If Champions Online has taught us anything, it's that microtransactions can be done in a way that have nothing to do with game play. You can buy action figures etc (that don't increase your in game skills) and that's about it.
I signed up for the testing earlier. I honestly don't care how I have to pay for it, I simply can't wait for The Old Republic. Bring on the Sith for me to cut down in the name of the Jedi Order!
@Drogmir: Agree. It's Okay if it's a PVE type game but when a MMO features PVP, a mall that has the potential to make you a overpowered player before you even create a character is a bit much.
Though I admit I enjoy that mall games do make a game free, you give and you take.
@Heliophage: Even the CU was still fun. I wish another game would be at least that good. I miss my days mining for hours then spending time in the Mos Eisley Cantina crafting new and interesting items.
I have hope that it will be an enjoyable experience, but I doubt anything will have the freedom of the playerbase to create so much of the entertainment as we did in Star Wars Galaxies. Between the crafting, the player houses and cities, and the unique player events that we started on our own -- some of which would bring in millions of credits from those in attendance -- Star Wars Galaxies was more, in a lot of ways, than any MMO since has been.
The Old Republic will be amazing, I have no doubt, but it will be different almost certainly.
@Jolan- needs something witty to put here: I've dabbled in 4th Edition D&D, but I don't play it a lot, I just read the literature. I used to play 3rd Edition (I absolutely loved oriental adventures campaigns) and I currently play the Saga Edition of the Star Wars RPG - Rodian Scoundrels for the win =D
@Jolan- needs something witty to put here: God, I wish I could get some fucking people to play Shadowrun with me around here. Sadly, all of my friends play D&D, and I just don't find it as interesting.
@Ursus-Veritas: In the latest star wars campaign I climbed a Chyrsalide Rancor and using dual lightsabers stabbed him through the top of the skull. good times
@Jolan- needs something witty to put here: Dammit, I wouldn't know! I have never played it before with anyone. I have the books, as well as a good storyline for a game. Hopefully one of these days I'll find someone who actually wants to play the game, lol.
@xAnarChisTx: good luck with that. Two of my favorite shadowrun stories: Both members of our party were trolls, and we show up to meet the Johnson and get our mission. Friend shows up first and sees an angry dwarf with a big gun, beats the crap out of him. I show up, knowing my friend has arrived and see a bloodied dwarf struggling to his feet. I kick him and roll waaaaay too well, killing him. I shove the dwarf into his dwarf sized car, rip open the roof, and drive towards some nearby cliffs, where I wedge the accelerator down using the dwarf's head. Then I rendesvous at the meet to have the Johnson tell us our third member, a dwarf, has yet to show up.
Another time we were supposed to break into a place and get a password for a computer we had previously stolen. Halfway into the heist all hell breaks loose, so I charge my way into the room, find the password, memorize text it to myself and see a bunch of guys with stun guns who will undoubtedly try to capture me. At this point I verify with the GM that I purchased the highest Docwagon, which clones you, he says yes. I turn to the rest of the party, say "See ya on the outside" and stick my pistol in my mouth. I wake up in a cloned body while the rest of the party gets thrown in a private company owned jail.
@Jolan- needs something witty to put here: Old school DM here. I started playing @83ish. Played basic DD, Star Frontiers, Indianna Jones RPG, Advance D&D, Call of Cthulu(2nd ed by wizards of the coast), Wraith, Cyberpunk, Cyber Gen, and when I quit D&D 3rd. I quit probably 3 years ago. It was too time consuming to keep up with people to make sure they would show up to session and when we got there they acted like a bunch of premaddonas that grumbled when they didn't get their way. Kind of sucky, cause I was very proud of my Resident Evil Campaign that I was running at the time using the Call of Cthulu engine.
As far as Shadow run: My only game I played was we were supposed to break into a corp building and grab some sort of data for some guy in a bar. Yes.. that's how the GM told us. I was a street sam, so I said "Ok going to grab an armored truck and ram down the back gate, rush the building to take them by surprise."
GM: no you can't do that. Me: Why? GM: Because their's a hanglider shop next to the building that you have to use hangliders to come of and go to the roof of building.
I looked at that guy.. but the game ceased 30 mins afterwards when he ran out of ideas. So ya.. Shadowrun is great if your GM knows what to do.
@Syftx2: I have only GMed once, a D&D campaign. Very basic layout. Big dungeon full of traps and illusions, with an artifact in the middle. Guys make it all the way through to the middle room which has a long rope bridge over to a largeish pedestal that has something on it. deep beneath the bridge is a vile, viscous green go. One of the morons in the party says "Everything else has been an illusion" and jumps off the bridge. The stuff was acid, and the bridge was 20ish feet above the surface and I was like... there's no saving roll for that. Sorry. Then he started cussing and stormed out, ending my only GM experience so far.
@Jolan- needs something witty to put here: I have played pen and paper RPGs for years, mostly because I grew up on them. Started with 1st edition AD&D and have played and/or ran 2nd ed. AD&D, 3rd/3.5 D&D, RIFTS, 2nd ed. Shadowrun, Spycraft, and Necromunda and Blood Bowl (such as those can be played/ran as miniature games go). Magic the Gathering was also in there amongst a host of other games like Lunch Money, etc. I stayed away from the larger miniature-oriented games like Warhammer and WH40K due to the investment required (both time and money).
For the most part, the paper-based RPGs and miniature games bring social and imagination aspects in that I do not derive from their MMO counterparts. Not saying that you can't be social or have an imagination with MMOs, but the feeling, imho, is very different. Good times.
This is totally a death knell for PS3. They've had years to catch up, especially since they're giving the service away for free!
Goes to show you, making expensive software and being hard to code on (all of Kaz's dillusions aside) is a losing strategy when pitted against a console planned to take over the multiplayer market (Halo 3 and Gears).
All it takes is one more price drop to have Sony on the ropes. God of War III better be the miracle they're hoping for... LBP was only a blip on the screen compared to the marketing money they through at it...
@midniteavatar: Yeah boy, especially when you consider that Microsoft have had to drop the price of their machine drastically over the year and now are going to give up on their best 360 because they know it won't compete with the PS3.
GOW3 isn't the flag ship brand, GT5 is. More importantly neither will be big enough on their own but both together mixed with a price drop and all the other first party titles in development will swing it for them. It's just a matter of time - and Sony have several price drops left, where as Microsoft will be giving it away if they want to keep the lead.
Considering you don't need a PSN account to do anything on the system except play online and access the Playstation Store, probably a significant percentage, not counting duplicate accounts for multi-region downloading.
Because WoW alone would totally dominate everything else on the list without even trying. There's no reason to include it when the outcome is that obvious.
It's the only service that I can collectively get all my gaming friends from the past 2 decades to use. And strangely enough, it's the only one we have to pay for, go figure.
The shear ease of use XBL offers me, a gamer who highly enjoys playing games online with friends, is 2nd to none.
If it weren't for CO-OP being such a new trend and developers having Party Systems with their Online MP games, I don't think i'd be as into gaming as I am now.
It'd just be a few really good SP experiences and that's about it.
I hear ya. These days, co-op is a HUGE selling point for me. Games like Halo, Gears, L4D... hell, even to a lesser extent, RA3 and Halo Wars... one of the best things about them is co-op. Playing with a buddy instead of against a buddy is pretty dope.
Thats why my PS3 kinda makes me sad. I mean, I guess theres team based FPSes, but I was kinda hoping more co-op would be implemented in the games, yanno? I love KZ2, but wheres my co-op you bastards?!?
Co-op can be a good thing, as long as it stays the fuck out of my plot-based RPGs. They've already been infected by the "moe" virus. I won't stand for the Halo generation raping what little is left of my childhood.
That's what MMOs are for. I'd rather story-focused games remain single player. It's impossible to take a storyline seriously when one of your friends is teabagging an NPC while they're trying to talk.
As for Mass Effect...meh. It's not KotOR 3, so it's useless to me.
Nah, I'm just not a shooter fan. I like melee combat, and Mass Effect removed any glimpse of that, replacing it with cookie-cutter pea-shooter guns without so much as a smidgen of solid design or creativity attached to them. And before you ask, yes, I've played and beaten the game. Got the Completionist achievement, in fact.
While it might not be the most original or innovative game in the universe, a new KotOR would at least have a story I'm interested in seeing completed, which Mass Effect has not offered me.
As Fallible says, there are some genres that just don't lend themselves well to co-op. Survival horror, for one, as well as narrative-driven RPGs, would both be hampered by the presence of another player. Co-op works for some games, but not all of them.
@Archaotic: I won't stand for the Halo generation raping what little is left of my childhood.
You and me both. I'm really not liking the way the video game industry is headed. Seems like developers are willing to sacrifice what made their games popular in the first place to appeal to people who hadn't even been born when the original was released. I feel like 10 years older than I am in relation to the game industry lately.
Exactly how I'm feeling lately, and as it stands, this is probably my last console generation unless things drastically improve. Which I don't see happening, considering how bad the global economy has become.
Try playing Silent Hill by yourself, then try playing the exact same game with a friend looking over your shoulder and talking the entire time. The fear factor is all but non-existent once there's someone else in the room. You might still get a jump if something pops out of nowhere, but the tension and unease of playing a horror game solo is completely eliminated if there's someone else WATCHING you play, let alone playing it with you.
Simplest put, some games, co-op works for them and improves the experience. Crackdown, for example. Decently fun in single-player, but VASTLY more entertaining with a buddy. I don't think Final Fantasy, on the other hand, would be nearly as engrossing when played cooperatively.
@Archaotic: lol, then you might as well start packing up your gaming hobby right now.
Funny thing, Silent Hill 1, along with RE1, 2, 3, were all played with a friend. Back in the day when I didn't own a PS1, i'd go to my friends house once and awhile and he'd let me play them. I loved them, and I still jumped at certain parts. But the overall fear was never there for me. Even when I did end up owning all the SH & RE titles and played alone at midnight in a pitch black room. But I grew up watching horror movies while others were watching saturday morning cartoons.
Anyway, I played the RE5 demo well over 50 times and it was fun each and every time. I got a huge list of friends to play with in the game, plus tons of unlockables & Mercs to look forward to.
Again, i'm not some bitchy little gamer who looks at the negatives. Capcom created a great game and it will be the most sold RE title, no doubt about it. PS3 & 360 release, day & date, yeah, it's going to be big.
I'm sure RE5 will do well. I'm not saying it won't. But it's not a Resident Evil game anymore. It's a co-op third person shooter with Wesker in it. Some people might like that.
Hell, I'm buying the game on Friday because two of my friends won't shut up about playing it online. But it's not survival horror, and from what I've played of the demo, it's not Resident Evil. Maybe the story will be hilarious campy bullshit like RE4 and that will appeal to me, but the gameplay sure hasn't.
We'll just have to wait until Friday, now won't we? I'm willing to accept I'm wrong if, after I beat the game, Sheva is completely non-intrusive, never once runs out of all of my ammo or gets me killed in a stupid manner. Sound good?
And besides, at the very least, Mercenaries Mode should be fun. Here's hoping Wesker's as awesome to play as in this one as he was in RE4. Now, I have to go buy some groceries. Good discussion; though you really don't need to resort to name-calling, I'm not mad at you and you shouldn't be mad at me. Differences in opinion are an inevitability in an industry as big as this one.
@Sir-Lucius: The industry is heading down two cliffs, one cliff for casuals and another for the aptly named Halo generation.
Its ironic, the Halo generation complains about casual games killing REAL, or PROPER, or HARDCORE gaming when the type of games they want butchers the things that made older games good.
I'm much more concerned about these new "hardcore" gamers than I am of casual gamers. Casual gamers get their own type of games that suit their tastes, they can exist separately. "Hardcore" gamers twist and warp the games I like to suit their tastes.
@Archaotic: I agree with you on Mass Effect. Where the hell was the RPG portion of it? Lol. All I was able to do was shoot, and select what abilities for my comrades, who were utterly useless, to use. I wont even get into the uninspired armor/customization system. A huge letdown from some of the things shown far before the games release, such as actually selecting where your members could take cover and such from the pause screen.
Quite frankly it felt to me like a bad shooter with a good story. I have no problem supporting a good shooter with a crappy story, but I be damned if I support a bad shooter with a good story, Lol. BioWare, please add some RPG to Mass Effect 2, bring back all the stuff you stripped from the first one; and VATS, LoL.
Agreed. Mass Effect was a victim of its own hype to a massive degree, but since it's a BioWare game, it got a free pass for a lot of it. It's not a bad game by any stretch of the imagination, but compared what it was publicized to be, it's a total letdown.
Hopefully ME2 fixes some of the cuts they made, gets a working version of UE3 to go with it, and preferably takes the story in an UNEXPECTED direction. I'm pretty sure I already know where the story is headed from here, and if the finale ends up revolving around Shepard and crew hijacking a Sovereign ship to take against its brethren, I'm going to jam my skull through the floor in the ultimate facefault.
I'm not at all surprised that the Wii is in second. Mario Kart and Smash bros have both sold 10 million+ copies right? Even if a minority of the owners are playing that online that is still a lot of people.
Valid point. I can't personally think of anyone who still plays either of those games at this point, but that doesn't mean other people aren't.
I can't see Smash having much of a dedicated online community nowadays though due to all the lag. Seems like too much of a hassle to get a good, solid game going; it's easier to just call some friends and have them come over.
I played both Smash and Kart online the other night, giving my 360 a rest for a bit. Smash online in random matches without friends is indeed horrible, but with friends it's as great as it is locally... We actually set it up so we talked over Xbox Live while playing Smash, so we didn't even miss out on the shit-talking.
Kart is always solid, and casuals will play it online as well.
Also, I've discovered there's a robust Tetris community online, of all things. It too a great hit with the casuals... my GF and i have wasted far too much time playing it recently.
I never did understand how Nintendo fucked up Brawl's netcode. If they were to release a new version of the game with NO CHANGES other than new, working netcode (oh, and Geno), I'd re-buy it in a heartbeat.
Because when you take that attitude, you're basically admitting, without question, to be a blatant fanboy. There are games on PS3 worth playing, quite a few of them in fact. If you're willingly passing all of that up and still call yourself a gamer, you're a fuckhead.
Be fair. Lots of Wii owners will go 'Oh Im a Gamer!' but the system doesn't get used for anything besides Wii Sports, Wii Play, and Wii-third-party-bargain-bin-shovelware-that-uncle-al-bought-as-a-christmas-gift
@Archaotic: There are plenty of people out there who don't have interest in playing PS3 games that own the console. Not all of them are "fuckheads", lol.
Sure, if they feel the need to upset you by purposely saying it lacks games & act like a fanboy, then fine, curse away.
But just be glad they supported the PS3 in the first place, i'd say.
What's the point in owning a system if you're not using it? Why would you spend that much money and not play games on it? It's not like it's going to HURT you to play LittleBigPlanet. Believe me, I've tried.
If you own the system, you're only doing it, and yourself, a disservice by taking the closed-minded fanboy approach and only using it as a blu-ray player. I don't use my 360 that much anymore since it became a portal to Silent Hill, but I don't just call it my "Netflix Box". It's stupid. Every system has games worth playing on it.
See as much as people on 'sides' of some 'fanwar' might hate to admit it, if someone owns a 360, theres almost a 100 percent chance they actually do 'game', as opposed to just have the system.
The PS3 can be sold on the blu-ray, with gaming as a secondary.
The Wii can be sold because its chic and 'in' to have one for your family, with gaming as a secondary (har har har)
The 360... what the hell does it offer besides a DVD player and portable media center? The former people already usually have, and the latter is usually too complicated for the average joe to bother trying to set up. So... gaming is the primary.
But thats besides the point. The PS3 has way more awesome and FUNCTIONAL games that work online than the Wii does. Is this a case of Wii owners being too stupid to know that Super Smash Bros is fundamentally broken with lag so they keep firing it online anyways? Or not caring that everyones pokemon on BR is Action Replayed garbage (god I hearted that game, until three days after it was out and it was no fun to face three shiny mewtwos).
Mario Kart I guess makes sense. I love the shit out of it, even to this day.
MK Wii would be better if they scaled online matches back to 8 players. I'm not too big a fan of the whole '12-person race' thing. Too many projectiles on screen at once. Kinda kills the balance, which is too bad, because the controls (Classic Controller, yo!) and gameplay themselves are top notch.
And yeah, I agree, there are definitely some people (parents, especially) who own a PS3 just as a blu-ray player. But they also don't go onto forums and talk about how big gamers they are. I'm ripping on the people who have the gall to call themselves serious gamers, own a PS3, and then only use it for blu-ray. They're idiots or fanboys.
@Komrade Kayce: Hero of Soviet Kotaku: I'd say the fact that the PS3 isn't in third place is because this is NPD and tracking only american numbers is not a good way to measure the success PS3 vs. 360 vs. Wii seeing as the PS3 is underperforming there
@Archaotic: Seriously, why is it that you peeps always PRESUME that just because you like the games, everyone else has to? Yes the PS3 has a lot of great games, but they all have a certain taste they appeal to. Most people aren't going to plop $60-$70 on a game that they are unsure of their enjoyment. I look at Bioshock and Assassin's Creed on my game shelf and know how it feels to get burned by mob anticipation. Plus not everyone is an avid gamer, at the time they bought a PS3 they just wanted a cheap BR player.
Again; if they bought the PS3 and actively call themselves gamers, they're idiots for not using it. If you post here on Kotaku, you're not a casual gamer. There's no excuse.
@Archaotic: Come on, that makes no sense >:( You're making the assumptions that people who use the PS3 as a bluray player (first) own other consoles and (secondly) you assume they have some kind of bias because they may play games on these other consoles they own; (lastly) worst of all, you insinuate they're idiots for using the consoles they bought for their intended purposes. Sony markets the PS3 as a bluray player... as the best bluray player even so if anyone is cannibalizing it's market, it's Sony. Don't blame consumers who gave up hard earned money because they don't make the numbers come out the way you like. You're better then that.
Microtransactions are fast becoming the norm, and I for one don't mind them. If you have the money, or free time, you should be allowed to advance your character in directions suitable to you - I can envision a time where games without such features will feel as if they are on 'rails.'
That said, I disagree with games such as HOME, and the Live dashboard (I am aware that neither are games - most especially the Live dashboard), charging fees for avatar customisation that, in no way, enhance- or increase - the games lifespan.
Gaming as a hobby is completely intangible. We can't show any sort of trophy to the real world to show how good we are or what we can accomplish. Sure there are tournaments with awards as well as pro gamers, but I'm talking about you and me -- the "normal" people of gaming.
Every sport has its exceptional athlete; we are the norm, or even the intramural gamers so to speak. We don't play pro, we play for fun and recreation.
So whether we spend our money on fake items, grind for fake items, or even buying the games themselves, it's all digital improvement. Mostly in our minds and the minds of our friends who enjoy the same games.
Maybe one day I can cash my Gamerscore points in for something -- like a discount towards a new game. It's only furthering the analogy, but hey, it's my hobby of choice. There's not much I'd rather spend money on than technology/gadgets/games/geek toys.
10/01/09
SOMEONE ACTUALLY READ THE TOS.
10/01/09
Let's wait for the full story.
10/01/09
*Brandishes Lightsaber*
10/01/09
10/01/09
Though I admit I enjoy that mall games do make a game free, you give and you take.
06/30/09
CU destroyed my faith in SOE. NGE nearly destroyed my faith in MMOs.
06/30/09
06/30/09
I was still around after CU. I didn't quit until after NGE. Both hit me particularly hard, as an entertainer.
@rogue32:
I have hope that it will be an enjoyable experience, but I doubt anything will have the freedom of the playerbase to create so much of the entertainment as we did in Star Wars Galaxies. Between the crafting, the player houses and cities, and the unique player events that we started on our own -- some of which would bring in millions of credits from those in attendance -- Star Wars Galaxies was more, in a lot of ways, than any MMO since has been.
The Old Republic will be amazing, I have no doubt, but it will be different almost certainly.
06/18/09
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06/18/09
Another time we were supposed to break into a place and get a password for a computer we had previously stolen. Halfway into the heist all hell breaks loose, so I charge my way into the room, find the password, memorize text it to myself and see a bunch of guys with stun guns who will undoubtedly try to capture me. At this point I verify with the GM that I purchased the highest Docwagon, which clones you, he says yes. I turn to the rest of the party, say "See ya on the outside" and stick my pistol in my mouth. I wake up in a cloned body while the rest of the party gets thrown in a private company owned jail.
06/18/09
06/18/09
As far as Shadow run: My only game I played was we were supposed to break into a corp building and grab some sort of data for some guy in a bar. Yes.. that's how the GM told us. I was a street sam, so I said "Ok going to grab an armored truck and ram down the back gate, rush the building to take them by surprise."
GM: no you can't do that.
Me: Why?
GM: Because their's a hanglider shop next to the building that you have to use hangliders to come of and go to the roof of building.
I looked at that guy.. but the game ceased 30 mins afterwards when he ran out of ideas. So ya.. Shadowrun is great if your GM knows what to do.
06/18/09
06/18/09
For the most part, the paper-based RPGs and miniature games bring social and imagination aspects in that I do not derive from their MMO counterparts. Not saying that you can't be social or have an imagination with MMOs, but the feeling, imho, is very different. Good times.
06/18/09
03/10/09
03/10/09
Goes to show you, making expensive software and being hard to code on (all of Kaz's dillusions aside) is a losing strategy when pitted against a console planned to take over the multiplayer market (Halo 3 and Gears).
All it takes is one more price drop to have Sony on the ropes. God of War III better be the miracle they're hoping for... LBP was only a blip on the screen compared to the marketing money they through at it...
03/10/09
GOW3 isn't the flag ship brand, GT5 is. More importantly neither will be big enough on their own but both together mixed with a price drop and all the other first party titles in development will swing it for them. It's just a matter of time - and Sony have several price drops left, where as Microsoft will be giving it away if they want to keep the lead.
03/10/09
"The survey data was then weighted to represent the U.S. population of individuals ages 2 and older. Fieldwork was conducted from January 6-26, 2009.:
US survey shows 360 in positive light - shocker. Fortunately for Sony that's just 1 country and not the world.
03/10/09
03/10/09
Considering you don't need a PSN account to do anything on the system except play online and access the Playstation Store, probably a significant percentage, not counting duplicate accounts for multi-region downloading.
03/10/09
I'm willing to bet the PC is in the 80 to 90% range. It's still the online medium of choice imo.
03/10/09
Because WoW alone would totally dominate everything else on the list without even trying. There's no reason to include it when the outcome is that obvious.
03/10/09
It's the only service that I can collectively get all my gaming friends from the past 2 decades to use. And strangely enough, it's the only one we have to pay for, go figure.
The shear ease of use XBL offers me, a gamer who highly enjoys playing games online with friends, is 2nd to none.
If it weren't for CO-OP being such a new trend and developers having Party Systems with their Online MP games, I don't think i'd be as into gaming as I am now.
It'd just be a few really good SP experiences and that's about it.
03/10/09
Ahh, we can dream, can't we?
03/10/09
I hear ya. These days, co-op is a HUGE selling point for me. Games like Halo, Gears, L4D... hell, even to a lesser extent, RA3 and Halo Wars... one of the best things about them is co-op. Playing with a buddy instead of against a buddy is pretty dope.
Thats why my PS3 kinda makes me sad. I mean, I guess theres team based FPSes, but I was kinda hoping more co-op would be implemented in the games, yanno? I love KZ2, but wheres my co-op you bastards?!?
03/10/09
I would of never thought, a bunch of years ago, that i'd be playing RESIDENT EVIL online with a friend through my Xbox. I'm truly amazed.
Playing a game Co-op is the best, it can even make a mediocre game (Mercenaries 2) into a good & fun experience.
Keep it coming developers!
I want to play EVERYTHING with my friends!!
03/10/09
Co-op can be a good thing, as long as it stays the fuck out of my plot-based RPGs. They've already been infected by the "moe" virus. I won't stand for the Halo generation raping what little is left of my childhood.
03/10/09
Of course without ruining the plot.
I would love to play MASS EFFECT with friends.
03/10/09
That's what MMOs are for. I'd rather story-focused games remain single player. It's impossible to take a storyline seriously when one of your friends is teabagging an NPC while they're trying to talk.
As for Mass Effect...meh. It's not KotOR 3, so it's useless to me.
03/10/09
I wouldn't see myself getting into an MMO tho.
As for having friends teabagging NPCs? Maybe you should find some GOOD friends to play with.
03/10/09
Nah, I'm just not a shooter fan. I like melee combat, and Mass Effect removed any glimpse of that, replacing it with cookie-cutter pea-shooter guns without so much as a smidgen of solid design or creativity attached to them. And before you ask, yes, I've played and beaten the game. Got the Completionist achievement, in fact.
While it might not be the most original or innovative game in the universe, a new KotOR would at least have a story I'm interested in seeing completed, which Mass Effect has not offered me.
As Fallible says, there are some genres that just don't lend themselves well to co-op. Survival horror, for one, as well as narrative-driven RPGs, would both be hampered by the presence of another player. Co-op works for some games, but not all of them.
03/10/09
You and me both. I'm really not liking the way the video game industry is headed. Seems like developers are willing to sacrifice what made their games popular in the first place to appeal to people who hadn't even been born when the original was released. I feel like 10 years older than I am in relation to the game industry lately.
03/10/09
Exactly how I'm feeling lately, and as it stands, this is probably my last console generation unless things drastically improve. Which I don't see happening, considering how bad the global economy has become.
@Dead Giveaway:
Try playing Silent Hill by yourself, then try playing the exact same game with a friend looking over your shoulder and talking the entire time. The fear factor is all but non-existent once there's someone else in the room. You might still get a jump if something pops out of nowhere, but the tension and unease of playing a horror game solo is completely eliminated if there's someone else WATCHING you play, let alone playing it with you.
Simplest put, some games, co-op works for them and improves the experience. Crackdown, for example. Decently fun in single-player, but VASTLY more entertaining with a buddy. I don't think Final Fantasy, on the other hand, would be nearly as engrossing when played cooperatively.
03/10/09
Funny thing, Silent Hill 1, along with RE1, 2, 3, were all played with a friend. Back in the day when I didn't own a PS1, i'd go to my friends house once and awhile and he'd let me play them. I loved them, and I still jumped at certain parts. But the overall fear was never there for me. Even when I did end up owning all the SH & RE titles and played alone at midnight in a pitch black room. But I grew up watching horror movies while others were watching saturday morning cartoons.
Anyway, I played the RE5 demo well over 50 times and it was fun each and every time. I got a huge list of friends to play with in the game, plus tons of unlockables & Mercs to look forward to.
Again, i'm not some bitchy little gamer who looks at the negatives. Capcom created a great game and it will be the most sold RE title, no doubt about it. PS3 & 360 release, day & date, yeah, it's going to be big.
03/10/09
I'm sure RE5 will do well. I'm not saying it won't. But it's not a Resident Evil game anymore. It's a co-op third person shooter with Wesker in it. Some people might like that.
Hell, I'm buying the game on Friday because two of my friends won't shut up about playing it online. But it's not survival horror, and from what I've played of the demo, it's not Resident Evil. Maybe the story will be hilarious campy bullshit like RE4 and that will appeal to me, but the gameplay sure hasn't.
03/10/09
It even says it in the demo.
I'll take Capcoms word for it over some bitter gamer on the internet.
03/10/09
We'll just have to wait until Friday, now won't we? I'm willing to accept I'm wrong if, after I beat the game, Sheva is completely non-intrusive, never once runs out of all of my ammo or gets me killed in a stupid manner. Sound good?
03/10/09
And besides, at the very least, Mercenaries Mode should be fun. Here's hoping Wesker's as awesome to play as in this one as he was in RE4. Now, I have to go buy some groceries. Good discussion; though you really don't need to resort to name-calling, I'm not mad at you and you shouldn't be mad at me. Differences in opinion are an inevitability in an industry as big as this one.
03/10/09
Its ironic, the Halo generation complains about casual games killing REAL, or PROPER, or HARDCORE gaming when the type of games they want butchers the things that made older games good.
I'm much more concerned about these new "hardcore" gamers than I am of casual gamers. Casual gamers get their own type of games that suit their tastes, they can exist separately. "Hardcore" gamers twist and warp the games I like to suit their tastes.
More SP narrative/plot-driven games please.
03/10/09
More SP narrative/plot-driven games please.
Agreed. Enough with the 5-hour campaigns and forced multiplayer.
03/10/09
Quite frankly it felt to me like a bad shooter with a good story. I have no problem supporting a good shooter with a crappy story, but I be damned if I support a bad shooter with a good story, Lol. BioWare, please add some RPG to Mass Effect 2, bring back all the stuff you stripped from the first one; and VATS, LoL.
03/10/09
Agreed. Mass Effect was a victim of its own hype to a massive degree, but since it's a BioWare game, it got a free pass for a lot of it. It's not a bad game by any stretch of the imagination, but compared what it was publicized to be, it's a total letdown.
Hopefully ME2 fixes some of the cuts they made, gets a working version of UE3 to go with it, and preferably takes the story in an UNEXPECTED direction. I'm pretty sure I already know where the story is headed from here, and if the finale ends up revolving around Shepard and crew hijacking a Sovereign ship to take against its brethren, I'm going to jam my skull through the floor in the ultimate facefault.
03/10/09
And that's just two games.
03/10/09
Valid point. I can't personally think of anyone who still plays either of those games at this point, but that doesn't mean other people aren't.
I can't see Smash having much of a dedicated online community nowadays though due to all the lag. Seems like too much of a hassle to get a good, solid game going; it's easier to just call some friends and have them come over.
03/10/09
I played both Smash and Kart online the other night, giving my 360 a rest for a bit. Smash online in random matches without friends is indeed horrible, but with friends it's as great as it is locally... We actually set it up so we talked over Xbox Live while playing Smash, so we didn't even miss out on the shit-talking.
Kart is always solid, and casuals will play it online as well.
Also, I've discovered there's a robust Tetris community online, of all things. It too a great hit with the casuals... my GF and i have wasted far too much time playing it recently.
03/10/09
I never did understand how Nintendo fucked up Brawl's netcode. If they were to release a new version of the game with NO CHANGES other than new, working netcode (oh, and Geno), I'd re-buy it in a heartbeat.
03/10/09
Just... what.
Really?
What.
03/10/09
Wii owners:
Are you playing -
Broken SSBM?
Action Replay'ed Pokemon Revolution?
Two Player Animal Crossing Only With a Friend?
Mario Kart?
Wii Vote?
'I'm losing so I'll quit' Guitar Hero/Rock Band?
What the hell could be so fascinating about the Wii online than people are playing on their PS3's??!?
DS... MAYBE would make sense for using the WiFi a lot.. but the Wii?
What?
03/10/09
Too many "ONLY FOR TEH BLU-RAYZ KTHXBYE" fuckheads clogging up the PS3 userbase tends to have that sort of effect on things.
Hopefully SF4 and Killzone can have a tangible effect.
03/10/09
03/10/09
Because when you take that attitude, you're basically admitting, without question, to be a blatant fanboy. There are games on PS3 worth playing, quite a few of them in fact. If you're willingly passing all of that up and still call yourself a gamer, you're a fuckhead.
03/10/09
Be fair. Lots of Wii owners will go 'Oh Im a Gamer!' but the system doesn't get used for anything besides Wii Sports, Wii Play, and Wii-third-party-bargain-bin-shovelware-that-uncle-al-bought-as-a-christmas-gift
03/10/09
Too many dashes for Wii 'Third Party Shovelware That Uncle Al Bought As A Christmas Gift'
03/10/09
True. The term has twisted and mutated so much this generation it's hard to associate with at all.
03/10/09
Sure, if they feel the need to upset you by purposely saying it lacks games & act like a fanboy, then fine, curse away.
But just be glad they supported the PS3 in the first place, i'd say.
03/10/09
What's the point in owning a system if you're not using it? Why would you spend that much money and not play games on it? It's not like it's going to HURT you to play LittleBigPlanet. Believe me, I've tried.
If you own the system, you're only doing it, and yourself, a disservice by taking the closed-minded fanboy approach and only using it as a blu-ray player. I don't use my 360 that much anymore since it became a portal to Silent Hill, but I don't just call it my "Netflix Box". It's stupid. Every system has games worth playing on it.
03/10/09
See as much as people on 'sides' of some 'fanwar' might hate to admit it, if someone owns a 360, theres almost a 100 percent chance they actually do 'game', as opposed to just have the system.
The PS3 can be sold on the blu-ray, with gaming as a secondary.
The Wii can be sold because its chic and 'in' to have one for your family, with gaming as a secondary (har har har)
The 360... what the hell does it offer besides a DVD player and portable media center? The former people already usually have, and the latter is usually too complicated for the average joe to bother trying to set up. So... gaming is the primary.
But thats besides the point. The PS3 has way more awesome and FUNCTIONAL games that work online than the Wii does. Is this a case of Wii owners being too stupid to know that Super Smash Bros is fundamentally broken with lag so they keep firing it online anyways? Or not caring that everyones pokemon on BR is Action Replayed garbage (god I hearted that game, until three days after it was out and it was no fun to face three shiny mewtwos).
Mario Kart I guess makes sense. I love the shit out of it, even to this day.
03/10/09
MK Wii would be better if they scaled online matches back to 8 players. I'm not too big a fan of the whole '12-person race' thing. Too many projectiles on screen at once. Kinda kills the balance, which is too bad, because the controls (Classic Controller, yo!) and gameplay themselves are top notch.
And yeah, I agree, there are definitely some people (parents, especially) who own a PS3 just as a blu-ray player. But they also don't go onto forums and talk about how big gamers they are. I'm ripping on the people who have the gall to call themselves serious gamers, own a PS3, and then only use it for blu-ray. They're idiots or fanboys.
03/10/09
03/10/09
03/10/09
Again; if they bought the PS3 and actively call themselves gamers, they're idiots for not using it. If you post here on Kotaku, you're not a casual gamer. There's no excuse.
03/10/09
01/20/09
on my toon's forehead and let me have this stuff for free?
01/20/09
01/20/09
01/20/09
That said, I disagree with games such as HOME, and the Live dashboard (I am aware that neither are games - most especially the Live dashboard), charging fees for avatar customisation that, in no way, enhance- or increase - the games lifespan.
01/20/09
Gaming as a hobby is completely intangible. We can't show any sort of trophy to the real world to show how good we are or what we can accomplish. Sure there are tournaments with awards as well as pro gamers, but I'm talking about you and me -- the "normal" people of gaming.
Every sport has its exceptional athlete; we are the norm, or even the intramural gamers so to speak. We don't play pro, we play for fun and recreation.
So whether we spend our money on fake items, grind for fake items, or even buying the games themselves, it's all digital improvement. Mostly in our minds and the minds of our friends who enjoy the same games.
Maybe one day I can cash my Gamerscore points in for something -- like a discount towards a new game. It's only furthering the analogy, but hey, it's my hobby of choice. There's not much I'd rather spend money on than technology/gadgets/games/geek toys.