is transsexual and Tingle is erm well I'm not sure what the hell Tingle is but I know I don't want it anywhere near me.
08/04/09
08/04/09
I just found the article to err on the side of rolleyes.gif is all.
08/04/09
What I took from it was not a mockery of the issue of gay marriage but rather a mockery of the way we argue about gay marriage and the overall senselessness of it being an issue in "Enlightened Society". It was a bit meager as far as chuckles go but it wasn't unintelligent.
I personally found it funny when it mentioned making laws that enable a self-replicating organism wanting to marry itself to do so, as it so obviously parallels with conservatives who claim that gay marriage will open up the doors to polygamy and polyandry etc etc..
I don't know maybe you saw
-VIDEO GAME CHARACTER-
and
-LESBIAN-
and assumed it was going to be either blatantly disrespectful or blatantly humorous.
08/04/09
08/04/09
08/04/09
>_>
Her Zero suit :)
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08/04/09
You pull them out so fast.
Hmm... That sounded wrong.
New lines are broken again?
08/04/09
08/04/09
08/04/09
Right then, I fully expect to see you do a bear armed with a cricket bat beating to death a bee in the next scribblenauts thread, or you know another nekkid lady would do fine.
08/04/09
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08/04/09
( . Y . )
08/05/09
08/04/09
08/04/09
08/04/09
Once upon a time...
08/04/09
@octalass: Samus giggles. The end.
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@adoggz: Maybe she did :)
11/16/08
It is a shame that a "realistic female" is the exception to the rule. Right now I'm playing Mirror's Edge and really enjoying Faith. She doesn't play like a girl, or a guy, but a real person reacting to various situations, and I like that.
11/16/08
Women are as violent as men. It's just that the culture and history always put men doing violent stuff like going to war, hunting, and stuff. And it has something to do with the undisputed power that men had. And this has changed. Women have status now, they are leading some important roles on society and while this is good it also brings up their "violent" side.
Speaking of games, my girlfriend is way more violent than me. She is the one who wanted to buy Manhunt, she is the one who plays GTA only to screw the bitches and run over them to get their money back, she is obsessed with fatalities on MK, etc.
I guess seeing girls as "holy pacifist human beings" is just part of our old men sexism.
11/15/08
To address games like Fallout, I am going to posit that they can't count. They fall much under the category of Metroid, where the main character is, by-and-large, voiceless and somewhat faceless (they have faces, but you rarely see them). The association between gender and actions is nearly irrelevant in such a case, because the character stands as more of a shell to represent the player rather than a personality that can be readily identified as male or female.
I will also say that the worst fights I have seen have been between women. Not necessarily the bloodiest fights, but the most vicious (and I would attribute this to the damage-dealing capacity of men vs. women). It's purely anecdotal, I admit, but animosity seems to run far less deep between males who get into fisticuffs, and usually seems to pass by the time the fight's over. That said, the frequency of male fighting is greater (again, just anecdotal). It does, however, raise the question of quantity over quality.
I'm also going to go out on a limb and say that children will be less likely to report an abusive mother than an abusive father, just from having watched kids. An abusive father tends to seem to become emotionally detached, relying instead on physical domination. An abusive mother seems to use emotional attachment as an additional weapon. I saw this particularly in the case of a girl my old room mate was interested in, and her mother. There was physical abuse, though not on the level of what a man can inflict. It was coupled with heavy emotional trauma, however, and that connection could be used as a guilt trip into preventing a child from reporting it.
I don't think this is a case of the article getting lost in its own cleverness, as someone stated above. I think there are points that are obscured by the fact that it's a video game article, and the fact that it's little over a page long. There is simply not enough room in that sort of space to give such a topic the attention it necessitates.
That said, I'm not trying to invoke anyone's wrath with this post. I would rather that it raised some points of discussion. This is a touchy subject, and people get very defensive when it comes to gender identity and admitting what they are capable of doing. I think we've all met a girl at some point who believed there would be no war if women ran everything. Of course, we've also all met that guy who thinks men do everything best. They're both wrong, but I think somewhere in all of us there is at least a fragment of that mindset we have to subdue in order to properly analyze a situation like this.
11/15/08
This article is a freaking stretch, lost in it's own 'clever' prose, and ultimately failing to make points of any significance.
11/15/08
11/16/08
11/15/08
11/15/08
Yes, complete grammar fail there, but you get the point.
11/16/08
11/15/08
And there's Bloodrayne - as female as you can get, while merrily slaying vampires.
So I personally can't see a specific expectation that female characters necessarily have to be non-violent/passive.
11/15/08
11/16/08
Just a handful from my gaming shelf...
11/15/08
There's Thi Barrett and Lorelei Ni from Rise of the Triad, Generic Females from GTA1, and Catalina in GTA:SA. I know there's more, but that's all that comes to mind at the moment.