Intel integrated graphics... what a joke. I have that on my laptop, and it makes me cry at night.

@Darthvinder: Yeah i have that on my laptop too they are pure shit...but i really dont like gaming PC, you have to upgade almost for every game :/

The PC Gaming Alliance is my saving grace.

@Mike918: Thats not true, many pc hardware sites always advice that you should not upgrade too often, why?, because prices on hardware drop very fast, if you play on realtive low resolutions you dont have to upgrade very often...

ATI graphics...HAH what a joke.

I used to be an ati fanboy too.

Random Question: If you have a graphics card, does the integrated graphics processor on your motherboard sit unused and pathetic like the worst player on an athletic team sitting on the bench, or does it contribute a bit?

@Moonshadow101:

ROFL.

No, he goes home at night dreaming of the day he'd get on the field, and when he gets his chance....he blows it hard.

@Moonshadow101: Nope it stays in the bench...

As much fun as I've had on computers over the years spending time gaming, these companies are going to have to face the facts. Computer gaming is a dying niche, not unlike the arcade scene from the 80's and early 90's.

The fact of the matter is that while not only has console gaming caught up in a technological standpoint, but technology is upgrading too quickly to keep on giving the PC gaming community a reason not to jump ship to gaming.

Also, the console gaming industry has become a multi-billion dollar phenomena over the past 10 years. There is simply more money and opportunity.

I think what we can count on in the not-so-distant-future is further integration of first party supported home brew via PC to Console programs, via XBLA, and I'm sure after Littlebigplanet comes out for the PS3, some sort of new version of their Net Yarouze user dev kits.

@ManjiKengo: In the integrated graphics field ati is working a lot to make a decent IGP...

@Moonshadow101: It does nothing if you have a dedicated videocard.

I'm using an Intel integrated graphic processer right now because my $250 ATI Radeon 9800 Pro that I bought a few years back (for Half Life 2 specifically) died on me. And though I'm not gaming, it works fine for everything else.

In other news, my launch 360 continues to run flawlessly and gets the bulk of my gaming attention.

I'm a console gamer, and I'm proud to say that.

@onboard intel graphics haters
Why did you buy the notebook if the graphics are so shit?

@ashtar: "The fact of the matter is that while not only has console gaming caught up in a technological standpoint" @_@ , right now both ps3 and 360 IGP cant compete to the new cheap graphics cards (9600gt and the HD38XX) also nvidia said something very niteresting, that in gaming in therms of graphic power the card is more important than the processor, and they are right, in crysis if you use a dual core or a quad core, you dont see much difference in performance, only the raw power of the card make a difference...

videogames sales on pc are suffering for the piracy , not desinformation, just look at the downloads on any torrent site.... for me the hardware prices are the ones to blame. A lot of people invest all the money they get on hardware to be able to play the games , but they don't expend the money on the actual games, they download them.
This alliance better resolve that....

to fix pc gaming:

try to mitigate the reality that it is a complete ripoff in comparison to today's console offerings.

Cliffy B: Hi I'm Cliffy B
Tim S: And I'm Tim Sweeny
Cliffy B: we are here to tell you a little story about graphics processors, and a boy named Johnny.
*teenager walks on stage holding a copy of Unreal 3*
Tim S: Johnny here really wants to play some Unreal 3, heck he saved up his allowance up for a whole week so he could buy it!
Cliffy B: Indeed Tim, but he is in for a rude awakening
*Johnny sticks the disk in his computer. The computer bursts into flames*
Tim S: UH OH! Looks like Johnny's PC only has an intel integrated graphics processor!
Cliffy B: HO HO! You're right Tim! I bet that really grinds his Gears of War ;)
Tim S: Oh Cliffy, you punster you!
Cliffy B: Now Johnny has learned a very important lesson about computers.
Tim S: Yep! If you want to email, listen to music, or just surf the web, a PC with an intel integrated graphics processor is just fine!
Cliffy B: But if you want to play todays AAA PC titles, such as Epic game's Unreal 3-
*Close up shot of Cliffy B, who winks while his perfect white teeth glisten in the light*
Cliffy B: you will have to buy a PC with a dedicated graphics card :D
*shot of Johnny using a different computer to play Unreal 3. He clicks away happily*
Tim S: Thats right, and now you know,
Cliffy B: And knowing is half the battle!
*A giant red white and blue PC logo explodes on screen while the words " PEEE CEEE GAAAAAAAAAMES!" are sung by an ultra manly chorus*

Hey, I have an ATI Radeon 9800 Pro, too. Sucks that it doesn't have Pixel Shader 3.0 which means the newest batch of games like Bioshock (which I bought, but can't play) and Crysis won't even look in my direction.

Fuckers.

"Sorry, you can't buy that PC. The Gaming Mafia want to you to spend the same amount on just the video card alone... every six months... yeah, sorry. Jimmy ain't going to college and Sally will always look like she was hit in the mouth with a 2-by-4. Buy this behemoth gaming PC instead! Quick, before it's obsolete!"

@Dauragon C. Mikado: Lol I spelled Tim Sweeney's name wrong xD

@ashtar: i sincerely hope you're wrong...i play on my consoles a LOT, more than i do my PC...but there are certain games i can't enjoy on a console

i recently bought my brother the Orange Box for his 360, and we spent the weekend playing it...and by no means is it poor quality, but i just didn't like it as much as i do when i play on my PC, it just *feels* different to me
(on that same note: some games *really* only feel right on a console)

also, the ability to make/distribute/download mods for PC games gives them more value i think, but i suppose that's only if you actually take advantage of that opportunity

What exactly matters the most? Because I swear the performance in games differ ALOT for me. I go so tired of having to upgrade I gave up and started console gaming 100% This is the first generation of gaming that I bought my own consoles (360 and Wii) because I hate PC game specs. I remember back when my older brother bought an old NEC back in the days and it lasted him years for gaming, now days PC's won't even work for older games. There's SO MANY different kinds of processors I don't even know which is good, all I know is Dual Core/Quad Core = good, but there's so many different kinds. Same with graphic cards. Then there's RAM to worry about too. Sadly I won't be able to play the upcoming SC2 game, I was such a blizzard fan.

@mariospants:

Exactly! More crap I hate, when games require different technical things like Pixel Shaders that your graphic card does not have and therefore you are fucked.

@T3kNi9e:"now days PC's won't even work for older games" , if that happened to you the problem is the drivers not the hardware, pc building can look intimidating, but if you read enough sites it becomes like a big buffet, you get the exact stuff that fit your needs...

And there they go solving the wrong problem. True or not, the widespread belief is that PC gaming is a waste of your time precisely because standard hardware can't run the games at promised resolution for more than a year. Amplifying that perception will not improve the PC market. Look, even if he knows what to get, every dime a guy spends on his rig is a dime that doesn't go to games. Higher hardware demands = less games sold. Fix that, PC gaming alliance.

@mwclarkson: True. You either have too much card for the games (eg no game takes advantage of your sweet PC, so the games look like shit) or too little card for the game (eg your PC is more than 6 months old, so the games look like shit). I agree integrated graphics are the sux0rs, but PC gaming needs some stable graphics STANDARDS that it can stick to.

The difference between computers and consoles is that almost everyone has a pc and distrubution is much easier. Games like WoW and Sims are both considered high quality without demanding too much graphically.

@omnibot2000XL: totally ...

@mwclarkson: I agree with you completely. One of the many, many reasons why PC gaming is in the gutter is because PC developers expect their customers to shell out hundreds of dollars every six to eight months in order to keep playing the latest games, and consumers just aren't interested in doing that. Rather than whining about integrated graphics, maybe the developers should try targeting those chipsets for optimum performance -- i.e. adapt to the market rather than asking the market to adapt to them.

@Mike918: not if your a idiot that upgrades a graphics card from a 6800 to a 7300le.

Piracy has done leagues more damage to PC gaming than video cards ever will.

People get to wrapped up n haveing the newest card, I have a 1.5 yr/old card at the moment and i can play anything on low settings, anything!! I Lan about once a month, and I know people with slower cards that can play most games also. Having the newest $600 card may make you cool, but prices drop quick, and pretty soon someone will have a better card, I buy them when they hit budget range and use them for a year or two and can always play every game(I haven't tried Crysis yet.)

I think Pc Dev's are learning that only Hardcore games need top notch graphics, look at the most popular PC games out there, they all have graphics that don't need a high priced card.

@francoamerica: Yea but WoW was made 3 years+ ago. I have a 4 month old Laptop that can't run WoW at 30 fps. It goes down below 10 fps unless its zoomed it alot.

Granted it uses a integrated nvidia geforce 6100 its still a 3 year old+ game.

MS should manufacture their own PC's instead of just making software. One thats more standard, like consoles. They use set hardware that is as good as their current console (360) and when developers make games for 360/PS3/PC they use MS's standards.

But this is extremely wishful thinking, also im not sure if I would want M$ to be the one with so much of an advantage

@TOCATL:
Well, you've just stated the obvious. Aside from that, consoles HAVE caught up in the technological standpoint nevertheless. Consoles are not PCs. You can have a Nvidia 7xxx series on the PS3 and have 1080p graphics at 60 fps. Try doing that on a PC please, let me know how it goes. Consoles don't need the 'uber-super-wow 9800 GTs to run great graphics.

@francoamerica, ArmiMaan: Dead on. If you want to resuscitate PC gaming you need to (1) make capable packaged chipsets more affordable and (2) make desirable games that run on affordable packaged chipsets. Yes, if you are dedicated and skilled and flush with cash you can keep pace with PC gaming requirements, but the dominance of consoles has come about precisely because you don't need to be dedicated, skilled, or rich to play the best games. The PC gaming alliance needs to focus its efforts on bringing convenience to PC gaming, not better education about IGP limitations. No matter what you do, at least 50% of PC purchasers are going to buy the cheap, standard box. Make games for them.

Why we need an alliance: Because Epic seems to have abandoned us just like the rest of them.

@T3kNi9e:
I don't want PC's having RROD now.

For some reason whenever I hear about huge companies teaming up I always think "Prince fixing?"

Meh. Not bothering with PC's anymore. Say I buy a computer which can handle Crysis on high settings. I probably had to blow around $400 or $500 at least, but still sweet.

One year later, the next BIG PC game comes along. Well heck, I can only play it on low settings. I suppose I need to upgrade again. Plunk down, say, $300.

I can simply buy a new console in both instances. Except with consoles, I don't have to buy a new one every year (Red Ring of Death not withstanding?) It's every five years.

After reading that interview, I don't see this changing. He argued that in the past PC gamers could play any game, even if the experience were crummy, they could STILL play the game. What kind of argument is that? Why would I want to play a game that runs clunky at all?

I remember being so excited for Total Annihilation back in the day. I could barely play it though and eventually stopped, because what's the point?

PC gaming suffers because:
- their products are crippled with DRM that affects system performance and (in some cases) stability.
- they copy the *entire* game to the hard drive and then insist the physical disk is required for play.
- they rely on retail sales (POST-launch) to "finish" the game (via patches).
- they **completely** ignore the notebook market - a market which (last time I checked) was much larger than the niche hardware markets that they target their games for.

That last one is the biggest problem. It's now more common to see people using notebooks than traditional gaming rig. They need to start treating the notebook market as the rule and not the exception.

@iisdev: "They need to start treating the notebook market as the rule and not the exception."

That's very true.

I always thought God of War 2 looked really good. Considering the very limited resources of the PS2 it's baffling. But it's possible when developers spend time and effort to learn how to maximize efficiency out of the hardware.

It seems PC developers have made a habit of requiring consumers to upgrade to remedy the developer's own laziness. GOW2 runs on only 32MBs of memory and a 300MHz processor. Yet, I'm sure if Epic designed their own Minesweeper game it would require 512MB of memory and a at least a 2GHz processor.

I guess what I'm saying is that, why doesn't Epic stop demanding customers have expensive high-end systems to play Epic's great looking games and instead start finding ways to make their games look great on affordable low-end systems? It will be harder. It take lots of time and effort. However, Blizzard did such with WoW, and look at the success.

I just want a proper 2D sequel to Jazz Jackrabbit 2, Epic. Bugger all this 3D shooter nonsense. You had a wonderful game series with Jazz. Y'know, when the PC could adequately hold its own in the platformer department.

Less Fenix, more Jazz.

@iisdev:
- their products are crippled with DRM that affects system performance and (in some cases) stability.

You're kidding. You're telling me that DRM on a PC is worse than a console, where EVERYTHING is DRM'd? DRM isn't the problem here.

- they copy the *entire* game to the hard drive and then insist the physical disk is required for play.

This is a problem. Fortunately, it seems like fewer games are require this these days. That, and lately I've been buying everything off Steam. Even though steam does have its own DRM, they provide enough conveniences (multiple installs, easy patching) that its worth it.

- they rely on retail sales (POST-launch) to "finish" the game (via patches).

This is an unfortunate trend that is also creeping into consoles.

- they **completely** ignore the notebook market - a market which (last time I checked) was much larger than the niche hardware markets that they target their games for.

I agree.

@pylon_trooper: I lost all love for Jazz after I recieved the most heartbreaking message I've ever seen in a game....

"Spaz ate the Dopefish!"

:P

when console gamers cry foul about rumors that MS is moving to fast if they bring out a next-gen console in 2010, what more about PCs, who changes every 5 months?

@Jomi294: i dont know what pc res would match 1080p, the card inside the ps3 is a 7800 wich is a good medium r