I'm sure German gamers have grown accustomed to this type of cenorship enough to already have established a nice pipeline of imported versions of the games they want to play. #aliensvspredator
@Modus_Operandi: one major issue being that germans are generally shit at understanding other languages than german, so they have great issue with non-localized versions. #aliensvspredator
@Modus_Operandi: Exactly what I was thinking. But does that mean it's still illegal to have them over there? Or was it never illegal in the first place? #aliensvspredator
@Kenshi_Ryden: I dont think its illegal to own the games but it is illegal for stores to advertise the sale of those games openly. That effectively kills the game since not many retailers will carry a game that is being advertised for. Its like having to buy porn from a backroom.
@Modus_Operandi: Yup it works like that (like porn). The funny thing is that over here (germany) it's easier for minors to get tabaco/hard booze than it is for an adult to get an "not rated" game in a retail store.
And yes we established a nice pipeline of imported versions. The austrians make lots of money because of this, they usually have uncut versions of the games with german language. So many people order their stuff from there and the austrian export shops know of their monopol and rip us off with insane prices.
Anyway this newsarticle is old, it has been known for quite some time that an release in germany is highly unlikely because rebellion refuses to cut anything about the game. I hope more developers/publishers will follow that example.
Because than at some point we germans will end up with no new games at all and at that point mabye some change might happen.. #aliensvspredator
@Poul Wrist: Easy solution: make games with a german language option, don't "localize" them though. Importers will snap them up, circumventing any ratings board. #aliensvspredator
@Nethlem: To me this is nuts. What is the point of having a ratings system that catergorizes the content of games and laws that restrict the sale of games to minors, if after all of that an of age adult cannot purchase the media they want? If there wasnt an auidence for this type of stuff then people wouldnt import it, so instead of effectively banning it why not just trust in the systems that are in place and lead by example. I understand the Germans have a dark period in their history but I really doubt that the next fuhrer will be the result of some kid playing a AVP or COD or Gears. #aliensvspredator
It's an understandable decision. After the way games have suffered due to modification to appease certain censorship boards, you can't really blame Sega for the decision.
It makes me wonder how the Australian censorship board will treat the game though. #aliensvspredator
Violence aside AvP is not a franchise that enjoys any popularity in Germany. The game would not sell on its name in the first place and I doubt it has anything else going for it.
The rating is not AvP's biggest problem in Germany, the lack of an audience is. Sega is doing the right thing by not wasting money on releasing it in Germany and instead seeking attention by blaming the German rating boards.
It would just be an 18 rated game of a franchise that is unlikely to attract more than 15.000 sales. #aliensvspredator
@Asbestos_Underwear: I find that a strange assumption. Forgive me if I'm mistaken, but Germany has had a pretty large PC gaming base for a good while and AvP at one point was the game to play on PC. Going off that, one could only assume that there would be many people interested in getting it in Germany.
I could be wrong but it just seems strange to make such a statement. #aliensvspredator
@Asbestos_Underwear: you are sadly mistaken. germany is europe's second biggest gaming market, not very far behind the UK.
and despite continued government efforts, the PC FPS crowd is huge there. the first AvP was a massive hit among said crowd in germany, so it would be fair to assume that the sequel will sell.
but nobody wants USK censored games anyway, so they just import. as i'm sure they will for the new AvP #aliensvspredator
@dnadns:
AvP had 1.000.000 sold movie tickets in Germany, AvP2 sold 750.000 tickets. That is in the nowhereland between hit and flop, it'll make its money back, but it will require DVD sales to do that.
So far that is ok, but you have to calculate an attachment rate of roughly 10% when the game sales start. Actually less, because uncensored imports play much more of a role in this niche and piracy will occur.
It's commercially not viable to fully localize a game, if your sales are going to be that low. While there are Germans who love their AvP, there aren't enough of them to valid a local version. Which is not a bad thing, because those who do like AvP will know how to get it anyway and are likely to have a taste for the original language version as it stands. #aliensvspredator
@Asbestos_Underwear: This game has nothing (read: nothing) got to do with the shitastic AvP movies. This is AvP 2010, the successor to the massively popular AvP game from 1999. I don't know if you've ever played the game but it had and still has a huge fanbase on PC and many people all over the world are looking forward to it. #aliensvspredator
@Asbestos_Underwear: You are forgetting that the movies were sub-par anyway and those movies always aim for DVD sales instead for box office sales. The very same formula can be applied to splatter/horror whatever movies who seem to do very bad at the cinemas, but get all the money in via DVD.
Uwe Boll is one of the usual suspects for that kind of sales strategy, btw. (no matter if you like or dislike his work).
Also, there is virtually no cost saved in terms of localization.
Don't forget that there are still other countries that speak German, namely Swiss and Austria.
The only "overhead" that is saved is the time spent in the cutting room.
As of now, there are 2 main reasons for us to buy movies, games and comics in another country. The price tag and wanting to have the uncut version. A minority (I am part of it) also loathes bad localization and wants to get the English version, but that is actually almost always included nowadays anyway.
Fact for me is, I do usually save 10-20% if I order stuff from the UK, do get the uncut version (and don't mind if there is no German localization). Still, most people order in Austria. Not everybody around here is proficient enough to watch/play movies/games in English. By coincidence, those people are the major demographic who also buy the DVD, instead of going to the movies. #aliensvspredator
Whenever it's aliens, I never really see it as bad as human gore. It's like when I went to get Metroid Prime. My mother was concerned (as a good parent should) about the content of the game because she noticed the ESRB Teen rating. I had turned 14 years-old, so I was old enough, but she wasn't fond of Samus shooting at aliens. I said that they were just aliens and that it was very unrealistic in terms of violence (creatures go BOOM).
I got the game in the end, but I think that point still holds slightly true today. The problem that arises is that the more humanoid the aliens become, the less likely it is to brush it off as fanciful instead typical gore.
@DocSeuss: Oh yeah, we do have the space marine element here. Then again, the content couldn't be anything worse than what you see in any of the Alien or Predator movies.
Though, thinking about the trailer... maybe not so... #aliensvspredator
@DELICIOUS BUNNY:
One of the new Special Infected for L4D2: the Spitter. She has acidic spit that drains your health really quick if you stand in that drool.
Aside from being deadly, it's also really nasty! #left4dead2
@syafiqjabar of Mars: Spits pools of acid onto the ground. You should try the demo, it's quite good (But only gives you one campaign level - unsurprising really) #left4dead2
@syafiqjabar of Mars: It's playable if you use the hack for the demo. Its spit glob also ricochets off of walls and ceilings. And when its killed, acid spills at the death site too.
But there are two levels you can play in the demo, not one. The first one is just really short (in the demo anyways) so people tend to either forget about it or it blends in their mind with the 2nd level. #left4dead2
@Kurtt: ...So that isn't a full "campaign"? I thought it was pretty short... You just get to that building and it tells you the survivors escaped (even one time when we got there having all died just on arrival) - then again I'm not familiar with L4D level structure so... #left4dead2
@Slanzinger: Nah, most full campaigns have around 5 or 6 maps, including the Finale. Or at least that was the case with the original L4D. It varies depending on whether it's an official campaign or player-made one. Unless you count that crappy Crash Course throw-together that Valve released recently. That was only 2 maps.. and kinda pitiful. But it was free, unless you're on XBox 360. #left4dead2
To whomever is responsible: my plight on travesty that you bring upon video games, please stop what your doing!
My words may not convince you but I hope that your heart (or what's left of it) will be filled with regret by seeing this picture. #bandhero
Valve could simply patch the ability to turn gore off into other versions after release...right? As totally rad as the gore is, it's kinda tough on my PC.
To do a 180, I'm hoping someone finds a way to multiply the gore somehow, and see how well it runs on a PC that does Crysis on very high. Murder sim FTW! #left4dead2
@Gantz: Your Trusted Friend in Science.: That's a cheap shot. "Your opinion is neglected because you're not typing out an article to compare with it"? That's like telling someone who said "I thought Borderlands was fun, but lacking in some areas" that they should shut up because they haven't made an FPS-RPG and released it. #left4dead2
@Gantz: Your Trusted Friend in Science.: For someone who doesn't seem to like it when people talk out of their ass... well you're talking out of your ass. Get over yourself. Somarix's post is on the money and its OBVIOUS. So obvious no explanation is needed. #left4dead2
If someone goes 'Those guys who did a study are full of fail, they don't know shit about anything', you'd damn well be able to back up what you just said.
Eg
Scientist: This disease will be cured by this, because of this, and because we did this, with these results
Random Guy: You don't know what the fuck you're talking about Scientist
Its perfectly reasonable to ask the random guy why he would say such things. And no, I'm not comparing some gaming guys running some tests to a scientist, I'm saying they've got reports and results from their own work. If you're going to rebuke them, nut up or shut up.
You don't have to type out an article, but you could at the very least explain why.
Or not get so fucking offended when someone asks you to do so. #left4dead2
I'm not seeing anything below besides 'Less graphix = more speed' which I thought was obvious.
I didn't say these guys were brilliant or made an incredible discovery, I just said theres nothing wrong with someone saying if you're going to discredit them, say why. #left4dead2
@Komrade Kayce: I understand your and Gantz' stance. Though, it's invalid for something so freaking simple. Especially when a bunch of others also shouted "nonsense" and explained parts.
Plus, when I was writing full articles here to explain my stance, they were easily ignored. So, I stick to teaching and discussing tech stuff on (game)dev forums and other places where info matters; and writing "blergh" posts like everyone else on Kotaku.
Plus, no-one ever got a star here for being informative, so there's no external incentive. #left4dead2
05:35 AM
05:41 AM
09:49 AM
10:32 AM
10:37 AM
And yes we established a nice pipeline of imported versions. The austrians make lots of money because of this, they usually have uncut versions of the games with german language. So many people order their stuff from there and the austrian export shops know of their monopol and rip us off with insane prices.
Anyway this newsarticle is old, it has been known for quite some time that an release in germany is highly unlikely because rebellion refuses to cut anything about the game. I hope more developers/publishers will follow that example.
Because than at some point we germans will end up with no new games at all and at that point mabye some change might happen.. #aliensvspredator
11:00 AM
11:03 AM
01:41 AM
It makes me wonder how the Australian censorship board will treat the game though. #aliensvspredator
01:33 AM
The rating is not AvP's biggest problem in Germany, the lack of an audience is. Sega is doing the right thing by not wasting money on releasing it in Germany and instead seeking attention by blaming the German rating boards.
It would just be an 18 rated game of a franchise that is unlikely to attract more than 15.000 sales. #aliensvspredator
01:40 AM
I could be wrong but it just seems strange to make such a statement. #aliensvspredator
01:56 AM
and despite continued government efforts, the PC FPS crowd is huge there. the first AvP was a massive hit among said crowd in germany, so it would be fair to assume that the sequel will sell.
but nobody wants USK censored games anyway, so they just import. as i'm sure they will for the new AvP #aliensvspredator
02:31 AM
02:51 AM
AvP had 1.000.000 sold movie tickets in Germany, AvP2 sold 750.000 tickets. That is in the nowhereland between hit and flop, it'll make its money back, but it will require DVD sales to do that.
So far that is ok, but you have to calculate an attachment rate of roughly 10% when the game sales start. Actually less, because uncensored imports play much more of a role in this niche and piracy will occur.
It's commercially not viable to fully localize a game, if your sales are going to be that low. While there are Germans who love their AvP, there aren't enough of them to valid a local version. Which is not a bad thing, because those who do like AvP will know how to get it anyway and are likely to have a taste for the original language version as it stands. #aliensvspredator
03:22 AM
05:50 AM
Uwe Boll is one of the usual suspects for that kind of sales strategy, btw. (no matter if you like or dislike his work).
Also, there is virtually no cost saved in terms of localization.
Don't forget that there are still other countries that speak German, namely Swiss and Austria.
The only "overhead" that is saved is the time spent in the cutting room.
As of now, there are 2 main reasons for us to buy movies, games and comics in another country. The price tag and wanting to have the uncut version. A minority (I am part of it) also loathes bad localization and wants to get the English version, but that is actually almost always included nowadays anyway.
Fact for me is, I do usually save 10-20% if I order stuff from the UK, do get the uncut version (and don't mind if there is no German localization). Still, most people order in Austria. Not everybody around here is proficient enough to watch/play movies/games in English. By coincidence, those people are the major demographic who also buy the DVD, instead of going to the movies. #aliensvspredator
01:19 AM
I got the game in the end, but I think that point still holds slightly true today. The problem that arises is that the more humanoid the aliens become, the less likely it is to brush it off as fanciful instead typical gore.
01:35 AM
01:39 AM
Though, thinking about the trailer... maybe not so... #aliensvspredator
01:42 AM
11/08/09
11/08/09
One of the new Special Infected for L4D2: the Spitter. She has acidic spit that drains your health really quick if you stand in that drool.
Aside from being deadly, it's also really nasty! #left4dead2
11/07/09
11/07/09
11/07/09
It's a Spitter. Probably spits at people. #left4dead2
11/07/09
11/07/09
But there are two levels you can play in the demo, not one. The first one is just really short (in the demo anyways) so people tend to either forget about it or it blends in their mind with the 2nd level. #left4dead2
11/07/09
11/07/09
11/07/09
To whomever is responsible: my plight on travesty that you bring upon video games, please stop what your doing!
My words may not convince you but I hope that your heart (or what's left of it) will be filled with regret by seeing this picture. #bandhero
11/07/09
11/07/09
11/07/09
11/07/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/07/09
[tvtropes.org] #left4dead2
11/07/09
11/07/09
@andrewwyatt: Here we go. #left4dead2
11/06/09
I didn't really need to read beyond there, but thanks for the heads-up regardless. #bandhero
11/06/09
To do a 180, I'm hoping someone finds a way to multiply the gore somehow, and see how well it runs on a PC that does Crysis on very high. Murder sim FTW! #left4dead2
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
This article is silly. It's like saying "When they cut out some of the more advanced effects in the game, it runs better!!"
REALLLLLLYYYYY I couldn't have ever guessed that! #left4dead2
11/06/09
11/06/09
Its easy to call someone out, but backing up your claim is another thing. #left4dead2
11/06/09
11/06/09
Also in your example, I would press them for details. Just saying "in some areas" is hardly specific. #left4dead2
11/06/09
11/06/09
What.
If someone goes 'Those guys who did a study are full of fail, they don't know shit about anything', you'd damn well be able to back up what you just said.
Eg
Scientist: This disease will be cured by this, because of this, and because we did this, with these results
Random Guy: You don't know what the fuck you're talking about Scientist
Its perfectly reasonable to ask the random guy why he would say such things. And no, I'm not comparing some gaming guys running some tests to a scientist, I'm saying they've got reports and results from their own work. If you're going to rebuke them, nut up or shut up.
You don't have to type out an article, but you could at the very least explain why.
Or not get so fucking offended when someone asks you to do so. #left4dead2
11/06/09
Or get some common PC-gaming specs sense.
etc etc #left4dead2
11/06/09
I'm not seeing anything below besides 'Less graphix = more speed' which I thought was obvious.
I didn't say these guys were brilliant or made an incredible discovery, I just said theres nothing wrong with someone saying if you're going to discredit them, say why. #left4dead2
11/06/09
Plus, when I was writing full articles here to explain my stance, they were easily ignored. So, I stick to teaching and discussing tech stuff on (game)dev forums and other places where info matters; and writing "blergh" posts like everyone else on Kotaku.
Plus, no-one ever got a star here for being informative, so there's no external incentive. #left4dead2