I actually thought that the 360 was doing pretty well in Europe. In the UK at least it seems pretty damn popular!

@Flazh: Yeah, continental types. Sorry, didn't make that clear enough.

UK is NOT Europe! Well, thats what the British say ;)

@Flazh: It Does well in UK, however everywhere else, not so well. In most of europe (France, Italy, Germany) The ps3 has outsold the 360 on quite a few ocassions, and with singstar out end of the month expect to see a slight sales boom

Me thinks people are just waiting for the elite to be released over here as well: why spend 340€ now when you'll be able to get a hundred gigs more hdd space AND digital video output in a couple of months or so?

Also, how in hell has Singstar sold that much over here?

I can only offer UK sales figures here, but the Xbox 360 had sold 1,193,088 units up to June 9th. I thought that was a pretty solid figure myself.

Personally I put the 360s lack of sales in Europe down to the fact that the majority of Europeans are slow to adopt new brands, products and technologies. Take a look at the software sales charts, we still love the plethora of crap movie tie-ins that get released; unlike the rest of the world most of Britain still thinks EA puts out great games. HD TV adoption rates over here are pitiful, were still happy as larry with our 576i sets. Internet speeds lag behind the rest of the world (except Scandinavia!) MS have just got to be patient with the European market, it'll take a long time before Xbox starts to become a recognised brand with name power.

Besides which I wouldn't be surprised if MS's idea of renationalised games was another WW2 FPS. Or worse.... EU Political Machine - Now with 36% more corruption.

This sounds good finally. I live in Estonia and while 360s are plentiful and really not too expensive, I could buy one, but can't use Live. It's the same in most Eastern-European countries, which, concidering it's a pay service and main draw of most 360 games, is really a grand oversight by Microsoft.
I have seen dozens of threads in local gaming forums about guys trying to access Live. Sad.

I would like to think euros buy few 360s because of its failure-rate, but of course few consumers do enough research before buying products :)

sigh the post does state non-english speaking countries.
Singstar has sold well across europe because of the many many local variations.. all in different languages. But also luckily most 'major' musical hits are in english anyway...

I've always wondered why in the USA games don't come with localised languages.. I mean come on a lot of the polulation speaks Spanish or Italian as a first language right. Seems the software houses are missing a trick to me.

It is about time that people started catering to my market.

You give the American's there 2394 generic shooter and give me something new and innovative.

Microsoft should buy the next 2 Fifa and Winning Eleven (Pro Evo) Games, and make them 360 exclusive. Sure it may cost a few hundred million, but it would create a huge sales boom in the euro market.

Here are some numbers from Germany: The PS3 outsells the X360 in monthly numbers, but the Wii is still the strongest. By the end of the year Wii should be in the lead of overall numbers, PS3 will catch up with the X360 in two years (This doesn't take Systemsellers and Pricecuts into account.)

Salesnumbers since Launch, Data from: April 2007
1. Xbox 360: 262.000 St. (Launch: December 2005)
2. Wii: 222.000 St. (Launch: December 2006)
3. PS3: 70.500 St. (Launch: March 2007)

Salesnumbers April 2007
1. Wii: 20.000 pcs.
2. PS3: 16.000 pcs.
3. Xbox 360: 9.500 pcs.

[www.cynamite.de]

@sionicus_rex: HD TV adoption rates over here are pitiful, were still happy as larry with our 576i sets.

Thats kinda true
@sionicus_rex: Internet speeds lag behind the rest of the world (except Scandinavia!)

Really? Almost everyone has DSL 6000 in Germany, and those who dont are either uninterested in anything other than emails or have DSL 16000. I think thats pretty fast.

With around 1.5 MB/sec you could stream a DVD (~1.3MB/sec)

@lollercoaster: Everyone waits for the Elite.

I plan on buying a 360 and I would not buy an overpriced Elite model. I think its quite a disappointment if the new price is also taken into
consideration.

@Macca: Hell, they should buy Nintendo and Sony too. This would make "conquering the world" so easier...

Love the Photoshop job on the map -- makes it looks like MS will be concentrating their efforts on a number of farming communities northwest of Warsaw :)

It's a shame MS haven't already gotten a better hold of Europe. Out of the three console giants, they're the only ones who don't treat Europe like shit compared to America and Japan.

Europe still gets treated like horseshit from the entire gaming industry.

href="#c1798164">Kuraudo:

That is quite true. 360 releases tend to be almost simultaneuous to the USA, unlike Sony (GoW2, recently The Darkness) and Ninty (Pokemon, Super Paper Mario, SNES etc)

Saying that, we are still without a HD Video Marketplace on Xbox Live, which kinda sucks when you figure in how much we pay for the service.

@Flazh: I'm Swiss. I know one single person with a 360. It's a friend of my brother. I don't even know his name. And it's the only person I know how owns a 360. I only know he owns one because he doesn't use it, so he lent it to my brother, and it's currently sitting under his living room table, collecting dust (literally, too)...

OTOH, I know 6 people with a PS3 (including myself), lots of people who generally intend to get a PS3, but don't, because it costs too much, and countless people who own Wiis. It's just one single data point, of course.

There are five reasons why I don't own a 360:
- It costs too much
- Quality seems to be crappy
- I don't like FPS
- I don't play online often enough to pay
- It's Microsoft

I have no idea why others don't buy 360s. I think it's price and brand, mostly. People know Nintendo and Playstation. Microsoft has a very bad image (everyone seems to have issues with Windows), and Xbox probably sounds too unwelcoming for many.

@AbyssUK:
"I've always wondered why in the USA games don't come with localised languages"

Mainly because of costs, and the time required to get a good translation (you don't want reverse 'Engrish').

@L_K_M :

Although I don't suscribe to all of them (I'm French and I own a 360), you've stated fairly good reasons why the 360 doesn't sell so well in Europe.

My guess is things could turn out better for MS in Fall, when better games and exclusives are released (Assassin's Creed, Mass Effect, GTA IV). The cheapest way to play GTA IV will be to own a 360, this should drag sales upward.

How big is GTA4 on the continent? In the UK I know it will sell by the truckload, what with so many chav kids who'd love to go on a crime spree, but with differing tastes across the borders of Europe you never know. Perhaps France is waiting eagerly for Vineyard Tycoon, or Italy is wetting itself in anticipation of Moped Death IV.

@sionicus_rex:

Now with 33% more corruption?! My gods that would almost make it as corrupt as the UK government...

Actually I think a big problem with many games is that many of my fellow Europeans have had enough of playing bloody American characters, or playing as the American side in a game. I loved that Battlefield on the 360 had an EU army choice for some maps.

Give me characters from England, Catalonia or Bayern and I can relate to them about a thousand times more than some guy from Broklyn or California.

@Walshicus:

I said 36% more corruption, that extra 3% takes it just slightly over the British government. ;)

I enjoy it when games are set in the UK. My dream is to see a Dead Rising sequel set in a British shopping arcade. Not only would you have British psychopaths to take down, there would be no guns or lousy aiming system. Huzzah!

@sionicus_rex:

"HD TV adoption rates over here are pitiful, were still happy as larry with our 576i sets."

If you walk into any electrics store to buy a new TV you'll walk out with a HD one. The smaller shops don't even sell SDTVs anymore.

"Internet speeds lag behind the rest of the world (except Scandinavia!)"

I don't know about you, but my 20Mb cable seems pretty damn fast. Most people I know have up to 8Mb ADSL if not higher, so I wouldn't say we're "lagging" as such. We sure are no Sweden, though.

Not many people like the 360 here (France) because of all the shooters and the Xbox didn't have a good rep. PS2 was huge so people expect the PS3 to be more of the same. They'll buy it without knowing any of the games out for it. Not to mention PS3 online is free. "But Xbox Live is worth the price!". Not in Europe. No video market place, barely any downloads and in Europe (especially the UK) you pay more for Live than the US. Another case of paying more for less.

@Walshicus:

Chances are you'll see characters from Catalonia and Bayern when you see Nazi Chipmunks carpet bomb Moscow with green cheese made from the moon.Seeing a game set in the UK with localized characters is a good bet at some point though.:)

Better late than never I suppose. Nice to see they're not just giving up on the areas they are weak in.

Europe is still mainly owned by Sony. I live in the UK and know several people from Sweden who all seem to think the PS3 is the best thing to happen to gaming since 3D, reason they don't own one is because of price, but you can bet they'll snap one up with a price drop.

I'd say, Europeans are the people that don't go online much, don't do any research. They still think Sony is the market leader with all the exclusives, which just isn't the case.

In any case, Microsoft needs to fix there rep, show off the 360 better. I think in my whole time the 360 has been out i've seen 1 TV ad for a 360 game, however the Nintendo DS has ads running all day long(in UK).

Sure more games that suit the regions better but basically i'd say they need to create more awareness. There are just son many people in Europe with PS2 who refuse to upgrade. They need to show people "hey look we have the best looking console games",a great online service, come join us.

@L_K_M: Well I'll be damned. Im Swiss too!! I actually OWN a 360, and I am currently in the process of acquireing a PS3 for MGS4. I enjoy it very much, it has never failed me and the online is pretty solid. Then again, I also am a PC gamer, and I consider Half-Life to be the best thing that has happened since cheese Fondue.
I guess mainland europe is far more interested in RTS and tactical games. Games were you have to think and ponder about what to do. No mindless slaughter and killing.
MS need to have a price-drop bundled with H3, Mass Effect or Bioshock. That should get the euros pumping hardware from the stores.

@Tezs: As long as the US is the main market. Give it a decade, and we will see the first games with european MC's. If not, wait until I make my own studio.

Better late than never...

@People who don't know who Lara Croft is

No european characters in games... come on the MOST famous real life like character in any game is ENGLISH seesh..

@AbyssUK:

You are forgetting THE most famous character. Mario!

@AbyssUK:

The fact Lara Croft is English only makes her merely semi-European.

@MasterOfPastures: Well, I guess that almost kind of makes you my second 360-owning acquaintance :-)

I'll have to echo Tiberian on this one. I live in Sweden, and I think the reason why 360 is doing so badly is because of the image they have from being a software developer for PC. Nintendo has been around since forever and Playstation is synonymous with console gaming.

Microsoft needs to establish a new image with thier console, and send the message "Why you should buy a 360 instead of Wii or PS3".
Sony is pushing it's Full-HD agenda pretty aggressively, and the install base for HDTVs here is pretty high.
Wii is selling because of the brand, low price and casual games, which is a huge market.
The 360 falls somewhere between. I think it's just a matter of time though. Takes a while to establish yourself among us slow europeans.

The 360 here in Central Europe is downright ridiculous. At a store you'll maybe find one or two cause there's no point in stocking any more. It's not about making "European" games or anything like that. They just need more marketing. Few people know about the 360. The playsation 3 on the other hand? Everyone knows the playstation brand. It's not the games on 360. It's just that M$ haven't made a big deal out of the 360

Heh. Reminds me of the first time I saw an Xbox 360. It was a demo system in a display museum (or something, I wasn't quite sure what it was) for Ferrari (or some brand of sports car) on the Champs-Élysées in Paris. It was about a week before the 360 had launched in the US, so there was an interested crowd of people who gathered around it to try PGR3. They were all loud American tourists. :)

I've run into quite a few Europeans playing on the 360, most of them from Holland and the UK, but others from France, Italy, etc.
They're all playing [Settlers of] Catan and Carcasonne, and some seem to play a lot of Forza 2. If Microsoft wants to do better in continental Europe, they should do more XBLA board games (I know they already have Alhambra coming out). They should put out any other "Spiel des Jahres" award winning games that would work well for online multiplayer.
That would probably really help them in those countries listed above plus Germany and Scandinavia.

@Yanko:
The UK we can either be the 51st state or Euro friendly... we can't go it alone economically anymore and playing the peace keet to say.per between the two (euro/usa) sucks. I'd actualy rather be French than American and thats a big thing for a brit to say!!

It doesn't help that whenever I've seen a display (and I've only ever seen one that's actually on)it was once playing some bad basketball game and the other time it was an even worse dynasty warriors style game (of which I don't remember the name). Gee, why don't they put GoW or Forza on!

Europe is Sony heartland? Weird, because I don't know but one friend out of ~20 (who are interested in videogames), who's owned a PS3 so far - and sold it again. Of course, that's a tiny mass, but those friends of mine who like videogames are still playing their PS2. However they're thinking about a 360 purchase rather than any other console.

interesting issue.

being british i have a poor handle on european tastes. but its got to be better than americans. id suggest microsofts problem is just brand consciousness, or lack thereof. if sega had never died, they would be strong competition here today. the console war involving the first playstation was a formative one for the european market. console gaming hadnt been as large as the states to that point, but it took off during that generation. and sony won it comprehensively. european awareness was cast in stone. microsoft came along later and had no chance to catch up owing to the way things played out, what with launching much later than the ps2. that situation persisted to the new generation. its also a reason why the wii is doing well, as that is a name people remember. lower internet-lifestyle penetration (i made that word up but you know what i mean, for reference take a poll of how many europeans browse, say, this site) prevents most europeans from educating themselves about the actual state of the industry, so they continue in ignorance to chant sony, sony, sony. youve got an entire economic bloc with generations of gamers going back 15 years for whom sony is the way to go.

personally i believe its a lost cause. there is little microsoft could do to change the state of affairs, sony are the incumbents and theyre not going anywhere. theres no approach i can think of to change the situation. if sony were to go bankrupt tomorrow and cease ps3 sales, europe wouldnt move to ms, theyd just stop gaming, or maybe buy a wii. this is why europe gets shat on all the time. there is little point giving them the same treatment as anywhere else, because they dont behave or react like anywhere else - they dont react at all. its an inert market. all those people talking about europe being the next battleground fundamentally misunderstand it.

the good news, for me at least, is that britain is not europe. here, xboxen are plentiful, and the ps3 is too expensive.

I like how in the picture they start by invading Poland.