Well, with Nintendo's agressive online "no cheating" policy, this will obviously be very short lived...

Oh, wait...

How can people be cheating ALREADY!? thats unpossible!

Yeah, I'm going with glitch. I remember hearing about glitches in Mario Karts, all the way back to the original.
Like, one guy said somewhere that he discovered if you hit a wall at just the right pixel in one of them, you cut through like half the level. It's probably just some bug Nitendo didn't catch.

Multiple people having the same time lends more credence to the bug theory.

... ... ... well shit.

I guess I don't care too much for Time Trials, but still. If it's a bug that'll auto-lap you 3 times... well, needless to say, we don't need no friggin' auto-teleportation-win during online races. :(

I'm a sad panda.

Will they try to do a title update (read: patch the game that should have been finished before going to retail) or will they delay the pending releases to fix the problem at the factory (thereby angering legions of Nintendo faithful)?

No-win situation.

This is why I hate these online leaderboards. When you see scores of Stardust HD in the BILLIONS and Super Hard Go!Soduku times in the 20-second range, you know that no matter how much effort you put into improving your score, it's always going to be beaten by someone who knows a cheat.

@Polywhirl: And those bugs were always things we could overlook in the past. But once something like that starts affecting online leaderboards, it'll pretty much make the leaderboards for any of those buggy tracks pointless.

Sure, right now there's only probably a couple people up there because of the bug. And you can easily watch the replay and discount their standings based on the bug; but eventually everyone on the first few pages of the board will have the exact same time because of the bug, and the board will become completely useless.

I'm guessing this is one reason they didn't put leaderboards into Brawl. They were worried about things like imbalance in characters being found and bugginess affecting the standings.

I use to care about online leader boards.

Then I played Rock Band.

Ther's this bug that somehow makes the NGC controller better than the Wiimote, they really ought to fix that shit.

@mariospants: Actually, the Sudoku thing isn't a cheat. I know the secret, and might even be one of those guys with the absurd time. All you have to do is play a level, and beat it.Then, you copy all the numbers down, and play it again.
Bam! You've beaten it in 20 seconds.
It's really just the fact that the levels never change that allows for such great times on it. Much different than Kart's imbalance.

@Polywhirl: Sounds like Wario Stadium in Mario Kart 64. Only it really wasn't that hard to do.

If you're playing with friends you can do the honor system, but for online scores? Anonymity means nobody cares.

This reminds me of how Metroid Prime: Hunters on the DS was ruined by its glitches (hiding inside walls and such) and other crazy antics like that. Then MKDS with its snaking method, which isn't actually cheating, but still gave racers who didn't know how to do it a disadvantage. As for this, its only going to get worse from here. Once specific directions of a certain bug is released, its going to spread like wildfire. And from what I know, Nintendo cannot patch the game. I really don't know why, likely because of no Hard drive, but then we got the good ol' 512 MB of flash memory and SD Cards, but who knows. =(

Maybe Nintendo will get online right next generation.

Almost as cool as the infamous "Wario Stadium" shortcut.

I've never been appealed to Time score leaderboards; just because I am embarrassingly terrible at holding any kind of game records.

The Bug Theory seems more plausible... Cheating at Mario Kart is just plain evil...

Mario Kart is infamous for its "time tricks" about 1/3 of the MK64 tracks were able to be short cutted in a matter of seconds... so its possible someone just found one.

Personally it's not a huge deal for me. Yeah, it's nice to get tops on an online leaderboard, but it is basically just the same as gamerscore. It's an e-peen contest and nothing more.

It's not going to affect my purchase.

@SanjiX: Agreed. I wish this didn't happen in games at all. I like going online and playing with a bunch of people who are simply there to have fun. People who abuse the exploits they find in games are one of the main reasons I've all but stopped playing online.

Storage problems, horrible internet play structure, (and, imo, VC problems). I remember when the Wii looked like a golden gem on the horizon. Why Nintendo?! WHY!?

@SanjiX: - "This reminds me of how Metroid Prime: Hunters on the DS was ruined by its glitches (hiding inside walls and such) and other crazy antics like that."

Yeah ... that really ruined the online mode for me. I thought I was trippin' when shots were coming out of the wall ... but then I did some research and sure enough there's not only glithces ... but honest to god hacks. See the following video below for the infinite health hack (during an online match).

+ Watch video

And other hack with infinite health, infinite ammo, and can fly with b.

+ Watch video

@Does Not Equal: - "Will they try to do a title update (read: patch the game that should have been finished before going to retail) or will they delay the pending releases to fix the problem at the factory (thereby angering legions of Nintendo faithful)?"

My guess is that they *might* fix the game, delay the next couple of shipments and print out a brand new disc. But that also means that they'd have to replace all of the other discs that people are using as well. And let's face it, the 512MB of internal storage isn't that big at all ... so there probably will be no patch. In fact, have Nintendo patched any games online? I've never read anything about that. When I've read about problems with some Wii games, Nintendo usually just fixes it and presses another disc of the game and that's that.

Oh? this game came out? Huh... I have apparently come completely apathetic towards the Wii sitting on my TV stand.

The record data is stored on Nintendo's servers so it shouldn't be hard for them to just filter these out in the future without patching the game.

@Does Not Equal:

Honestly tho, I don't see Nintendo doing anything about this. If there's only a glitch for the Time Trials, and that's it ... I bet that they'll just blow it off.

@dead_red_eyes: For Japan, the damage is done. Unless they can rig up a title update, there'll be copies of the game with that glitch/bug/exploit. For the rest of the world, though, they could fix it -- but that would probably necessitate a delay.

I have no idea what Nintendo would actually require to fix this, but whatever it is, I hope to god they do. I'm not at all interested in playing this game, but I hate seeing this stuff in any game.

Something tells me that nintendo hired a bunch of real gems for testing the game eh? Back when they had put out the add that is.

@dead_red_eyes: Nintendo have been known to hold no regard for time trials (which are one of the best aspects of Mario Kart games). Just look at Mario Kart 64 on the VC. They could have easily added some sort of memory pak emulation but nope ghost data isn't important.

Also, every online Nintendo game I've played has been overrun by hackers and/or cheaters. Take a look at Advance Wars: Days of Ruin. My god it's ridiculous.

Long story short: Nintendo have absolutely no clue how to keep out hackers/cheaters and they probably don't care too much.

Alot of people say "hopefully they get it right next gen" but I honestly doubt even that will be plausible. They just so far out of the loop it's ridiculous to ever imagine a good Nintendo online service.

And by "good" I mean "not ridiculous horrible" like every one of their online attempts have been.

@EVERYBODY:

Most of you guys suck at Mario Kart so it wasn't like you were going to get on the leaderboards anyways.

I wish they would make these things a little more cheat/cheap proof.

I think that Nintendo is still being dragged into the online-gaming age.

Remember that they place more importance on playing with family and friends than strangers. They would rather you get together with friends and family and play on the same TV, or have multiple people in close proximity play the same DS game. In that venue, anybody caught cheating would have to endure whatever his peers would inflict upon him.

Online, that can't happen. Maybe that's why they don't care so much about glitches.

@Does Not Equal: Funny thing is, I really wouldn't mind if the games didn't have online at all. I haven't come to expect Smash Bros games or Mario Kart games to be online. If they never made these games online, I wouldn't even notice.

I just hate to see people half-ass things. Especially Nintendo. For all their stubborness throughout history, Nintendo have never half-assed their games. They always put their games' quality above all else. It even almost killed them in the past (sticking with cartridges on the N64 because they didn't want load times).

But this online stuff either needs to shape up or ship out. I think Brawl is perfect in every way except for one glaring flaw: it's absolutely horrendous online mode. The worst online mode I've ever seen in any game. And I've been playing online games since the 56k days. Hell, I've been playing since the null modem days. Never, ever, have I seen such a half-assed attempt at online.

@SanjiX: Saying that snaking is in some way unfair is like saying that using a rocket launcher in a FPS is unfair. Yes, it isn't fair when you can't use it but you can LEARN to use it. Snaking takes actual skill to do, much like using items or weapons effectively. I've lost races pretty bad to players who know how to use items while I was snaking. Sometimes a well-placed shell or banana peel is enough to fuck someone up.

@VergessenHeld: I think the argument is that, in a racing game, turning on a straight-a-way shouldn't be the fastest way to run a race. It was obviously not the intended use of the drift-boost feature.

@VergessenHeld: @dowingba: Before this continues, I beg you not to turn this post into another argument about the pros and cons of snaking. We've heard it all before.

Many, many times.

Thank you!

I only play mario kart online to make *me* feel better.

@Gomerboy: um, how is snaking not relevant to a discussion of mario kart online exploits?

@StratfordX: No I agree with him. This is a debate that we've all heard a million times in the past like 2 months and there will never, ever be a conclusion to it. It's a greater paradox than religion or politics. Snaking just is. It's like a universal truth.

@StratfordX: I never said snaking was not relevant, I just don't want to read fifty posts about how people who can't snake call it cheating and those who can snake don't.

If you want to talk about snaking, talk about something like how it has affected online play, either in a positive or negative way.

For example, if suddenly there was a glitch discovered in Brawl online where Fox's gun could create one hit kills and now everyone online is using Fox and demolishing everyone who is not, what would that mean in the big scheme of online? Who would end up playing online, and who wouldn't?

@Gomerboy: For the record (and really I'm not trying to dwell on the snaking) it has affected online MKDS in an absolutely negative way. The same way any "exploit" would affect any other game.

It is something that can only realistically be done with a couple karts, and is not a well-known technique. And using it is enough of an advantage that your unwitting opponent will likely think they are a victim of hackers or horrible lag.

The vast majority of people playing online will just get completely owned by the snaker (and I'm talking, like get lapped, repeatedly) and will have no idea why unless they happen to research it on the internet. Most people, though, will not bother researching it and will simply give up on MKDS' online mode, coming to the conclusion that it is broken (and they'd be right!)

This was already on an other site inc pictures: www.n-europe.com "Today was the official launch of Mario Kart Wii but already code junkies are rubbing dirt in our eyes! 3 people that are playing online seem to have found some kind of code that makes them able to ride a exact time like the other two on every track out there. This is virtually impossible so it can only be achieved by cheating. Here are 3 pictures of it: http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/7712/image00008ij8.jpg http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/6464/image00007pz4.jpg http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/847/image00006ze1.jpg

I knew about snaking before MKDS came out and simply refused to do it. I think a speed burst is well and good for a corner. But abuse is abuse.

Easy fix for snaking set a review system for players. Set a limit (don't want to play agianst player with X rating or lower). DOA has it and it seems to work.

Mario Kart, with the "casual" experience they (nintendo) seem to lean towards. Should've thought of this crap before dating a game. Give me my $millions now.

It's obvious nintendo wasn't/isn't ready for online. They only caved due to demand and expectations.

The wii is simply turning out to be a money making machine with lackluster online gameplay (see DS). And the library is backing that up, another first party system. That fails when online play is added. (see DS)

I love nintendo, but damn. If they held their online play as high as their games. they COULD make it just off first party games. They still do make it, but holy crap! Some reviewer should take their games down a peg for total crap online. But they don't.

OOps meant to say: "I knew about snaking ,before I bought MKDS"

sorry.

I'll never understand what one gets out of being on top of a leader board by using cheats. Are their egos in that much need of stroking that they want to be number one in anything, even if it is gotten through such disingenuous means? I guess I feel more sad for the people who cheat than angry about their cheating.

@dowingba: Great points, Dow-dow. I have to wonder if the people who think you should be able to zig zag down a straightway actually like other racing games... Oh, but we're not allowed to complain about snaking. Sorry.

Did anyone honestly expect Nintendo to get online right in any aspect?

Seriously. Friend Codes were enough for me to know that online gaming on the Wii was simply not going to be an option.

wow, cheating in Mario Kart, has to be a new all time low in online gaming

They can only patch the game if it was specifically programmed to be able to be patched...and Nintendo doesn't do that.

I don't really mind friend codes actually. It's better than seeing all the lametard handles on xbox live like killaluv420 or 3pickilla187 (you mean someone already took those horrible names enough to warrant a number!? cliche numbers at that...

If Live would wipe their database of still unused usernames. we wouldn't have this problem.

But with so many users on every console it's hard to have unique names for everyone.

Now different friend codes for every game!? WTF.

The fun in MK online isn't the time trials, so i don´t really care. Battle mode is sweet.

@Klaymen:
Exactly. I was never to good at Metroid (control was a tad to awkward for me) but I still enjoyed most of the online matches I had with it. Now with some guys cheating the system, its like a playground to anyone who has mastered using the glitches.

@dead_red_eyes:
Thank you. I'm glad someone was aware on what ruined MP DS online. And yeah, Nintendo (as far as I know) has never patched any online DS/Wii game. The only thing I know of that gets patched (or "updated") is the Wii itself.

@VergessenHeld:
You didn't really understand what I was getting at. I only said that snaking is bad if you using it around someone who cannot do it (at that time). On the other hand, two snakers against one another can do quite a close race. Although, as you have said, a item can completely ruin a race for a person if it is set or released at the right place.

Actually, online play in MKWii is AWESOME, you can't even compare it with Brawl. 12-player Matchups takes about ten seconds to start, never experienced any lag what-so-ever, you get a cool Mii-presentation before the race where everyones Mii is waving to you from their respective countries on a globe, there's a neat ranking score to keep track, there's tournaments etc. etc.

I played it with a friend (split-screen locally, online) online for six hours straigt last night :)

I've seen this in action, and yeah, it sucks. I hope Nintendo weed this out quickly and decisevely.

@dowingba: 3 things:

1. Midway owns the patent to ghost data. Unless Nintendo wanted to charge extra to give Midway a cut of the VC profits, they had to remove it. It had nothing to do with their having been "known to hold no regard for time trials", which I've never heard before you said it.

2. It seems utterly insane to me that anyone in this world could consider Smash's online to be the worst attempt ever at online. Yes, we're all disappointed to some degree, but it's by far and away Nintendo's best attempt yet. Think about it... The most chaotic game EVER has an online mode that doesn't lag at all when playing in "With Friends" mode (barring your friends or yourself don't have hideously terrible connections, lag should be non-existant... says everyone I know and my own personal experience). There are savable replays, with a screencap option... both sendable over the network. There are custom maps that are sendable as well. There are no restrictions on items online (I personally expected this not to be the case). And the biggest thing... we were all warned about the lack of voicechat and the potential lag issues (which I don't usually see personally) before the game was even released via the Dojo, so I have no idea what you (nor anyone else who makes this annoyingly common complaint) could have been expecting to be different.

P.S. If I somehow missed your actual complaint with Smash's online in my above rant, feel free to comment back with it and I'll rescind my statements and offer a genuine appology... promise.

3. I agree whole-heartedly with you on snaking. Couldn't have argued it better myself.

The 'leap over the goalie' exploits in Strikers ruined the game for me online. It would have been a really good experience if it wasn't for that one element which just meant you would never win a game against a random opponenet if you didnt do it. I wanted to play a game of manic football, not a forward-flip sim.
Hopefully this sort of stuff is just linked to the time trials - lets face it, i'm not committed enough to make it to the top table anyway!

Why are people slamming Nintendo for this? Even first party Xbox 360 racers like Forza 2 still get the occasional glitch that hits the top of the leaderboards, when the game was first released it had a TON of glitches that were exploited for superfast times. Obviously they get patched eventually, and MK Wii most l