FTA:
"I pressed him about why his organization is going after M-rated games rather than R-rated movies, and he kept repeating "the focus on this today is on video games, not movies."

It's ridiculous to have separate standards for video games and movies or even books for that matter. All forms of media have a wide spectrum of violent and sexually explicit content. The only reason these groups attack video games is because they can make inaccurate and misleading statements without being immediately contradicted by mainstream media.

People who don't play video games know nothing about GTA, except that it's a huge phenomenon that they're not a part of. That's bound to make a few people nervous and groups like the PTC pander to that anxiety. These are the same people who said rock-and-roll was corrupting our youth in the 50's. Jerks.

This is getting so ridiculous. At first it was enraging, then I stopped caring, and now I can't take it.

It's a game. It's rated appropriately. Average gamer are adults up to mid 30s.

What the hell do they want. Enough, [organization of the day]. E fucking nough.

PTC, this is for you.

*flushes toilet*

Oh, i'm sure Fox "News" will be getting company-wide stiffies on the thought of being able to run this garbage night and day for a few newscycles. Ignore real problems, think of the children!

Have you played the game?

"I've actually played 'Grand Theft Auto IV,' and it's right in keeping with previous versions. The series continues to lower the bar and this is the first game that has an alcohol content warning. You get points for driving drunk in this game."

You know that's not true, right? The game doesn't have points.

"If nothing else, it's a rewarded activity. Necessary for advancement."

I don't think so.

"But there's an alcohol content warning and a scene of drunk driving, correct?"

Yes. Did you play that part?

"No, no. I didn't get that far."

Are you a gamer at all? Do you play any games these days?

"I enjoy video games."

What do you play?

"I have a lot of fun. I play all sorts of games. I actually have a Wii."

I'm sorry sir, but if all you own is a Wii, you are missing out a bit and you should really do a bit more of your homework.

Another misinformed person with the contradictory mentality of "games are for kids, but they're too violent for kids."

The worst part about this (completely expected) outburst of hate against GTA IV is that Rockstar DID learn some lessons from San Andreas. The girlfriend-sex scenes are five seconds in length, tops, meaning that they didn't just actually have the characters do the act inside, and change the camera angle (Hot Coffee). Also, there's only one girl you really need to date for storyline purposes, and the sex scenes with her have her exclaiming "Oh Niko...tell me more...interesting things!" Cheeky Rockstar.

Then we have the ad campaign, which floored me with its universal sense of class. Sure, we have the requisite hot girl, but so does every movie poster, and at least she's fully clothed. No one is carrying a gun, or even doing anything more violent than giving you a mean glare. Rockstar scaled a lot of things back, and I respect them for it, but stuff like this still happens.

Helen Lovejoy would be proud.

@karasu is my homeboy:

If the average gamer is in his mid-thirties then why is this rarely reflected online?

I fully agree that groups like this are full of it.

However I think the best way forward is to make it impossible for kids to buy M-rated games. That way the blame lies fully on the parents, not the shop or the publisher, when their kid plays the game and does something stupid.

This will also help those of us that are older enjoy online gaming without some 13 year old acting like everyone wants to hear him act like a jack-off.

Great, more morons. Seriously, where do they get this info from and why do people keep giving these whackjobs outlets to talk.

Someone seriously needs to stand up for gamers.

This game is rated M for a reason. Movies are rated R for a reason but R rated movies are ok for the kiddies. Just like adult rated TV shows are fine for the kiddies. But games, good god, games are the devil's work.

I hate people, specifically stupid people who have no idea what they're talking about.

this BS would die out soon, S. Miyamoto is bringing in the casual market, soon moms and grandmas will be playing videogames and wondering what the hell is the media talking about, like how is wii sports a bad thing?

After speaking to Isett, who sheepishly said he's not a parent, I'd say he's a smart guy with the best of intentions.

So, the Director of Public Policy for the Parent's Television Council doesn't have kids? Who made that hire?

Thank you, kind sir, for telling me how I should feel about a subject on which you have no relevant experience.

"You know that's not true, right? The game doesn't have points.

"If nothing else, it's a rewarded activity. Necessary for advancement."

I don't think so."

It was worth it, just for that.

Last time I checked, the game PUNISHES you for driving drunk.

@AndrewG009:

The wii is a games console.

I call bullshit. If the PTC guy had actually played any of the game, he'd at least be able to explain some of the scenes from the beginning of the game. From the article it sounded like he was just avoiding all the questions that were designed to find out if he really had any first hand experience with the game.

PTC, do us all a favor and get off Fox News' dick. We have enouch ignorant douchebags proclaiming GTA4 to be the worst thing since Reefer Madness, Rock n Roll, and NWA. Leave us all the fuck alone so we can go back to our normal lives.

I hate people, specifically stupid people who have no idea what they're talking about.

Then why are you on an internet discussion board?

;-p

@chiefpoopingpants: Too true. There have been too many times when I've logged on to have someone just generally ruin my game because they want to talk shit.

That said I had to talk some shit when someone on GTA IV online said it was an American game.

@Puck:

These groups are largely followings of PMRC, a group created by.......TIPPER GORE, yes Al Gore's wife, a democrat, having nothing to do with Fox News. You asshats here just keep spouting the same crap without reading or actually learning what your talking about.

Thats one area of the game Rockstar got amazingly wrong, when the swipes they took were hidden and needed a bit of intelligence they were funny. Now they do it openly and its not funny anymore, I guess when a majority of your audience has never read a book you need to spell every last thing out for them.

Ignorance like this continues to highlight the problem - that there is a misconception about who games are for. It seems that most people from previous generations still think that games are for kids, so they react accordingly when a game like this comes out. I just wish there was a way to change this perception. I mean, these games are making HUGE records when they come out, and it's not just a bunch of anti-social 14 year olds waiting in line to buy them, but grown-ups with jobs and normal people who like doing all kinds of other normal activities as well. It's starting to drive me nuts how ridiculous this is all getting.

I know that in 10-15 years, people making these decisions and writing these articles are more and more likely to have grown up with gaming, but I just get worried that some kind of stupid legislation or overhaul of the industry will get forced upon us before that day comes.

Strange, driving drunk when I played only resulted in me nearly getting busted. :P

Maybe one day these people will realize that these comments they make are pretty much free publicity for what they're trying to decry? Especially when the bulk of their reports are grounded thoroughly in ignorance...

Hell, it is possible to shoot people in the game, and take them out of combat without actually killing them (Leg shots). And much like the tranquilizing gun in MGS3, they're considered 'dead'. The only exception are the scenes where the NPC must die, and from what I've played that's only happened with 2 guys so far. Hell, 90% of the times I accidentally hit somebody, they get up and walk away from it.

But ignorance is bliss, and sales and hits for everybody involved.

@IanC: As we are all well aware, but if you just have a Wii, I believe you are missing out. I love my Wii and 360, and once MGS4 comes out, that's the incentive to get a PS3.

This isn't 1980 people, you don't get "points" for anything anymore. Just because you're allowed to do something in a game doesn't mean you get make-believe "points" for it.

Hmmm elements of the Taliban appear to be infiltrating our fair country after all...

@Rbastid: I have to agree about the humor. It is still funny, even hilarious at times, but it's definitely less clever. (For example, "TW@". Made me smile the first time, but now it's just a bit obnoxious.) Luckily the storyline itself is still very well written.

I can't wait until we see people in a mob carrying torches to burn down Rockstar.

God, you'd think by the year 2008 people wouldn't be so sheepish and still spewing blind hate everywhere.

@Rbastid:

Way to do exactly what you're saying, being unable to read or understand. I know who is involved with this idiotic council and I couldn't care less which party they belong to. The entire point is... nevermind, you wouldn't understand.

*pats head*

Run along now.

I drove drunk in the game once. Within seconds, I was surrounded by cops. I almost died, and Brucie ended up in the hospital. So much for "points".

@Rbastid:

Hello tool, what's it like being a tool?

Do you tool it up in your little tool box with your tool friends?

Do you like doing the work of bigger tools for no recognition because you think its right to tool about for no real gain?

I like tools they're silly and easily manipulated.

"Sure, I' play games."

"Like what?"

"Oh, you know. Lots."

"Like what?"

"Like that one with the duck."

"Duck hunt?"

"No, not Duck Hunt. But wasn't that game a hoot. That crazy dog! Oh, the times we had."

"You didn't answer the question."

"Hmm?"

"Which games have you played?"

"Like I said, the one with the duck. What was it called? Journey?"

"No, Journey was the arcade game with Journey. The band Journey. No ducks."

"Oh, that's right! Man, Journey! What a band, hunh? 'Don't stop! Believe-in!' Come, on, join in!"

"Sir, I'm trying to conduct an interview here."

"'Hang on to that feelin' yeah, yeah!' Come on, let it out!"

"A duck? What duck? What game has a duck? The duck level of Bioshock? The unlockable duck weapon in Super Smash Brothers? Doctor Quack in Xenocide? What duck?"

"You know, you're in that dungeon, the duck is chasing you around..."

"You mean the last game you played was Adventure?"

"That's the one! Adventure, not Journey. How could I have -"

"This interview is over."

"But you're interviewing me! I'm supposed to-"

"Sir, this interview is over."

Are you a gamer at all? Do you play any games these days?

"I enjoy video games."

What do you play?

"I have a lot of fun. I play all sorts of games. I actually have a Wii."
==================================

LOL, Yea this guy sure is a hardcore gamer.

Their copy of GTA4 doesn't exist physically, its an abstract format within their mind. Their crazy screwed up mind that can't discern between fantasy and reality, as they believe their copy of GTA4 is somehow being played by children.

@Miksho: I am a dyed in the wool GTA fan but have you picked up prostitute (usually aroud Brucies Hood)try each level of service they are more visual than ever they make the girlfreind scenes seem like cold coffee I love it!!!

damn lag

When I get home, I shall give birth to a turd, and thus name it PTC.

@IanC: Correction the wii is a mini-games console. ZING! I kid I kid :D

@SkutSkut: It's true, I lol'd.

@PresDNA: My only experience with prostitutes in GTA IV is to push them out of the way. Then they chase me up the street. :(

I like this man. He has balls. I like balls.

what's hilarious to me is how these groups seem so up in arms about the inclusion of drunk driving and completely overlook the fact that an important part in the game is revenge killing which the game actually does reward for. hell theres rewards for simply going on homicidal rampages to acquire weapons needed to complete a mission. drunk driving is one of the few criminal activities in the game that actually make it more difficult to complete plot moving tasks.
World of Warcraft really slipped under the radar for being a teen rated game that allows you to wield a hell-fury blade of death while intoxicated yet receiving no flak from concerned parent groups despite being one of, if not the most played video game in history.

This claim of "points" is not new. Uninformed groups have claimed for years that GTA games award points for killing hookers and other M-rated activities. These people are not gamers. The PTC guy in the article may own a Wii, but he's not a gamer, either.

You'd think the PTC would have learned when they went after World Wrestling Entertainment and failed. They had to pay a sizable chunk of money (much of which was donated to their cause) and submit a public letter of apology.

Hang it up, guys. Go back to assigning stoplight ratings to network television.

[InsidiousTuna.chatango.com]

@ShaggE:

The Tw@ thing was great cause most of the times people look at it like WTF? When I got my mouse pad with it I was like oh, wait, WTF?

@Puck:

What nice try at trying to be condescending and failing. Your trying to make this an issue against something like Fox News when it has nothing to do with them. Theres no doubt on every GTA IV article here theres someone trying to take a swipe at Fox when having nothing to back their point up. You try to be clever but you just have no way to defend yourself.

@SkutSkut:

And your point? I'm the tool despite having my own real opinions and not just following what every one else here says? Maybe you should look into what your trying to talk about. Someone would be a tool when they blindly follow without knowing what their talking about. Sort of like attacking a group without having any real backing.

I believe like most of you that this issue is something that should be delt with by Parents who need to control their kids. But there also needs to be protections against idiots who are allowed to have children (see 25% of the posters)

If the game industry wants to get taken seriously they need to not act like 10 year olds. One needs to be able to abck themselves with facts and not with cookie cutter lines that every fool says after reading it off a message board.

Based on most of the arguments here these protection groups will win every case because the defense of the videogame industry is coming from people who have hard times creating and actual point and backing it with facts and not with childish jabs.

@Rbastid:
Not to sound childish, but how does one abck themselves? :)

What's really funny is that the first time you get drunk, the game notes that you are impaired and suggests that you take a taxi! Nobody seems to mention that.

And if, just like real life, if you do insist on driving under the influence the result is reduced response time, blurred vision and utter confusion. I managed it (in the game) by driving very slowly and managed (barely) not to hit anything.

If anything, they should applaud Rockstar for its realistic depiction and anti-drunk driving message. But they had already made up their minds and written up their talking points before the game was even released.

Reactionary conservatism strikes again, however: I think he makes a semi-valid point that games and movies aren't the same. Movies are a passive medium, although younger people are certain to play out or re-enact scenes they like (older folks occassionally do in the privacy of their bathrooms)(what, you've never delivered the Taxi Driver speech while shaving?), the primary means of taking in a movie doesn't require any interaction beyond sitting down in the theater or putting a DVD in the drive. Games are by their very nature interactive, which is why we love them. Even in the most linear story and restricted gameplay, WE are the ones controlling the ebb and flow of the action, which is why parents are right to be concerned about GTA4. I know for a fact we'd all agree that a highschooler properly raised could probably handle most of the themes and violence in the game, but put yourself in a parent's shoes (if you're not a parent already) and ask yourself if you'd want your 12-year-old getting warm coffee in a drunk-driving simulator?

That being said, do your research, douche nozzle.

/done with work, going home to kill and rob a hooker post-coitus

I call foul on the Kotaku article. From the way it's written, I thought they hacked the game to do all this stuff they claim to be able to do.

Imagine my dismay when I read the actual article. :(

That'd be great, though. They hack the game to further their own desires.

haha i love the Lies, Damn Lies reference. Please tell me im not the only one to get that...