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Denver, 3:34 AM
Wed Nov 25
53 posts in the last 24 hours
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10/20/09
Its good that everyone is talking about this now, but this is just silly. Its an overreaction on par with network news. The gaming press should be ashamed. #valve
10/20/09
10/20/09
I myself like Steam as it is, but that does not keep me from worrying about what it could turn into, or wonder how much better it could be if they actually had real competition.
Because at the end of the day Steam is really just a video game console that runs on the power of your PC. #valve
10/20/09
What I'm getting at is that there is no more of a conflict of interest with Valve and Steam than there is with Microsoft and the 360, or Sony and the PS3, or Nintendo and the Wii. Seems like a fairly analogous situation to me, so this isn't some kind of new phenomenon.
With that said, it should be common sense here that smaller developers aren't going to badmouth Valve or Steam in public. They don't have the clout or (ironically) independence to defend themselves if Valve decides to jack up the percentages on them. Gearbox has wide retail distribution, and while broaching this subject on Valve doesn't seem like the smartest business move it's something that Pitchford can get away with.
The telling thing here is that nobody has yet come forward to dish dirt under the condition of anonymity. If that happens Pitchford may have a legitimate point; otherwise he's just raising much ado about nothing. #valve
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#valve
10/20/09
Smart insights, Toasticus, as always. I was thinking similar thoughts on the bus today.
I would also like to add that any distribution method a la Steam that DIDN'T have the incentive and backing that Valve has with "first-party games" would mostly likely not be nearly as robust as Steam is. #valve
10/20/09
Yeah, that's a very good point. It's kind of like game engine development -- if you make your own games as well then sure, there's a conflict of interest there. But at the same time, having to put a game all the way through to completion on your engine will do wonders for showing you the kinds of things that developers need when doing likewise. In a sense, being one of their own "customers" allows Valve to proactively improve the quality of Steam as a service rather than just listening to feedback from other people who put their games on Steam. #valve
10/20/09
the only thing i think they need to change is their european pricing. people have been saying it's more expensive than retail in europe. #valve
10/20/09
10/20/09
I like Pitchford, but his comment always struck me as odd. Valve is really a one of a kind company in how they handle themselves. Gabe will go to press conferences dressed like always, kind of like a slob, and not care. The games speak for him, he doesn't care what people think of his appearance. And when he jokes with the mod community and they start a fund to go to Australia for L4D, he says "Okay, I'm going to Australia then. See you in a week."
No other company would do that right now. #valve
10/20/09
10/20/09
I am more than happy with the cut I get from Steam. Yeah of course more would be nice – but the cut isn’t anywhere near that low that it would turn me off selling through Steam. Maybe I’m a special case because GMod has sold so well – but I know that Introversion nearly went under until they got on Steam (Although flushing all the money out of the company at the end of the month is probably asking for trouble).
Should Steam be it’s own company? What difference does it make? It’d be the same Steam, run by the same people, probably from the same office. It would change nothing.
Should Steam get competition? Yeah sure competition is always good, but I can’t imagine anything will ever overtake Steam now. Steam is doing everything right, there’s no need for an alternative. Not to mention the amount of money we all have already invested in the games we own in Steam. Steam IS the PC gaming platform. As a consumer I don’t want to have different digital distribution software installed for every publisher.
So I guess Pitchford is the only guy with his feelings.
[www.garry.tv] #valve
10/20/09
10/20/09
Physical pre-orders need some sort of incentive, since things don't sell out much anymore. #valve
10/20/09
With digital downloads having no physical objects to manage, no set quantities to order to a distributor, the original reason for pre-orders simply vanished. Only leaving a marketing ploy that makes little sense (but possibly big money).
That said, there might be advantages for a digital download outlet to have pre-orders. While they do not have game boxes to manage, they still have logistical issues such as bandwidth. Having people pre-download a game certainly reduces the data transfer peak on the day of release and the costs it may entail.
10/20/09
1. Digital Pre-orders are usually cheaper, Steam tend to knock of 10% or so
2. Steam lets you pre-load the game, so 12midnight hits you can start playing your game
3.The pre-load also means Steam don't have several thousand folk trying to grab the game at midnight. #valve
10/20/09
and context is everything, as even a supposedly positive comment from a steam supporter such as "...Valve offers the most developer-friendly terms for digital distribution in the industry." should be taken lightly. what are those terms, and how fair are they? just because you're better than the worst doesn't make you as fair as you should be.
pitchford's a bit nuts though if he thinks a wal-mart model would be good. uber-distributor = cut-throat pricing and predatory tactics to keep product with that distributor. #valve
10/20/09
Valve is running a "shop" but also making products for this "shop" and allowing other companies to sell their products in this "shop". What Pitchford said was, that there might be conflict of interest, because Valve as a private company would rather propagate their own product than someone else's if they had to choose. There. Yes Steam is great and yes Pitchford was right even if he likes Steam.
I don't think he's on "edge", he's just pointing out the obvious. Even if I like something I can't be blind to it's faults, that's all he said.
10/20/09
10/20/09
The possibility for conflict of interest is there, that's all he said and that's a fact. Same goes for this Macy's or whoever else. #valve
10/20/09
I've never been a PC gamer without Steam... (switched over to PC about a year and a half ago) and I can't really see myself being one without it.
The first time I downloaded the Original Half Life and WAS ABLE TO PLAY IT WHILE IT WAS DOWNLOADING... I was literally in shock. I'd never experienced such quality digital distribution coming from the console end of things.
I do hope PC developers will get a grip on themselves and realize that nobody ever liked GFWL... and that still nobody likes GFWL. #valve
10/20/09
The only real gripe I have with it is start-up times: starting the thing up for me takes 20 secs, and starting up a game takes two to ten. Annoying. #valve
10/20/09
10/20/09
I wonder where retail fits in the equation. #valve
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10/20/09
Why do people keep shining such a negative light on his comments?
Maybe there's some part of the interview I skipped? :/ #valve
10/20/09
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10/20/09
Because I can download the game as many times as a I want. Every day if I like.
How many times can you download what you buy of itunes?
Yeah, I thought so. #valve
10/20/09
We all love it now, but let's say, hypothetically that Valve is bought out--maybe Gabe retires, or maybe something happens and he's gone. Who's to say it will STAY great? It could be, theoretically, leveraged into something very evil very fast.
...The thing Pitchford fails to understand is it would promptly fail, and be a non-issue. Steam isn't popular because Steam is popular, Steam is popular because it's conveinent, well-valued, a decent platform and offers FAIR DEALS TO THE 'competition.' Fail to do that, and people won't sell on Steam, people won't buy on Steam, it will go away.
We're not talking about issues with people who control say, hardware, or Software, which can cause all KINDS of conflict *coughcoughMICROSOFTcoughcough*. Steam's just a selling-arm of a gaming company. They don't wield that much more clout than other companies, and they can only 'screw' with other companies in so much as its profitable. Valve may resonate with us PC gamers, but it's not such a powerhouse that Steam can survive on Valve alone--at least not at the level it is now.
In short, yeah, I see his point, but he's still full of it. #valve
10/20/09
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10/20/09
This is one of the good sides of capitalism.
OT: I like Steam very much, but I can also understand the conflict of interest. Perhaps it would be a good idea for Valve to seperate the Steam publishing service into a new company? #valve
10/20/09
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10/20/09
For evidence of this, I point to the absoulte FAIL that was Games for Windows Live.
I could create hypothetical scenarios that are divorced from reality until I'm blue in the face, but trying to argue that Steam could gain so many games that it becomes sentient and because people think it's conveinent they continue to feed it anyway until it finally just plugs us into neural links and plunges is into the Matrix--that doesn't mean my fear is in fact, completely fucking unfounded.
10/20/09
@Evdor: #valve
10/20/09
Whatever. #valve
10/20/09
No, you're right.
But I think... the problem is more about advertisement. Valve could basically ignore the competition and put their games exclusively on the front page.
If this happened, it wouldn't inconvenience players to the point of avoiding use of the service. It might stop developers from using the service... but if the players are still there, why should they?
I think they'd probably be more likely to just advertise elsewhere... and if Valve were to change their policiy on pricing, and start meddling with other developers' game prices, the developers would just sell their shit elsewhere, and gamers would "add them" to their steam game list.
I really don't see how this could be so detrimental. Either way, Valve makes a good deal of money from the sales of OTHER developers' games... and they can't expect to pump out enough first party games to account for that revenue.
Their business model requires games sales from other developers. #valve
10/20/09
10/13/09
Like I said before, it has done a lot for indie developers, but it's probably also not a charity fundraiser.
Steam is just business. I'm pretty shure Valve keeps a good share of the profit, as most distribution business does, and I'm also pretty shure it isn't as bad as what Randy said on his interview, since tons of indie developers are jumping in the wagon, even celebrating when they do it.
The thing about independent game developers is that they usually lack a reliable channel for payments, to keep the buyer's data, and to publish and make their games visible.
And they really need a centralizing channel... which is the same thing all consoles/portables and cellphones are making right now.
Every couple of days at most I make an indepent game post on my blog... most of them are free, the ones that are payed either uses Steam or D2D.
With rare exceptions, the ones I decided to buy all came from those (rare exception being Machinarium ).
Another positive effect of Steam is that it's a great place for oldschool gamers. I probably would have never spend money on old games if it was't for it.
And since Indie Games and oldschool games mix well, the whole thing helps sales.
I got World of Goo, Darwinia, City Rain, and some other independent games all from either Steam or D2D, mostly from those Weekend Deals with oldschool game packs like the iD pack, X-Com UFO and some others.
And I have to admit I certainly wouldn't have bought any of it if it wasn't just a few clicks away...
10/12/09
Steam and Valve are basically a virtual version of a console. Console makers have their own games, and 90% of the time, those games are the best ones and the reason people buy that system vs another one. So yes, they have a console to move their games. But i doubt anyone would argue that Console developers are getting exploited.
Besides, console dev has to pay roughly 15 bucks to the console maker, 5 bucks to the store and probably another 5 to 10 on marketing and packaging. And in the case of PC games, most of the time they outsource DRM so there goes more money. Depending on the game, devs are loosing a third to over half the money off each game sold to all the people involved in actually putting it in the consumer's hand.
If Valve comes along and says, Our service outsells the brick and mortar store and undisputed digital platform to buy PC games. Go through us and we will ask for 30% of the sale price of the game, and we will go and do all the marketing, distributions, give you and everything you need to have a secured product.
How can you argue, Devs get more money and don't have to bother with any post production and distribution mess. Its a Win Win... especially for the small guys.
10/13/09
Ever hear, and I'm paraphrasing..."Get the guys coming to you for a service to like you, and they will continue to come to you even after you stop playing nice. After that, all you need to do is maintain a presence of affability and people will make excuses for you."
Not saying that is happening here, but let's just say that in business history has been known to repeat itself.
10/13/09