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Denver, 8:31 AM
Fri Dec 18
64 posts in the last 24 hours
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07:27 AM
12:25 AM
But I just feel this is even worse than not having it rated.
You're country is now looking into getting an R18 rating and in the midst of that this game, a game that is rightfully given an 18 the rest fo the world, is getting a 15 certificate.
So now you'll have the folks parading round that there's this game on sale to kids (cos that's what 15 year olds are) and it'll just set it all back a bit.
Yes not having an R18 rating is bad, but purposefully giving games incorrect ratings is not the way to solve the issue.
12:08 AM
12/17/09
If nothing in the code was changed, exactly what changed their minds?
12:03 AM
That is why the current classification system is so screwed, 15yr olds can play this when really it should only be available for 18 years and over. Good thing for 15 yr olds that Atkinson is so bent on not introducing the new rating.
12:08 AM
Meh, who am I. I just find it surprising that they would suddenly become so fickle over a decision they have made when they've always been so hardline in the past.
12:09 AM
I'm not sure I'd say it undermines the system, but I do see it as one more step towards the inclusion an R18+ classification within the Australian system. It'll happen eventually, it's just a matter of when. Capatalism usually wins out in the end. ;)
12/17/09
12/17/09
12/17/09
Thats a new one...
They're kinda splitting hairs here.
12/17/09
Not makin that up.
12/17/09
Thats.....weird....
What really gets me here is the variations in
"Strong ______ Violence"
12/17/09
12:15 AM
"Depictions of Very Bad Weather"
SOMEONE THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!
12/17/09
12/17/09
12/17/09
12/17/09
12/17/09
And maybe some Moderate Violent Nudity.
Good times...
12/17/09
12/17/09
12/17/09
12/17/09
12/17/09
12/17/09
It just seems to me that most people don't understand that video games are not all aimed for kids, and if things like tobacco, alcohol, porn, and everything else mentioned by Izod517 are not banned but rather sold or showed in a way that makes it difficult for kids to get then why not do the same for games?
That just shows that video games are still perceived differently, and as long as that holds, people will not try to look for a solution that allows young adults to enjoy the games they want while still keeping those games away from children.
12/17/09
I actually said as much in a post below.
All of those "vices" we'll call 'em have/had different ways of becoming less threatening and falling under the public scrutiny radar. Remember when Joe the Camel was banned from being used in certain magazine ads because he was too popular with kids? When alcohol had a strict law put in place that made a person culpable for crimes minors committed while under the influence of alcohol purchased by adults? I think most people are too embarrassed to take their kid to see an R Rated movie because they don't want to get humiliated when the kid acts up or they don't want to get an accusing stare from other adults at the theatre. Movie channels...parents know a lot more about the content on HBO and Showtime than they do about video games. Porn is mixed in with the internet and is way too hard to police so we won't even go there. All parents are intimately familiar with all of these vices as well, not so much in the case of video games.
With all that said, who even knows if the gaming industry can or wants to survive without the underage gamers who somehow get their hands on M games. This goes for retailers too. Personally, I think if developers and publishers throw a big enough bone to the Australian rating's board, like always including a non-gory version without being asked to do so or tone down the marketing so that it doesn't cross paths with the younger demographic, then there would be less bannings. As for Manhunt? Well, if you want that game bad enough just order it online. In my opinion, that game is not copacetic in any culture, it's probably as close as you can get to a snuff film without actually being a snuff film, which is ironic because the director in the game is making a snuff film.
12/17/09
A better system would be to card people when purchasing any M rated game just as would be done with alcohol and tobacco purchases.
Shwarzanneger tried passing such legislation in California. Stores caught in the act of selling M rated games to a minor would be fined. It's unfortunate the legislation met with opposition from the fat cats in the videogame industry.
12/17/09
12/17/09
*cough*
Seriously though I'm actually really psyched for the multiplayer in this one. If you knew me you know that I don't make comments like that. Online FPS experiences? Not my thing. I play Killzone once in a while, and Team Fortress 2 is of course fantastic (mostly because all those classes let me play the game how I want to play it, not how the kids force you to play it or suffer constant griefing and headshot deaths) but the standard stuff? Meh. Simply running around with a machine gun shooting folks can be fun for a while, but it's not something that gets me hot and bothered.
All these racial based game modes though, those are exciting to me. Gives me an actual objective to strive for, and the drastically different playing races just make it all the more interesting. If switching from Heavy to Scout to Demoman refreshes me in TF2, gives me a whole new way to play on the fly, then going from Marine to Alien to Predator is even better.
Cannot wait for this game.
12/17/09
If you're looking at preventing material, such as that above, from actually being sold to kids who are legitimately too young to have access to it then Australia does it better then North America does.
It's heavy handed but the simple fact is that no 12~15 year old is going to, legally, be able to get their hands on this game.
In Canada or the US? For all the ESRB tries if a kid of that age wants to get this game then they will. M rating be damned.
So in that sense, yeah Australia's system certainly works better. But that's not to say I agree with it. Parents should be the ones who govern what their kids are doing and thusly a simply M rating should be enough to get the job done. If parents can't be trusted to parent their children responsibly then I suggest spaying and neutering them as a solution.
But out right outlawing something just because a kid might get their hands on it? Idiotic. Even if they in all likelihood probably will get their hands on it? Well... I don't know about that. I wouldn't let my kids play something I deemed too violent for them, though I think I'm fair and open minded so it's not like I'd be impairing their experiences or anything, and frankly if other parents don't care what their kids are doing who am I to say they're raising their kids wrong? I don't think a twelve year old should play a Manhunt game, but I also don't think it'll make them into murderers. So I suppose in the end I'm in favor of a self governed ESRB-like ratings system, even if objectively I think there's a lot of kids out there playing stuff they probably shouldn't be.
(note: I was exposed to plenty of violence and stuff from an early age as well, but nothing super terrible. I saw Aliens when I was a kid for example. I just say this because I don't want to make people think I'm suggesting stopping kids from playing anything even remotely violent. I don't have a problem with a 15 year old playing Halo. I do have a problem with a kid o that age or younger playing Manhunt (cliche example? Yes. Good example? Also yes) however. Or after playing the Dante's Inferno demo the other day, that's another game I don't think someone should play until they're probably ~16+. It of course varies on the kid, some are more mature then others obviously so it varies. That's where a parents judgment comes into play. Who better knows their kids? In theory anyhow)
12/17/09
12/17/09
The ratings board may have the best of intentions. And let me say that I don't think you'll find anyone here who would willingly show the posted image to a child.
But censorship is just wrong, period. Not only does it compromise the artistic vision of the developer, it takes away from the whole point of art; to express feelings and attitudes not easily represented via another media.
Here's the bottom line: either everything is okay to be depicted in art, or nothing is. Regardless of whatever the content is, somewhere there will be a person who is offended.
Regardless of the intentions of the ratings board, they are openly engaging in fascism against their citizens. The views of a few, who do not use any semblance of a standard rating process to justify their decisions, are allowed to control what free citizens can or cannot experience in the privacy of their own homes.
The world is full of all manner of weaponry, pornography, and extremist content that children should not be exposed to. That is why they have parents.