Most of those blindly and wildly embracing this idea haven't thought beyond the noses on their faces, probably ever.

I feel very much the same way as you.

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But Sony is effectively killing the used games market. -walls99

So how is that a good thing for gamers?

If SONY and the retailers are still making theirs, the price is unlikely to come down, and lets be honest, shareholders really aren't interested in dropping prices anyway.

So basically, you're fucking over gamers who want to sell their used games or trade them in.

And you're applauding this?

I weep for our future.

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What makes you think the UMD will be there? Those things are shoddy. Crappy little enclosures that can mess up the psps ability to play the game at all.

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For the same reason I can still buy used NES games but some digitally distributed games from Xbox Live! and the PSN are already gone for good.

I think your argument that the physical case of some UMD is a problem is a bad counter for Vidunder's irrefutable assertion that the servers will not be available for these games in 20 years.

All digital is a plague for legitimate retro-gaming.

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Not to mention digital distribution means games could cost considerably less since they would have very little cost to put the games out there.

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And speaking of the price of MP3s and their price, you mentioned that digital distribution for games would make them generally less expensive to purchase? I doubt that because businesses don't work that way. Remember when the price of gas went up and so the price of goods went up? then the price of gas wen't down and the price of goods stayed the same and companies just pocketed the extra money they were getting (as an example) charging 3 dollers for a loaf of bread? An album on MP3 Even if they didn't pocket it, they would just blow it on pumping more uneccesary production values into their games so they could continue the age old pissing match of video game technical development.

The industry should decide to entrench themselves in "outdated ideals" because when people have jobs they can spend it on superficial entertainment like video games. When people don't have jobs, games are not quite a priority when compared to rent or food. How many people in those tent cities do you think decided "ah screw the house, I'll keep my iPhone and download the new Katamari instead"?

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1. itunes is the no.1 music retailer IN THE WORLD. So whether or not you personally are willing to buy the mp3s is rather inconsequential. its about convenience weighed against quality, and at the end of the day so they can carry it around in their pocket many people

2. games on steam cost less than retail copies, that is a fact.

so yea. about all those points you made...

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...many people are willing to make that tradeoff. Even the most hardened audiophiles i know realize their lossless encoded lifestyle is fading away. the standard for music today is mp3 and aac.

ill take my 320kbs/44hz mp3s.

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You missing the choice, though. Yes, things are available digitally, music, movies, and books, but every single one of them is almost entirely also available physically.

I have no problem with them offering a game digitally, but if there is no physical copy, I won't be buying it.

1. itunes is the no.1 music retailer IN THE WORLD... -Azures

That's a skewed talking point. There is very little in the way of competition in the digital music market, but there is a lot of competition in the CD market. It's hard for one vendor to gain the competitive edge in CD sales that iTunes has in digital music sales.

It is true that digital music is on the rise while CD sales are dropping, but I think that's more indicative of radio culture that is song driven.

As such, I think digital music makes a horrible comparison for digital movies or games. I might be fine with a single from an album, but I'm not going to be satisfied with just one chapter from a book or 10 minutes of a movie, or the first hour of a game.

...many people are willing to make that tradeoff. -Azures

I think you overestimate that number because you're willing to. And as far as audiophiles go, they're going old school. Vinyl sales are up over several quarters.

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Would you consider people who buy mp3s from itunes or those who download games from Steam as not owning that media?

Digital ownership is still ownership.

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Minus transference rights, which matter to a lot of people.

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Yes, you are right; I don't consider people buying games from Steam to actually own their games, which is exactly the reason I've never bought anything on Steam despite those sometimes-awesome prices (mostly they are too high).

As for iTunes, I can't say. AFAIK their DRM is pretty restricting in the end but on the other hand that DRM ought to be pretty much easier to get rid of. Besides, creating a personal backup that requires no online activation is easier (I think; I still don't KNOW very much about iTunes shop).

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AFAIK their DRM is pretty restricting...

As of last week, all of their songs are DRM free, but most players other than the iPod lack AAC support.

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And anyone without access to high speed internet.

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The only reason they do it now is because few people go over the bandwidth caps. Usually just us unfortunate tech nerds who are fond of downloading. The normal masses won't stand for getting nickle and dimed that way. Especially when other ISPs start using a lack of those fees as a selling point against their competition, kinda like how cell phone providers started doing. And what do we have there now? Unlimited data plans coming standard.

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The only reason they do it now is because few people go over the bandwidth caps. -Azures

The main reason bandwidth caps were implemented was to limit the amount of software and media pirated via torrents.

Back when most piracy was via newsgroups or FTP, very few people went over the cap. Once torrents opened up the floodgates of piracy for every Tom, Dick, or Harry who could execute a Google search, the ISPs fought back by capping bandwidth.

So thank the lousy pirates.

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Your priorities are not everyone's. You may rank having internet access above playing games, but others may not. A significant chunk of the United States only has access to dial-up to begin with, so it's not a question of priorities, but simply access.

C'mon, people...think beyond your own personal situation. It's funny how people with so much information at their fingertips can still be constrained by self-imposed rules.

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So I'll eat my original words. Yummy. *blerg

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The PSP was released as a purely digital device, so it's nothing like the OnLive in that sense.

It's more if they said OnLive would be disc-based to begin with and THEN become what it really is.

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You're against a used market for games?

Why?

Are you equally against used markets for other products? Books? Movies? Houses? Cars?

I'll never understand why people who claim to be gamers are so inexplicably against their right to sell and buy used copies of games. If you have a coherent reason, by all means, let us know.

If it's nothing but reflexive, anti-Gamestop gibberish, go lay in a highway.

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I think you're being naive if you think digital distribution and the lack of a used games market will lead to cheaper games.

Do you think shareholders will get less greedy because of those things? That's the real question you have to ask yourself.

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You can't really use the 'claim to be gamers' whine when the 'gamers' are the ones that choose to pay full whack in order to support the developers instead of line the game store's pockets just to save five dollars.

If that sounds like gibberish, then I think it may be you that needs a lie down. :)

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To begin with, the used game market is not limited to Gamestop, but that's the conclusion so many leap to when discussing used gaming, and there is so much anti-Gamestop sentiment (admittedly, some of it deserved), that gamers are hopping eager at the chance to hurt them, even if it means limiting their own consumer rights and options.

Honestly, the argument that people who buy, sell, and trade used games don't support the developer is bullshit. Some people buy all new, some all used, but I'll be most of us buy a mix of both, especially with older, harder to find games.

I have never seen another industry rail against a used market the way so many gamers do. It's so curious, and, even when asked directly, all you can do is get defensive.

I'm a gamer. My goal is to maximize my playing time and purchasing power. If that means I have to sell used games and buy some used games, then, at least for now, that's my prerogative. So, I'll ask again, what is your coherent reason for espousing your happiness at the contemplated death of the used games market?

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They could sell me a UMD in a cheap cardboard envelope. It would be cheap, but it would work. They'll never sell me a digital download voucher in a plastic box with (I'm assuming) an instruction manual.

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@Cloral: I fail to see what that has to do with the (over)-packaging of the game. 'in some form' could be a highly visible POP fixture full of cards that give you a code for DL-ing the game. I bet there's clever, cheap ways around it.

@icarusprime: Have you ever done customer service? That is the only way to do it that makes you not wanna go home and extinguish a 6pack. Most undervalued service in the economy. People who deal with The Public (terrible, terrible beasts) should get paid what CPAs do. when I think of what I had to smile as I said to people today... urrrgh!

@smcallah: best answer that i've heard so far. I still hate it, but it's a good answer. Worst that I can say about it is that it prolongs the time that games that are sold in this fashion will have to have a plastic box to stay visible. I bet the answer boils down to a combination of this and what I said to Cloral. Someday, the smartest company in the market will work the POP fixture to their benefit...

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I'm not. I won't be buying Patapon 2 because of this, and I won't buy a physical media free device. Call me crazy, but I want the ability to lend, trade, and sell my games and even buy them used.

I'm less thrilled about losing a tiny memory stick or having a hard drive crash wipe out my entire game collection.

Sure, if it happens next week, I could download them again. But what if it happens in 10 years?

Digital media is fine for mini games and extra content, but I think too much of the market is either opposed to digital only or shut off completely from it by lack of internet access.

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