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Debate

GTA IV

Arguing 'Grand Theft Auto IV' With N'Gai

Once a month or so, N'Gai Croal and I debate a video game. Usually we do it well after a game's been released. We call our exchanges Vs. Mode, co-publish them on both of our blogs, and hope that people have enough bathroom time to read them.

The latest debate concluded this morning. It's all about Grand Theft Auto IV. We talked about bringing our A game for this one. Or at least we would have if we spoke in sports metaphors. It's full of spoilers... about the game's moral quandaries, its ending and other stuff. So beware.

But if you're looking to see him have a go at me for preferring San Andreas to GTA IV and if you're interested in stuff like this...

N'Gai: I'm wondering whether the fault lies not with inconsistencies in the work of Rockstar's writing team, but with the credulity of all of us. Liberty City is filled with self-deluded characters like Playboy X, Manny and Brucie, who present themselves one way only to be exposed by their behavior. Why do we take Niko at face value? Is it just because he's our avatar? ... Maybe Niko is deceiving himself as much as do the rest of the lowlifes he runs with. Maybe as much as he believes he's fatigued with death and killing, he's actually drawn to it? Maybe we have all misunderstood Niko Bellic.

...then head to either of our sites and read the loooong debate. I'm linking to his version, because I'm classy.

Round One
Round Two
Final Round


debate

Why Aren't There More Console MMOs?

Back in April, Dan Rubenfield (Ultima Online, Star Wars Galaxies, etc.) ranted, raved, and put MMO developers 'on notice.' And, at the end, admonished developers to "quit making PC games. It’s a waste of time and money." Unsurprisingly, people hit back, and now over at GameSetWatch, Joe Ludwig (producer of Pirates of the Burning Sea) has a snappy little response detailing six reasons why MMOs are just plain harder to develop for consoles versus PCs. Does that mean it won't start happening in greater numbers? Of course not: More »

debate

XBLA's Delisting Policy? Developers' Perspective

GamerBytes, the new blog in the Game Developer/Gamasutra/GameSetWatch line up, chatted with some developers to get their opinions on the XBLA delisting issue. The little three parter is a nice look at a couple of view points. Unsurprisingly, opinions are mixed — some are staunchly opposed, while some (like the cofounder of Merscom, Buku Sudoku developer) think it's a fabulous idea: More »

e3 award debate

ESA, Game Critics' Awards Debate "Best Of E3" Eligibility

A heated debate has erupted between the Entertainment Software Association and the Game Critics' Awards over the eligibility of games in this year's E3 Media and Business Summit. The dispute was prompted by Activision and Vivendi's recent departure from the ESA and, simultaneously, from the show.

The association assumed that the departed companies' games would no longer be eligible for any of the annual "Best of E3" awards, given out by an independent group of Game Critics' Awards judges at each year's show.

But Geoff Keighley, GameTrailers executive producer and co-chairman of the Awards, said that decision hasn't been made yet. The critics' group, of which Kotaku managing editor Brian Crecente is also a member, still needs to meet to discuss the issue and decide how exactly to define which games are and are not eligible.

"The fact that Activision is not a registered exhibitor for E3 has brought to light the issue of how to determine the eligibility of games," Keighley said.

More »

criticism

Why the Term 'Gamer' Does Not Need to Go

Last week, Douglas Wilson made an impassioned argument for why the term gamer needs to go; this week, Rene Patnode, a fellow soldier in the grad school trenches, responds with his take on why the term gamer does not need to go the way of the dodo:

... change to the fan sub-culture appears inevitable, but yet so are reactionary responses from the fans. But those responses are soon swallowed up by the progress of the sub-culture on the whole. Given this inevitability, is there reason for concern?

After all, the course of history has already begun to unfold. In the same way we gaming old-timers may look down on PlayStation fanboys (for the record, I'm a Nintendo man), those same gamers who cut their teeth on the PS2 may denigrate the n00bs who are just learning to waggle their Wii-motes. Wilson's critique may in fact stem from his own nostalgia for the good old days before a series of tubes became the internet we now know and love, and flame wars became easier to ignite.


He makes some good points on the nature of subcultures in general, and where we gamers may be headed on the whole.

Si, Ceci Est Un Gamer [GameSetWatch]


violent games

British MP - Games Let You Rape Women

The time-honored tradition of stodgy men arguing over things they know nothing about continued in England during last Friday's game censorship debate in the House of Commons, with MP Keith Vaz showing us how it's done while speaking in defense of Julian Brazier's bill to add a censorship level above the British Board of Film Classification. In comparing the interactivity of video games to movies, Vaz unleashed this little gem:

However, someone sitting at a computer playing a video game, or someone with one of those small devices that young people have these days, the name of which I forget— [Interruption.] PlayStations or PSPs, something of that kind.

"Well, whatever they are called, when people play these things, they can interact. They can shoot people; they can kill people. As the honourable Gentleman said, they can rape women."

More »

art

'The Art of Games': Art and Entertainment

In typical fashion, one post on the games-as-art debate spawns a response. This is one debate I actually enjoy watching, since the evidence people haul out in support their positions is fascinating. We go from the Impressionists to 300 in this Gamasutra essay by E. Daniel Arey, and he tackles the question of why the 'art inherent to games' does indeed matter. Just like any good artistically driven medium, games have pushed the boundaries since their creation, he says:

While I fully understand and support that games are a wonderful play pastime, and that gameplay and fun are the beating heart of our business, I find these assertions to keep everything the same as a set of false boundaries that foster cynical limitations by those in power to assure the status quo is comfortable and predictable.

The real truth is, games have always pushed the boundaries and evolved on their own, right from the beginning. First they were a simply a "Novelty." Then Time Magazine proudly labeled them a passing "Fad." Then they were a "Quaint Pastime." Then a "Cultural Phenomenon." And now a "Mainstream Entertainment" medium.

I think the problem inherent to these discussions is that while people can try and slough the question of 'what is art?' off to academics, it's very much tied to the question of 'art and video games' or 'art in video games' or 'video games as art.' Many modern media struggle with this, and it's by no means confined to games - but this debate has no end.

The Art Of Games [Gamasutra]


opinion

'Are Games Going To Grow Up?': A Debate

Speaking of games being juvenile (maybe), Steve Gaynor threw down the gauntlet over at Fullbright with some incendiary comments that were of course going to start a firestorm, and were indeed designed to. His contention? The video games are going to be stuck in the same ghetto as comic books — always marginalized, forever juvenile, doomed to never being 'a relevant cultural medium': More »

austin gdc 07

Are Microtransactions The Future of MMO Games?

What do you get when you put Everquest II producer John Blakely, Matt Firor of ZeniMax Online Studios, Mark Jacobs of EA Mythic, Raph Coster of Areae, and GoPets CEO Erik Bethke into one room to discuss opportunities for increasing revenue and reaching new players in the MMO space? From what I saw this afternoon, you get a debate over microtransactions versus traditional subscription payment systems. I attended a panel called "Where are the Biggest Online Gaming Opportunities?" which was supposed to about experimenting with new MMO design and innovative new revenue models, but it quickly because a debate of old school MMO systems versus the new ones. The subject of microtransactions has popped up a lot this week, most notably in the Dave Perry Q&A from earlier in the day, where Perry sings the praises of the ad-supported, microtransaction funded business model. More »

the great debate

Roger Ebert Strikes Back

Outspoken movie critic and author Roger Ebert came under fire from the gaming community a while back with his statement that he does not consider video games to be art. Since then the topic has been hotly debated and written about on just about any game related publication and website you can think of. More »

manhunt 2 debate rolls on

Former ESPLA Boss Talks Banning

The boss who formerly headed up the the ESPLA in the UK has voiced his concerns on the BBFC Manhunt banning. The ex-director general of the UK games regulator, Roger Bennett, has started questioning whether or not the firm understands the long-term repercussions of the ruling, and believes that the government and the BBFC have become "heavily influenced by anti-game prejudice". More »

pirate

Pirate v Ninja Makes The Paper

Yes, it made the newspaper because I put it there and no, it's not game related, not really. But I thought perhaps you'd still want to read it, that and I mentioned it last night in my Night Note. More »

law

Lawyerman Versus Monster Killer

If you live in the California, PA area and are free tomorrow night, you could be in for a real treat. JT Lawyer Guy will be at the California University of Pennsylvania campus on Tuesday the 30th at 7 p.m., debating author and culture critic Gerard Jones over violent video games and their sale to children. Jones is the author of "Killing Monsters: Why Children Need Fantasy, Super Heroes and Make-Believe Violence," a book that explores the importance of games, comics, and other fantasy violence in helping children learn to deal with anger, violence, and sexuality. More »

second life

Second Life Presidential Press Event: Aftermath

Presidential hopeful Mark Warner recently held a press conference in the MySpace of MMOs, Second Life. The coverage of the event was decidedly subdued, and I've seen very little followup worth reporting. More »

silent hill

Ebert Reviews Silent Hill

Roger Ebert took the time to watch Silent Hill, I say that with all sincerity, because they didn't show a preview for him, he had to actually go to the movies to see it. More »

jim emerson

An Epic Debate: Are Video Games Art

After getting back from Boulder, Colorado, Jim Emerson wrote up quite a lengthy explanation of how he researched and formed his opinions for his debate with Roger Ebert about the whole "are video games art" question. More »

ebert

Emerson Defends Ebert Debate

Seattle-based movie critic and editor of RogerEbert.com Jim Emerson dropped me a line over the weekend in response to my rantish blurb about the video games as art "debate" he took part in with Roget Ebert last week in Boulder. More »

roger ebert

Ebert Debates Games as Art

I missed one heck of a debate yesterday at University of Colorado at Boulder. Apparently Roger Ebert came for the 58th Annual Conference on World Affairs. One of his panels was titled: An Epic Debate: Are Video Games an Art Form? More »