Not very historically accurate. WWII Pacific Fighter/Bomber pilots and crew favored American Actresses, Singers or girlfriends on their nose art. Not brits.
Do you know why 21st century girls can't pull off 20th century sexiness? Because that just isn't considered "sexy" anymore. Just look at her. Way too much makeup in all the wrong places, fake hair, bad lighting, forced pose, not even an inkling of focus on the legs...
@AntonF**kingEgo: Eh, it's a give and take situation. On the other hand, chicks in the 21st century actually mow the lawn as opposed to the dreaded jungle commonly associated with the seventies, as that's when porn went relatively mainstream, but surely prevailed through most of the 20th century.
Trimmed trim ftw. I'll be damned if I'm going down with a snorkel and a sandwich on some Wookie-bushed vixen of yesteryear.
If Japan had won the war, Japan would still be an technologically backward, religiously imperialistic state...
Sometimes it's actually good for a country to lose a war. Especially when they've won too often before, such as the US with Vietnam... Granted, it wasn't good for the soldiers involved, but for the nation as a whole? Yeah, I think it did some good.
I just don't see how Japan could even get a negotiated peace? The U.S. so badly outclassed Japan in manufacturing capabilities, the even the total loss of the Pacific Fleet would have just put off a U.S. victory for several more years.
WWII Star craft analogy (inspired by my reply in another post):
Germany -
Terran metal on a normal map. no hacks.
Strong combined offence but somewhat poor defence. Had a decent amount of resources and had very good technology. Radar technology was behind and all communication cracked.
Britain -
Protoss air. minimap hack. all units double vision.
Had air superiority which helped ground defence. Cracked the German codes so they knew most German positions and practised advanced information theory to keep Germany guessing. Radar was advanced.
Japan -
Zerg ultralisks, scourges and cracklings supported by using hydralisks as meat. all units with 1/3 vision. no hacks.
Japan had a faulty naval strategy. They thought battleships (ultralisks) were the most important unit and sacrificed carriers (hydralisks ) to save battleships. Used encryption codes that were fully broken and had extremely primitive radar.
US-
Mass carrier toss air supported by terran tank crawl and ghosts. Full hacks. starting position is from a money map.
Basically had every advantage and took it. Nuclear launch was also detected.
@kingmanic: what you seem to forgett, is that japan had only 100 years to develop from the middle-ages to a fully industrial, war-capable country, wheras america had twice the time and already the basics of thechnology from europe. I think it's safe to asume, that had the germans shared their progress on atomic weaponry and missile technology, japan would have been perfectrly capable of perfecting it and using it against it's enemies. I think they proved that they were quite savvy regarding newer technologies, just lacked time and resources to adapt.
but more importantly, the japanese fought for the emperor and where ready to fight until the end for their country. that is, until the nukes where dropped.
but if america had had to enter the main japanese islands, they would have suffered very heavy losses, as the japanese soldiers would have fought to the last one. technology is one aspect of war. but human will power can do extraordinary things.
@laencythe: Not saying Japan wasn't a force to reckon with but in comparison their industrial complex and technology lagged in a few important areas. At the start of the war The Japanese war machine was both technically and numerically superior. In the span of a few years America bridged that gap and surpassed them. Ditto with Britain and Germany. Germany always had a distinct technological lead and it's simply amazing they kept resource rich Britain and France down for decades as long as they did in both wars. In fact the German weaponized rocketry program immigrated to America and Russia and became the US and USSR space programs.
Ironically one of the key players in that technological dominance is a homosexual they would have gassed. Alan Turing. He helped crack all the encryption codes, laid down the theoretical and practical foundations for modern computing and played a hand in the Allied dominance in fire control.
German had given up on the bomb as impossible. Perhaps it was espionage/sabotage but they believed the bomb wasn't possible and suspended their a-bomb project. They lacked the political support, the resources, and scientists. Ironically again one of the lynch pins of the Manhatten project (although he did not work on it) was also an German Jew who fled to America. Einstein laid the theoretical ground work for it and lent his name to a letter to push for the project. This motivated the administration to whole heartily support the project.
What I'm saying is Germany and Japan were fighting at some pretty great disadvantages. They had their lines of communications compromised. Laboured under poor strategic assumptions. And were massively outproduced by America and between America and Britain they were out 'teched' in all the important technologies (encryption, radar, fire control, the bomb).
@kingmanic: My understanding is that while significant hide-bound Imperial Navy factions favored battleships, the winning faction - led by Yamamato - recognized the primacy of naval air power.
Indeed, that - with the Blitzkrieg in Europe - were the key innovations of WWII.
We caught up in those areas, and excelled in the others you note, but they innovated in these areas. Indeed, that's how they got as far as they did, and so quickly.
Ironically, one battle that Yamamato lost was the decision to attack the US. He saw it led to folly.
"As what BelgianBadger explained Japan was not going to war to defeat the US only to destroy the US Navy's ability to wage war against Japan for 3 years. During this time they would hope they could gain large portions of Asia then sue for peace."
Or, they were attacking to remove the navy, which they had the possibility of doing, so that they could take hold of asia. After pushing the Americans back to their own shore, the [i]Germans[/i] could easily invade, thus destroying Japans main obstacle in holding asia.
I can forgive all what happened back during WWII and I don't hate the Japanese at all, but there is one question I would really like to get an answer for:
Do Japanese people from today know what they did during the war?
I know it's a stupid question, but for some reason it seems most Japanese people are not aware of what happened in general during WWII. My gf and all her friends (boys and girls) have a very basic understanding of the history of the war as well as the specific battles and events.
Of course I visited cities like Hiroshima and Nagasaki and I know the people there still remember the war, but in general in seems as if the Japanese like to pretend that nothing happened at all and that they were the victims more than the aggressor.
So how is it? How do Japanese see this and what do they think of the action their nation took during the war?
@emag: No it was just curiosity. I remember what we learned in history classes when I was a kid and I was wondering how they approached kids with war in Japan.
I'm French-Canadian so for me it has always been stories of us being jumped on by some other aggressive country who wants to expand while we were dancing and eating! Or stories about how normal farm boys from Canada left their homeland to join the RAF and protect the skies of England against the German menace and to take back France, the land of our ancestors.
However it must be more difficult for Japanese teachers to tell the kids about how the Japanese tried to invade Korea over and over throughout history and how (and why) you entered in WWII.
For Canadian kids, it would sound very stupid for a country to go to war to expand territory.
I was curious because I think there is a lot to learn from WWII for a Japanese kid. Maybe that it is very dangerous to try to expand through war, but very rewarding to do it economically and technically? I don't know. What is the first thing you learned about war as a kid?
@Kaneda: just my two cents, I'm half german, half mexican, am visiting a german school in france and will soon graduate. What I have noticed, is that we germans tend to know more about the war than our french neighbours, for whatever reason that may be. though I think that the japanese in fact have more of a problem with aknowledging it than we do.
as a sidenote, during a trip to japan I met this french girl who had this idea, that the americans bombed pearl harbour themselves in order to provoke a war with japan. so you know, igonrance knows no country.
My aunt is German so I'm kind of aware of how Germans see it now and how they dealt with it.
The Japanese definitely didn't pass that chapter. They prefer to hide it, as they hide everything they are ashamed of. As they hide the homeless in Tokyo, denying their very existence, for example.
I go out with a Japanese and I have many Japanese friends. I regularly visit Japan and I truly respect their nation and people. Ever since I was a young boy, Japan has always fascinated me because it is so mysterious. However, despite the great technical achievements of its people, it seems Japan still lacks a certain wisdom and peace of mind that old Europeans gained after the war.
Just what I see for now. I still have many years to understand Japan anyway.
@Kaneda: I also have many Japanese friends. They seem pretty aware that Imperial Japan was a bad, bad thing.
They're also the only post-industrialized country with an article in their Constitution forbidding force outside of (real) defense. And it remains a popular article.
For a country of their wealth, influence and vulnerability, they're a remarkably pacifistic people and nation. We could learn from them (and from yours).
But some of the specifics - Nanjing - they're a bit fuzzy on. No one's perfect.
@Kobun: not sure if this is a US vs Other English Speaking Countries thing, but at least in American English, we quite regularly say "The war with" as well as "the war against" and occasionally "the war on" but that is almost always referring to a thing and not a nation or group.
@NoBullet: Especially when you consider that the Japanese made the brutally bad strategic choice of valuing Battleships over Carriers. The Americans saw the real value in carriers and structured their fleets to protect them while the Japanese over valued the battleships and sacrificed carriers to save relatively less worthy battleships.
@kingmanic: @System_Zero: It's totally useful. Once alien forces destroy all other weapons and we develop the technology to raise it and retrofit it for space flight I think we'll see how "useless" it is...
@kingmanic: In a word, no. In fact, the Japanese came up with the concept (and very tricky to do implementation) of naval aerial warfare.
It was the Allies that were fighting the last war.
Granted, our mobilization, once began, overwhelmed Imperial Japan. But their strategic breakthrough was always based on marine-based aircraft. We were playing catch-up for most of the war, and McArthur improvised with his island-hopping campaign.
Capital ships, of course, require vast resources and lead times to produce. Thus they had a surplus of battleships, and after Midway, lost their air carrier edge. Most crushingly, they lost their pilots. Those were the hardest resources to replace.
But Yamato was the first to see the value of air carriers over battleships, which was genius.
As what BelgianBadger explained Japan was not going to war to defeat the US only to destroy the US Navy's ability to wage war against Japan for 3 years. During this time they would hope they could gain large portions of Asia then sue for peace.
It was empire building with a planned peace at the end. Japan never had any plans on invading the US only to sink the Carrier fleet and push the US Navy back to their west coast bases.
This game could try two different outcomes.
1. Disable the US Navy so they can't perform the island hopping that helped defeat Japan. If the US fleet can't get within striking distance to the home islands it would be a stalemate.
2. Force the US to invade the home islands and grind down the US invasion force so as to make public opinion go against it because of the number of deaths that would have occurred among US forces.
@Starplate: of course we know that every game about american soldiers includes the unfair treatment of native american and afro-american soldiers, the forced labour camps in which asian amercicans where interned during the war, for no other reason than being asian, the shooting of japanese surrendees because they "couldn't be bothered", and of course the lynchings that took place in the american mid- and southwest during half a century. remember, hitler killing jews was bad, but as son a a "nigger" did something to displease the whites it was perfectly right to "teach them a lesson".
Making generalisations is fun, huh? and good god we don't have any games about the Indian-american wars...
no country is better than the other when it comes to war-crimes and violations of human rights. no, not even america.
@laencythe: Actually, the internment of Japanese citizens was only along the west coast, and while certainly an overraction and certainly illeagal, some Japanese citizens in Hawaii did contribute to detailing positions and movements of ships in and out of the harbors before the attacks.
Dangeresque (Kojima-san doesn't have to make Metal Gear any more) was starred
Dangeresque (Kojima-san doesn't have to make Metal Gear any more) was unstarred
Even the Japanese themselves knew that they couldn't win the war outright, their objective the whole time was to win enough battles to force the US to deal for peace and allow them to keep at least some of the new territory they had conquered. I wonder if the game reflects that or not?
@BelgianBadger: Maybe. It could be why they are being coy with how Japan "wins". Either way they better hope something similar happens with the USSR or they get steamrolled out of China.
04/18/09
Just sayin...
04/17/09
04/17/09
04/17/09
You can tell who plays too many video games because they expect a "good looking woman" to resemble Rikku, Lara, or Joanna Dark.
04/17/09
It's like models forgot how to look awesome.
04/17/09
Trimmed trim ftw. I'll be damned if I'm going down with a snorkel and a sandwich on some Wookie-bushed vixen of yesteryear.
04/17/09
Someone call Chris Hansen!
04/17/09
04/17/09
04/04/09
Sometimes it's actually good for a country to lose a war. Especially when they've won too often before, such as the US with Vietnam... Granted, it wasn't good for the soldiers involved, but for the nation as a whole? Yeah, I think it did some good.
04/03/09
So really, how "realistic" could they get?
[www.combinedfleet.com]
04/03/09
WWII Star craft analogy (inspired by my reply in another post):
Germany -
Terran metal on a normal map. no hacks.
Strong combined offence but somewhat poor defence. Had a decent amount of resources and had very good technology. Radar technology was behind and all communication cracked.
Britain -
Protoss air. minimap hack. all units double vision.
Had air superiority which helped ground defence. Cracked the German codes so they knew most German positions and practised advanced information theory to keep Germany guessing. Radar was advanced.
Japan -
Zerg ultralisks, scourges and cracklings supported by using hydralisks as meat. all units with 1/3 vision. no hacks.
Japan had a faulty naval strategy. They thought battleships (ultralisks) were the most important unit and sacrificed carriers (hydralisks ) to save battleships. Used encryption codes that were fully broken and had extremely primitive radar.
US-
Mass carrier toss air supported by terran tank crawl and ghosts. Full hacks. starting position is from a money map.
Basically had every advantage and took it. Nuclear launch was also detected.
04/03/09
but more importantly, the japanese fought for the emperor and where ready to fight until the end for their country. that is, until the nukes where dropped.
but if america had had to enter the main japanese islands, they would have suffered very heavy losses, as the japanese soldiers would have fought to the last one. technology is one aspect of war. but human will power can do extraordinary things.
04/03/09
Ironically one of the key players in that technological dominance is a homosexual they would have gassed. Alan Turing. He helped crack all the encryption codes, laid down the theoretical and practical foundations for modern computing and played a hand in the Allied dominance in fire control.
German had given up on the bomb as impossible. Perhaps it was espionage/sabotage but they believed the bomb wasn't possible and suspended their a-bomb project. They lacked the political support, the resources, and scientists. Ironically again one of the lynch pins of the Manhatten project (although he did not work on it) was also an German Jew who fled to America. Einstein laid the theoretical ground work for it and lent his name to a letter to push for the project. This motivated the administration to whole heartily support the project.
What I'm saying is Germany and Japan were fighting at some pretty great disadvantages. They had their lines of communications compromised. Laboured under poor strategic assumptions. And were massively outproduced by America and between America and Britain they were out 'teched' in all the important technologies (encryption, radar, fire control, the bomb).
04/05/09
Indeed, that - with the Blitzkrieg in Europe - were the key innovations of WWII.
We caught up in those areas, and excelled in the others you note, but they innovated in these areas. Indeed, that's how they got as far as they did, and so quickly.
Ironically, one battle that Yamamato lost was the decision to attack the US. He saw it led to folly.
04/03/09
Or, they were attacking to remove the navy, which they had the possibility of doing, so that they could take hold of asia. After pushing the Americans back to their own shore, the [i]Germans[/i] could easily invade, thus destroying Japans main obstacle in holding asia.
04/05/09
04/03/09
Do Japanese people from today know what they did during the war?
I know it's a stupid question, but for some reason it seems most Japanese people are not aware of what happened in general during WWII. My gf and all her friends (boys and girls) have a very basic understanding of the history of the war as well as the specific battles and events.
Of course I visited cities like Hiroshima and Nagasaki and I know the people there still remember the war, but in general in seems as if the Japanese like to pretend that nothing happened at all and that they were the victims more than the aggressor.
So how is it? How do Japanese see this and what do they think of the action their nation took during the war?
04/03/09
Then again, what do you want them (and us) to do? Get all emo and cry about the sins of our forefathers, for the rest of time?
04/03/09
I'm French-Canadian so for me it has always been stories of us being jumped on by some other aggressive country who wants to expand while we were dancing and eating! Or stories about how normal farm boys from Canada left their homeland to join the RAF and protect the skies of England against the German menace and to take back France, the land of our ancestors.
However it must be more difficult for Japanese teachers to tell the kids about how the Japanese tried to invade Korea over and over throughout history and how (and why) you entered in WWII.
For Canadian kids, it would sound very stupid for a country to go to war to expand territory.
I was curious because I think there is a lot to learn from WWII for a Japanese kid. Maybe that it is very dangerous to try to expand through war, but very rewarding to do it economically and technically? I don't know. What is the first thing you learned about war as a kid?
04/03/09
04/03/09
as a sidenote, during a trip to japan I met this french girl who had this idea, that the americans bombed pearl harbour themselves in order to provoke a war with japan. so you know, igonrance knows no country.
04/03/09
My aunt is German so I'm kind of aware of how Germans see it now and how they dealt with it.
The Japanese definitely didn't pass that chapter. They prefer to hide it, as they hide everything they are ashamed of. As they hide the homeless in Tokyo, denying their very existence, for example.
I go out with a Japanese and I have many Japanese friends. I regularly visit Japan and I truly respect their nation and people. Ever since I was a young boy, Japan has always fascinated me because it is so mysterious. However, despite the great technical achievements of its people, it seems Japan still lacks a certain wisdom and peace of mind that old Europeans gained after the war.
Just what I see for now. I still have many years to understand Japan anyway.
04/05/09
04/05/09
They're also the only post-industrialized country with an article in their Constitution forbidding force outside of (real) defense. And it remains a popular article.
For a country of their wealth, influence and vulnerability, they're a remarkably pacifistic people and nation. We could learn from them (and from yours).
But some of the specifics - Nanjing - they're a bit fuzzy on. No one's perfect.
04/03/09
04/03/09
04/04/09
04/03/09
04/03/09
04/03/09
04/03/09
04/05/09
It was the Allies that were fighting the last war.
Granted, our mobilization, once began, overwhelmed Imperial Japan. But their strategic breakthrough was always based on marine-based aircraft. We were playing catch-up for most of the war, and McArthur improvised with his island-hopping campaign.
Capital ships, of course, require vast resources and lead times to produce. Thus they had a surplus of battleships, and after Midway, lost their air carrier edge. Most crushingly, they lost their pilots. Those were the hardest resources to replace.
But Yamato was the first to see the value of air carriers over battleships, which was genius.
04/03/09
It was empire building with a planned peace at the end. Japan never had any plans on invading the US only to sink the Carrier fleet and push the US Navy back to their west coast bases.
This game could try two different outcomes.
1. Disable the US Navy so they can't perform the island hopping that helped defeat Japan. If the US fleet can't get within striking distance to the home islands it would be a stalemate.
2. Force the US to invade the home islands and grind down the US invasion force so as to make public opinion go against it because of the number of deaths that would have occurred among US forces.
Either of these would have been a win for Japan.
04/03/09
You know people in California were killed because of their fire balloons, right?
04/03/09
04/03/09
04/03/09
As 'smart' as your comments are, you don't play a footsolder or experience the ground war in these games, ever.
HAR HAR HAR U SO CLEVEAR.
04/03/09
04/03/09
Is Mass Rape like Mass Effect or something? Or rape in a Catholic church?
04/03/09
Making generalisations is fun, huh? and good god we don't have any games about the Indian-american wars...
no country is better than the other when it comes to war-crimes and violations of human rights. no, not even america.
04/03/09
04/05/09
My understanding is that no Hawaiian US citizens of Japanese descent - none - were ever convicted of spying for Imperial Japan.
04/03/09
04/03/09
This only ceases to pump up my excitement. We're finally getting to play the 'other side' in games beyond WWII hex strategy games for the PC.
04/05/09
04/03/09
04/03/09
04/03/09